My 5.4L 3V N/A build thread

Okay I've got most of the stuff here except for the cams, phaser lockouts and lash adjusters.
I need a little advise on the lockouts though.
here's what the combo is:
shortblock:
5.4L iron 3V block bored .020, stock crank, probe lightweight I-beam rods, probe superlight flat top 12:1 pistons, ARP studs etc.
heads/valvetrain:
stock 3V castings w/ CNC port&polish by suttonHP, multi-angle valve job
Ti retainers
comp "stiff"(duramax style) beehive springs
custom comp cams "very aggressive" custom grind solid roller profile
BLE solid lash adjusters (required with cam grind)
stock followers
livernois? cam phaser lockouts (required with cam grind)
cometic head gaskets
ARP head studs

there's the meat of it. also have a few other things planned for it once it's in the car and running (vacuum pump being one) but the need for an intake manifold outweighs some of those other things. comp says the engine should make max power around 7500-8000rpms so the stock intake has to go and right now there's not much of an option...expensive custom intake or really expensive custom intake

my question is to any engine builders or guys with experience using the cam phaser lockouts:
with my n/a combo should i use the full advance lockouts? my cams are being ground currently and last i heard (Thursday) they needed to grind them 10*advanced on the billet due to the lobe design.
how do you degree the cams using these lockouts?

all the assembly will be done at Woodbine Motorsports (WMS) since i'm used to working with pushrods JJ is going to help with the assembly on this one.

Sweet can't wait to see what it looks like and what it does

Found it!!!!!

Beck has been making the intakes I told you about.

http://www.beckmechanical.com/

When do you guys start? I'd like to drop by and see the motor before it goes in...now I know where you've been lately...

John

Wow, I don't have an answer to your question but I do want to say that your new engine sounds like it will be pretty impressive. Can't wait see what you can do on the track with it.

Awesome, another 5.4 build up. I went with the 3V as well. For the intake, you might want to give Mike@Powerhouse a call. He did my entire build, and developed the intake for mine. Mine has an intercooler built into it, but I'm sure he can build one without. Here are pics of mine (I'm still up in the air on the finish, powder coated black or polished, which is why its in a raw state right now):

Rygen, that is sick! When is the build expected to be complete? Can't wait to see the track times...

It's done, well sort of. It was 100%, tuned, etc, and I was doing test drives with Mike last weekend at the shop. Near the end of the day, after refining some things with it, I took it for a drive and third gear suddenly slipped, then disappeared completely. It's a 4r70 with Lentech components in it. The transmission shop that Mike uses is already working on it, I hope to have it back soon. They replaced the 3rd gear clutch pack, but it burned it out again. So we'll see, but very soon I should have it back.

One other thing, Ron.......is that crank forged? Also, what modifications have you done to the crank for that rpm?

US-1 said:

One other thing, Ron.......is that crank forged? Also, what modifications have you done to the crank for that rpm?

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It's whatever came stock in the 2004 F150. I doubt it's forged I never really checked it cause it didn't matter i was using it anyway the guys did a nice job on it just doing the basic stuff, oil holes are chamfered, balanced, etc.
i don't consider that a level of rpms to where i'll have crank issues. I've used factory cast cranks past 8000rpms on pushrod motors without problems. They just have to be balanced well and machined correctly...and you need a light piston/rod combo. I've got lightweight I beam rods(50grams less than Hbeams) and some super light pistons (around 325 grams w/pin) so there's a lot less weight flying around in there than stock.
I don't plan on spinning it 8500 but if it needs to go 7500-7800 or so it should have no problems. My limit to comp was 8000rpms. If not they would grind something that would make killer power but at 11,000rpms or something crazy. I'd like it to last for at least a full season before refreshening.
John, JJ was in Indy for a tuning thing so i couldn't drop it off saturday but i'll get it to him one day this week. I won't start assembling until i have all the pieces (cams would be nice . also need the phaser lock out and lash adjusters which i'll order this week.)
I was asked why i went with a 5.4 ...it was cheap and it's 50 more cubic inches. just to get an extra 40 cubes in a 4.6 it would cost an extra $3-4K.
I've figured just with the increase in compression and added cubes it should make over 400rwhp and that doesn't count better heads,cams,valvetrain or intake manifold. I have no idea what i'll wind up with in the end but i'd be happy with 425-450rwhp although i've been told to expect a bit more than that.

The problem we have had in the past with the cast modular cranks is the lack of center counterweights. I have not looked at a 5.4 crank in so damn long I honestly could not tell you if it has them or not. The only broken cast crank I have seen snapped in the center due to harmonics in the middle of the crank. Without the counterweights it just wobbled and spider webbed until it broke. Two others developed spider webs in that area and we switched the crank.

I'd have to check the books to see if that year model came with a forged crank. On something with that much rpm I would cut down the counterweights and rebalance the crank. At the very least I would have the counterweights knife-edged.

US-1 said:

The problem we have had in the past with the cast modular cranks is the lack of center counterweights. I have not looked at a 5.4 crank in so damn long I honestly could not tell you if it has them or not. The only broken cast crank I have seen snapped in the center due to harmonics in the middle of the crank. Without the counterweights it just wobbled and spider webbed until it broke. Two others developed spider webs in that area and we switched the crank.

I'd have to check the books to see if that year model came with a forged crank. On something with that much rpm I would cut down the counterweights and rebalance the crank. At the very least I would have the counterweights knife-edged.

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good info thanks. i was told once that the 04-up 5.4's had forged cranks but who knows. anybody know a way to check by casting #'s or something?

spyder7724 said:

good info thanks. i was told once that the 04-up 5.4's had forged cranks but who knows. anybody know a way to check by casting #'s or something?

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If its a 6 bolt, it is absolutley cast. Only 5.4 steel forged crank i know of is stock in the lightning trucks. The only thing id be worried about with a cast crank is high reving RPM, the 5.4 is a long stroke. Its hard to say though ive never had any experience with a cast 5.4 crank and this kind of a build.

Just FYI Ive been running my car through the traps around 7200 RPM and have seen 7400 RPM (11.15 pass) with my new motor and cams. Its pretty crazy seeing the tach turn so far but shes still pulling like a SOB!! I couldnt image what turning more RPM would sound and feel like!!

JimIII

JimIII@JDM said:

If its a 6 bolt, it is absolutley cast. Only 5.4 steel forged crank i know of is stock in the lightning trucks. The only thing id be worried about with a cast crank is high reving RPM, the 5.4 is a long stroke. Its hard to say though ive never had any experience with a cast 5.4 crank and this kind of a build.

Just FYI Ive been running my car through the traps around 7200 RPM and have seen 7400 RPM (11.15 pass) with my new motor and cams. Its pretty crazy seeing the tach turn so far but shes still pulling like a SOB!! I couldnt image what turning more RPM would sound and feel like!!

JimIII

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it does have 8 bolts so it may very well be steel.
even if it was a cast crank wouldn't bother me too much and the long stroke should be fine with the light piston/rod combo.
we ran pushrod motors routinely at 8500rpms (svo small blocks) and even some of our stroker big blocks up to 7800rpms and some even had cast cranks. those were race engines and had an expected life of 200-300 runs max some got less I'm hoping i don't have any problems and it will last for a while (500 runs maybe?) but thats the price for trying to make power sometimes.
when you have a 500+cid engine spinning 7500rpms or a small block winding up past 8000rpms through the lights it feels great but at the same time you are a little on edge cause if it lets go you may just go for a hell of a ride when the oil gets on the tires.
Jim if your cams are similar to what they ground me then you know there's more power in it with a good intake manifold and more rpms.

just curious, can you use the stock PCM tune when you plug a 5.4 into it? does it require any major retuning or is it just adjusting the basic stuff? (A/F, fuel, etc?)

dustindu4 said:

just curious, can you use the stock PCM tune when you plug a 5.4 into it? does it require any major retuning or is it just adjusting the basic stuff? (A/F, fuel, etc?)

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I'm going to use the stock PCM and adjust for the displacement increase in the tune. it's really no different than tuning for a 4.6 stroker combo. the 5.4 3V has all the same functions as the 4.6 3V so all the sensors should function fine.
cams and phasers are here. now just need the BLE lash adjusters and we are ready to assemble.
degreeing the cams is going to be fun. these things had to be ground 10degrees advanced just to fit on the billet. not sure how i'll adjust them if they need to be changed.

i'm trying a low buck HP trick.
I used VHT SP101 white ceramic header paint on the tops of my pistons. I've read about this in a couple articles way back and they claimed to find 20+hp by doing this and coating the combustion chamberas well. they also recommended painting the intake port but my heads are assembled so that's not going to happen but i will coat the chamber and valve heads.
when it's cured properly the ceramic coating should last for quite a while and is solvent resistant so the fuel won't make it peel or burn off
It's supposed keep the heat in the explosion instead of transferring it to the metal (pistons and head chamber/valves). this increases cylinder pressure thus making more power.
I'll never know if it actually made a difference but heck I had the paint here so why not?.
my wife didn't like the smell when i used the oven to cure the paint
curing process
250* for 30 minutes
allow to cool
400* for 30 minutes
cool again
650* for 30 minutes (my oven only went to 550* so that will have to suffice.)
here's a pic

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA THE OVEN!!! good stuff

Set your cam locks in full retard. Cams and Ignition timing are just opposite. Full retard on the cams gives max power and torque.

For the crankshaft, all truck cranks have an 8-bolt flange. Look at the casting/forging numbers. F75-IE or F75-E are forged. Everything else is cast.

dem some purty pistons Ron!!!

good luck with the build