Forced induction or all motor build?

Hey! I have a somewhat unique situation for my 2005 mustang. I'm
Building it for competitive drifting where a car has to be reliably taken to event after event being driven on the limiter for long periods of time so reliability is a must as around having 400+hp to be competitive. I'm curious which way to go with my 4.6 3v. Either forced induction or build the internals and high compression pistons. Both options will be tuned on 100 octane race fuel.

I can see pros and cons of both. Such as being all motor will run cooler than a roots super charger but if I blow an engine I could possibly take the super charger off and put it on another engine and re use it, or rebuild the super charger.

My build is seen here http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=131193
Any advice I really appreciate!

A stock engine with a prochager and good tuning will provide everything you need and run on pump gas.

I would normally say N/A for a situation like this. Less moving parts and less heat. But if you go with a blower what about a centrifugal?

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01yellerCobra said:

I would normally say N/A for a situation like this. Less moving parts and less heat. But if you go with a blower what about a centrifugal?

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You can't reach his power goal N/A with a 3v engine. The blower I suggested is centrifugal though lol

RocketcarX said:

You can't reach his power goal N/A with a 3v engine. The blower I suggested is centrifugal though lol

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I wasn't sure since I'm not that versed in 3V stuff. A centri just makes more sense in this situation to me.

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I def agree, RPM based power without the heat soak of a turbo or traditional "blower".

Still run it on race fuel with centrifugal also?

OutlawEvans said:

Still run it on race fuel with centrifugal also?

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You can make enough power to shit a rod on pump gas with any power adder on a 3V.

RocketcarX said:

You can make enough power to shit a rod on pump gas with any power adder on a 3V.

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What do you mean by that? No matter what I run fuel/power adder wise the rods are prone to fail unless I do the rods?

OutlawEvans said:

What do you mean by that? No matter what I run fuel/power adder wise the rods are prone to fail unless I do the rods?

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You have a 500 horsepower limit with a stock engine because of ring gap and the powdered metal rods.
So you can make up to about 500 WHP on pump gas safely with the stock engine and beat on it forever with just regular maintenance provided your tuning is sufficient.
Basically you will never require 100 octane at your power level.

RocketcarX said:

A stock engine with a procharger and good tuning will provide everything you need and run on pump gas.

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Agree with the choice of centrifugal supercharger for forced induction but for long-term reliability, I'd perform the following engine upgrades:

Forged rods/pistons (stock 9.8:1 compression)
Billet oil pump gears (or GT500 pump)
Canton oil pan (higher capacity & better oil control for hard cornering)
Oil cooler

A NA 3v wouldn't allow you to reach your power goals (maximum 390rwhp from a 281, and 430rwhp from a 302 stroker).

RocketcarX said:

You can't reach his power goal N/A with a 3v engine. The blower I suggested is centrifugal though lol

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you can with an all out build, high CR, cams, ported and polished heads, headers,etc
pretty sure at least 2 members have done it, thought I cannot find the threads after looking.

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-to/engine/1408-400-hp-4-6l-three-valve-stroker-build/

I can't see this vid at work - but I suspect its a member here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_J7Ly4fWxY&feature=channel_page

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-to/engine/mmfp-0812-livernois-motorsports-cylinder-head-upgrade/

OutlawEvans said:

What do you mean by that? No matter what I run fuel/power adder wise the rods are prone to fail unless I do the rods?

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stock rods are subject to failure around 450 whp and higher

Dino Dino Bambino said:

A NA 3v wouldn't allow you to reach your power goals (maximum 390rwhp from a 281, and 430rwhp from a 302 stroker).

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it can, but it's expensive and not cost effective vs adding a blower.


Evans - also consider upgrading the valve train.

Coyote.
NA.

Wastegated Procharger.

Juice said:

Coyote.
NA.

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Yeah another topic of my debate for sure. Most people have said the whole swap goes for about 8k+ for the engine, trans, parts, Ect. Definetly would be all about one of those though

Probably a 6 or 6.2 liter LS should do the trick. Square port heads, carb intake, Holley terminator EFI. Have fun!

eighty6gt said:

Probably a 6 or 6.2 liter LS should do the trick. Square port heads, carb intake, Holley terminator EFI. Have fun!

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Get out.

eighty6gt said:

Probably a 6 or 6.2 liter LS should do the trick. Square port heads, carb intake, Holley terminator EFI. Have fun!

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OutlawEvans said:

What do you mean by that? No matter what I run fuel/power adder wise the rods are prone to fail unless I do the rods?

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Correct. The oem rods are pretzel sticks...they will eventually succumb to metal fatigue. For your drifting application, and sustained high rpm, and oem rods, don't take it much past 400 rwhp.

Swap in current Coyote rods if you are on a super tight budget. You can reuse everything else but it will need to be rebalanced. The Coyote rod is dimensionally the same and has proven durable to well over 600hp. So keeping things at around 500hp you would most likely be fine with a proper tune.