BBB Winter Build - KISS or...

I'm putting the BOSS50 in my '05 GT over the winter. I use the car for fair weather jaunts and road course HPDE's. I'm wanting to lower the block in the engine bay and create a strong foundation for suspension upgrades as I transition to slicks on track. I don't want to blaze a trail so much that I cause issues with the install, but I don't want to change things later that make sense to do during the swap.

My thoughts:
1. Use a Maximum Motorsports K-member which adds weight but stiffens up the front suspension mounting points vs. stock.
2. Use Steeda lowering mounts to lower the engine to help offset the additional weight and higher CG while cornering.
3. Use a higher capacity oil pan, preferably with road race baffles.

Possible clearance issues:
1. Current JBA LT headers - Will they interfere with the K-member using the Steeda lowering mounts (I want to go at least 1/2" or the full 3/4")?
2. Will the rest of my exhaust be dragging along? I'm going back in with my JBA catted H-pipe and Roush Extreme Performance exhaust. The resonators already drag once and a while.

Anyone with experience that can help me avoid a clearance problem would be majorly appreciated.

Currently owned parts that are on, or going back on the car:
Livernois 3V stroker rotating assembly
Diamond 3.700 stroker pistons at 11:1 compression
Livernois Stage 3 N/A cams
Livernois Stage 3 heads w/ over sized valves
Phase locks
ARP head studs
FRPP etched valve covers
94mm Cometic head gaskets
C&L Racer intake
C&L Aluminum intake manifold
FRPP stock sized throttle body
JBA long tube headers 1 5/8" primaries w/ 3" collectors
JBA catted shorty H-pipe
Roush Extreme Performance exhaust
FRPP Cobra dual fuel pump
BBK high flow aluminum fuel rail kit
FRPP EV6 injectors - 80 lb./hr. (I know this is overkill for my current setup)
Meziere electric water pump
Mishomoto high capacity performance radiator
Mishomoto oil cooler kit
Steeda underdrive pulley system
Barton shifter
RAM twin-disc clutch
Motive 4.10 ring and pinion
Aluminium one-piece driveshaft

Suspension goodies include:
H&R Street Performance coilovers and dampers (rear adjustable spring perch)
Eibach front sway bar
Eibach rear sway bar
MM panhard bar
MM caster/camber plates
MM bumpsteer kit
MM rear control arms
Brembo 14" 4 pots with PFC-01 race pads or stock '07 GT500 pads
Boss 302 brake ducts

If additional information is needed, just let me know. I'd really like to plan this engine build to do it once... insert laughter here.

Thanks

Maybe some of this thread will help you out. It's my Big Bore Boss build from a few years ago. Motor is still in the car and running strong 20k miles later. I used it as a daily driver for almost two years.

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105837

What are you using for the intake manifold, the stock unit? That seems like it might be a restriction in the system no? Maybe I am used to the Boss philosophy where there higher Revs help the car out a bit more.

You and I agree on the higher revs part.

I am using a C&L aluminum intake. The performance data I've seen shows very little change on the dyno until 4500 rpm. After that, a built motor can see 12 - 15 whp and 10+ ft-lb all the way to the top.

The extra weight is a bummer, but I love the look and performance. The intake weighs 33.44 pounds! That's 22 more pounds than the FRPP intake.

This, and the iron block, are the reasons I want to lower the engine in the car. I'm seriously worried about plowing through corners on track.

Maybe some of this thread will help you out. It's my Big Bore Boss build from a few years ago. Motor is still in the car and running strong 20k miles later. I used it as a daily driver for almost two years.

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=105837

Click to expand...

I have seen this thread, and it was very influential in my decision to go BBB. No E85 for me though. Availability in NC is very sketchy.

My questions on this thread focus on the K-member, lowering mounts, and oil pan. IIR, you used the '07 GT500 cast Al oil pan. That's on option I'm considering, but I'm concerned about adding fitment issues on the initial build.

I want to do all three upgrades during the initial build. If I do them in steps (K-member, then lowering mounts, then oil pan), I can more easily control interference issues, but the cost, time, and PITA factor go up.

Does anyone have any of these mods individually. I'd like to piece together some opinions as to whether I'm creating a clearance nightmare.

Boone said:

I have seen this thread, and it was very influential in my decision to go BBB. No E85 for me though. Availability in NC is very sketchy.

My questions on this thread focus on the K-member, lowering mounts, and oil pan. IIR, you used the '07 GT500 cast Al oil pan. That's on option I'm considering, but I'm concerned about adding fitment issues on the initial build.

I want to do all three upgrades during the initial build. If I do them in steps (K-member, then lowering mounts, then oil pan), I can more easily control interference issues, but the cost, time, and PITA factor go up.

Does anyone have any of these mods individually. I'd like to piece together some opinions as to whether I'm creating a clearance nightmare.

Click to expand...

I used a 2013 GT500 5.8 liter oil pan, pickup, and windage tray/scraper. AFAIK the cast aluminum pans were only used on 2013 and 14.

The pan fit with a stock k member. It was a little tight getting the motor in but it fit and once it was in the clearance was just like stock. I've had a non lowering BMR k member before and can confidently say that it would of made the motor install much easier with the GT500 oil pan.

The Steeda engine mounts are the dumbest design ever devised. Way fucking retarded.

Use Prothane mounts and have them shaved down. I've gone -3/4" and at that point the oil pan was just hovering over the steering rack. It wasn't going much more than that. The Kooks headers still cleared the oil pan.

Thanks for the info guys. When shaving down the Prothane mounts, did you keep the bullet shape. I have access to a machine shop, so I can do this at any contour needed. I'm planning to go 1/2" lower, so it will be a little less extreme than the 3/4" DOB was going.

I'll see if I can locate the cast Al pan. The additional volume plus my oil cooler should keep things in check in the oiling arena... which brings up my next question...

Billet oil pump gear or FRPP high performance oil pump. I'll be seeing around 7200rpm on track, and I've seen the videos of the oil pumps "flowing over" at high rpms. What does the real life experience crowd say on this subject?

Just shave the mounts down flat (they will still retain some bullet shape).

Block is getting ready to go to the machinist. Final components list as follows:
3.700 iron block
Diamond 11:1 pistons
Livernois stroker kit, Stage 3 N/A cams, and Stage 3 heads (reused)
GT500 aluminum oil pan and gasket/windage tray
FRPP high-output oil pump
Livernois billet oil pump gear
Prothane engine mounts shaved 1/2"

Am I going to have trouble with my Meziere electric water pump fitting? I seem to recall a thread with some issues.

I have decided not to do the MM K-member at this time. Probably a stupid decision, but I see it as a handling upgrade due to the added stiffness and relocated control arm pivot location. Don't feel like dealing with alignment issues right now.

So the winter build is rolling into the spring build...

Block comes back from the machinist today. I'm going to Pro Dyno to take a look at it and get some pics.

While I'm in the Charlotte area for work, I'm going to pick up my LT headers. I decided to make a run to Burlington, NC to the folks at Jet Hot to get them ceramic coated. $255 is the retail price to blast them and coat them inside and out. 7 to 10 working day lead time. Still not sure if I'll go with the chrome look, silver matte, or take advantage of one of their color options. My wife is the interior designer, but I can't even ask her since she doesn't know about my latest deviation. Going to be a bitch if I try to select a shade of green to match my Legend Lime since I have a little red/green color blindness.

I hope to keep the updates rolling as we get this into high gear.

Btw, here's how the 1/2" shaved Prothane Bullet mounts came out. It's a shame they have to be buried down in the engine bay.

Two unforeseen improvements have made their way into my winter rebuild.

Dropped the headers off at Jet Hot to be ceramic coated. They are less than 30 minutes from my house. I'm going with the polished stainless look so the headers will be easier to wipe down. Only $220, which I think is a steal!

Also picked up a Whiteline strut tower brace from a super nice S197 forum member. Dropped it off at Pro Dyno when I picked up the headers. I know that's the epitome of lazy not to install my own STB, but when I get my car back, I just want to drive it.

Picked up the headers from Jet Hot. Hard to believe they are the same headers that have 10's of thousands of miles on them. They're like new, but better with the ceramic coating inside and out. Running them to my builder on Saturday.

You may need to adjust the height of that Whiteline strut bar. There are eccentric bolts on either end.

I'll play with it if I need to. Motor will be dropped 1/2", so I'm hoping the C&L intake will clear. The adjustable height of the Whiteline STB is one of the main reasons I jumped on it. If I've got room to spare I'll snug it down and keep it tight to the intake. Plenty of room under the Keenan 3" cowl hood, so no issue there.

I think I had it adjusted in the lowest setting, since I had a stock Coyote intake (the lowest of all factory intakes). Basically, loosen the jam nuts on the back of the bar, and then use an Allen key to turn the eccentric bolts a bit to "raise" the bar up. Then tighten back down the jam nuts afterwards. I believe this works best if it's off the car when you do this, but I can't remember for sure. I couldn't find the instructions. :-/

It's picture time!! no build thread is complete until you show your own version of Christmas in April.

First, the Whiteline STB.

Thanks to some good advise, the 2013 GT500 oil pan with windage tray / gasket and an 8 quart capacity.

After screwing me royally by providing the wrong size pistons (stock bore vs. the 0.030 over they were labeled and specified as), Diamond is providing the pistons. They were kind enough to give me $0 off for their mistake that claimed my engine. On the flipside, Livernois gave me a 5% discount just because the first set passed through their hands.

They have been measured, and the system has been balanced. Pistons weights range from 398 grams to 401 grams.