Control Arm Cross Reference- 2011-14 Arms on a 2005-09 car

Hello,

I used the search function and still couldn't seem to find the answer to this. I have a 2007 Mustang with bad ball joints. I have heard that OEM 2011-14 control arms contain stronger and larger ball joints, and I would like to upgrade to them. Is there anything stopping me from doing so? BMR lists a different part number for 2011-14 vs 2005-09 arms. Is this because of a geometric difference or a fitment inconsistency, or is it just because of different bushing materials etc?

Any help appreciated, thanks!

If the ball joint is larger, I don't see how the spindle will slip over it without modification.
Why not get the 07-09 GT500 arms?

46addict said:

If the ball joint is larger, I don't see how the spindle will slip over it without modification.
Why not get the 07-09 GT500 arms?

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I thought by larger they meant the ball joint unit itself rather than the stud diameter. Unsure as to whether I should upgrade to gt500 arms or boss 302 ones and change to coyote spindles as well.

Iirc some have drilled out spindles to fit the larger ball joints

05-09 use an 18mm ball joint, 11-14 use 19mm.

If you want to run the larger 19mm on an 05-09, your options are to either drill out your current spindle to accept the larger ball joint, or buy a set of 11-14 spindles to swap in. I looked into this a while back and the eBay seller Midway Mustang Parts had the spindles for about $100 per side.

I drilled my spindles for the larger ball joints. You need a strong drill and maybe a few bits, but it can be done.

46addict said:

If the ball joint is larger, I don't see how the spindle will slip over it without modification.
Why not get the 07-09 GT500 arms?

Click to expand...

This is the route I would and have gone.

If i do that id take my spindles to my cousin and use a drill press at his shop, dont want the holes to come out in weird angles or anything

Wes06 said:

If i do that id take my spindles to my cousin and use a drill press at his shop, dont want the holes to come out in weird angles or anything

Click to expand...

I'm a little sketched out by drilling spindles, if I were to do anything it would be to just get 2011+ ones. Are the ABS sensors different/do they need a different connector?

I converted my 08 to BMR 11-14 style A-Arms with tall ball joints. Contemplated drilling my 08 spindles from 18mm to 19mm but in the end just went with 2011 spindles.

19mm adjustable with tall ball joints on the left and 18mm non adjustable on right (early style).



Used 2011 spindles cleaned up and painted.



Assembled with new 2011 hub nuts. The torque specs for the 2011 hub nuts are significantly higher than for the earlier years. Can't remember exactly but it could be 30 ft-lbs more.

tooslowfiveo said:

I'm a little sketched out by drilling spindles, if I were to do anything it would be to just get 2011+ ones. Are the ABS sensors different/do they need a different connector?

Click to expand...

Used my 08 ABS sensors in the 2011 spindles without issue.

I'm sure a machine shop could drill those spindles for less than $100 a side and you wouldn't be worried about any weirdness. Take the old ball joints in so they can determine fit.

tooslowfiveo said:

I'm a little sketched out by drilling spindles

Click to expand...

This ↑↑↑ . . . times a lot. Particularly on a 2007 car.

When Ford upgraded the strut to knuckle bolts from coarse thread (148 ft-lb) to fine thread (166 ft-lb) somewhere after the middle of the 2008 model year run, they also thickened the knuckle slightly. Removing strength from anywhere on the 'weaker' knuckle sounds like a bad idea.


Norm

Thanks for the info! I wonder what the issue actually was, and I wonder if the new strut bolts I ordered are fine thread. I don't think so.

The issue centered around the possibility that the clamping force through the strut 'ears' and the knuckle (sandwiched in between the strut ears) might not be sufficient, or could perhaps relax slightly. Like most bolted joints, this one really relies on friction rather than shear directly applied to the bolts. Given that you need to have a little bolt to hole clearance, it's the way it has to work - or else you could have a 'clunk' that really would be by intentional design.

The smoking gun was a few knuckles that actually BROKE, I think up around or above the upper of the two strut bolts, in extreme uses such as autocrossing and road course running. Fatigue failure being what it is, it could still happen on a street-driven-only car, just that it'd take quite a bit longer.

They went to fine thread fasteners partly because there's a tiny bit more tensile stress area and partly because the fine thread develops more clamping force per unit torque. Might have been made from a better grade of steel, but I'm guessing a little here.

At the same time (IIRC), the knuckles were thickened, at least in the strut mount region, by something like 0.020", the point here being that some amount of torque ends up being "wasted" drawing the ear & knuckle sandwich together, and the clamping load would suffer as a result.


Norm

They were really reaching with that 20 thou... those ears are fairly flexible in their weak axis, I don't recall a substantial clearance, I wonder what the wasted force actually was. Someone did the math.

I remember watching some videos of these cars with big brakes and race tires. The spindle was deforming dramatically under braking loads. It was griggs, and the video is gone now.



found this while poking around, I cut the flags off of my nuts, looks like ford went on to spline the fastener in 2013 and started using my method of tightening.

eighty6gt said:

They were really reaching with that 20 thou... those ears are fairly flexible in their weak axis, I don't recall a substantial clearance, I wonder what the wasted force actually was. Someone did the math.

Click to expand...

Every little bit helps, and the thinner the original section the bigger the improvement coming from a fixed 0.020" thickness increase.

I know I used a decent-sized C-clamp to squeeze the ears together when I did a strut swap but kept the OE springs. The second time, when I also swapped in some stiffer springs, the strut ears already were quite snug on the knuckles and I actually had to tap the knuckles in. Since the struts were yellows both times and I didn't change the knuckles, there's some dependency on strut tolerances as well.


Norm

I emailed Maximum Motorsports Techline and got this response in regards to big vs small ball joints. NOTE: the spindle to strut bolts on their website are the OEM ford fine pitch eared nut variants.

This largely depends on if the car will be used for track use or not. If only used for street and autocross with street tires, the
stock strength ball joints and spindles will be ok. If you use it for track use, the transient loads from berm impacts are very
high. If you autocross the car with R compound tires or slicks, the loads can be very high also. In either of those cases, I would
change out the ball joints to the 20mm models with the matching spindles. In either case, change out the strut to spindle bolts to
the revised models that we have on the MM website. These are a finer thread pitch with a higher torque spec to generate more clamp
load between the strut and spindle. This will keep the spindles from flexing and breaking.