FRPP M-18000-C vs Koni yellows ?

oldVOR

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Another +1 for the Vorshlag street pro setup w/FRPP Ks that gets DD and used for autox. The DD ride is much better than the OEM '05 suspension and autox handling is spot on with a set of Steeda adjustable swaybars. Been in use for about a year and a half without any issues.
 

Pentalab

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Hey thanks for that!
I wasn't actually aiming the question to get any rates but to potential "corner carvers" that should be actually asking these questions.

After having a "nosebag" through that list , I am surprised how soft the Ford front suspension really is.
The Front is softer than the Rear with the rear having a 1:1 motion ratio

You can refer back to my comments about the POGO effect.

From my "young and bulletproof" days, we use to run cars on the street much stiffer than most of those [macpherson struts that is]

I have found "too stiff" to be less detrimental to road manners than "too much camber"

I would be quite happy with 350lb/in fronts and 210lb/in rears in a streetable road-racer [then tune it ARB an RARB]

Check this out. https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/TechArticles
Then click onto their spring rate tests. https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/TechArticles

Scroll through it, blown up of course. On album 2 of 6, the 1st item is the FRPP P spring detailed data https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/TechArticles/Spring-Rate-Tests/i-QrC8Sxk/A There they depict an AVERAGE of 167 lbs for the fronts...and 121 lbs for the rears...which contradicts the info on posting #5 on http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=127549 which depicts 204F /167R..go figure.

Vorshlag also depicts detailed spring tests.. on the same album 2 of 6.... for items 2-3-4, all for mustangs. I would be inclined to go by the real deal Vorshlag testing. I assume they start with the spring fully extended, then start adding the various amounts of force... to achieve a given displacement in inches. If that's the case, your real starting point will be with spring partially loaded, since they will have several hundred lbs sitting on them... with car parked on a level surface. You require the spring compressor just to install the strut mounts to the top of the completed strut + spring assy..... and that's before you mount the wheel + tire..then lower onto the ground.

I'm guessing they will be loaded to aprx 4+". I guess you could call this..' total pre-load'..... once parked on the ground ?
 
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John@Steeda

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hrm, posted and it disappeared on me


I ran the konis on my 2011 gt i used as an ESP car and was very happy with them, i had previously used tokicos on my 08 gt and feel the konis were a better setup, also koni is doing a mail in rebate through oct 21st, and we usually have yellows in stock
 

Senna1

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Scroll through it, blown up of course. On album 2 of 6, the 1st item is the FRPP P spring detailed data https://vorshlag.smugmug.com/TechArticles/Spring-Rate-Tests/i-QrC8Sxk/A There they depict an AVERAGE of 167 lbs for the fronts...and 121 lbs for the rears...which contradicts the info on posting #5 on http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=127549 which depicts 204F /167R..go figure.
I've seen posts from them indicating the 204/167 P spring rates much more recently than that image first appeared. It's entirely possible Ford 'revised' the P springs, or Vorshlag revised their testing methods in the years since those graphs were posted.

Add on top that some of the manufacturers have different versions and/or P/Ns of S197 springs under the same product name, and the uncertainty really makes lowering springs a PiTA on S197s.

That said, I wouldn't hesitate to call Vorshlag and talk to them if I had cash in hand and was ready to buy. If you note the Street Pro kit product page, they'll pair it with either version of the Eibach Pro Kit, FRPP 'P', or FRPP 'K', but I'm sure they have their preference(s) depending on your desires and intended use.
 
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Norm Peterson

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That said, I wouldn't hesitate to call Vorshlag and talk to them if I had cash in hand and was ready to buy. If you note the Street Pro kit product page, they'll pair it with either version of the Eibach Pro Kit, FRPP 'P', or FRPP 'K', but I'm sure they have their preference(s) depending on your desires and intended use.
Impression I keep getting is they expect you to be lowering your car at least an inch . . . separate from the matter of spring rate choice.


Norm
 
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Pentalab

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Impression I keep getting is they expect you to be lowering your car at least an inch . . . separate from the matter of spring rate choice.


Norm

Will the Vorshlag Bilsteins still work with a 1" rear drop.... but only a .5" front drop ??
 

Norm Peterson

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Really a question for Jason.

I suspect they'd be OK at 0.5" lowering, but I certainly couldn't guarantee it. The little Bilstein experience I do is based on the Subie in my sig, which runs on a non-standard and very limited production set of Bilsteins that I know were at least developed for aftermarket spring rates. Her car is still on the OE springs and other than probably being a bit overdamped for family sedan use everything has been fine for tens of thousands of miles (she actually asked me in the beginning if I could dial them back a bit).


Norm
 

Senna1

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Might keep in mind that there is an OE-length Bilstein HD front strut p/n as well, for 2011+ cars.

A lot is made of the improved compression stroke of the shorter version Bilstein; I wonder how much of that (if any) is negated by the inherently reduced stroke of a monotube vs. twintube, due to the nitrogen cell and divider piston in a non-remote strut.
 

modernbeat

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The Bilsteins we work with should not be run at stock height, and really want to be used with lowering springs that lower the car 1" or more.
 

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