TVS 2300 or 2650

JG-1

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Hello all,

For a 2012 5.0 with stock internals and a full exhaust, is the 2650 superior or is the 2300 the way to go? I would be running approx 10lbs of boost on 93 octane. I believe VMP is making the Gen 3 2650 for the 5.0 platform within the next few months.
 

mrt2you

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it depends on how much power you want to make and how much money you want to spend.
a 2.3 and supporting mods on a coyote should get you to 800 rwhp.
more than enough for most people.
my guess is in 3-4 months after the 2.65 is out vmp2.3r can be found for $2K or less, i have seen several NEW ones at $2500 already. a 2.65 will be $4K.
if you have the $$$, buy the 2.65, they flow 20% more air and use less hp to turn. there will be less stress on your motor with the bigger supercharger than the smaller one with the same power levels.
if you plan on staying with stock internals go with the 2.3. they flow more than enough air to destroy a stock internal coyote motor.
 

JG-1

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it depends on how much power you want to make and how much money you want to spend.
a 2.3 and supporting mods on a coyote should get you to 800 rwhp.
more than enough for most people.
my guess is in 3-4 months after the 2.65 is out vmp2.3r can be found for $2K or less, i have seen several NEW ones at $2500 already. a 2.65 will be $4K.
if you have the $$$, buy the 2.65, they flow 20% more air and use less hp to turn. there will be less stress on your motor with the bigger supercharger than the smaller one with the same power levels.
if you plan on staying with stock internals go with the 2.3. they flow more than enough air to destroy a stock internal coyote motor.

Honestly I'd be happy with mid 600 hp. I know it's not to safe to push the coyote much further past that with the stock block and internals.

I'd be looking at buying the whole VMP kit, which is about 8k+ for the Gen2r right now.
 

JG-1

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I guess a better question would be is it better/safer to push 650ish HP with a 2.3 TVS or a 2.65 TVS. Or is it not that much of a difference?
 

Pentalab

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I guess a better question would be is it better/safer to push 650ish HP with a 2.3 TVS or a 2.65 TVS. Or is it not that much of a difference?

You would have to look at the eff maps (aka 'islands') and compare the two. My initial guess is the bigger 2.65 is more eff, requires less hp to drive it, and would make more boost for a given blower rpm / blower pulley diam.. and also lower blower outlet temps..and slightly reduced IAT's. Run it past Justin at VMP. On paper, the 2.65 should have an easier time of making 600-650 rwhp vs the smaller 2.3 The 2.65 is not only bigger displacement, it's more eff, between those 2 items combined, that's a big win-win. But you would have to see what blower pulleys VMP has available for the larger 2.65.

If it's just for street / DD / hwy use, 500-550 rwhp is ample, esp with a stock oem 2012 5.0 eng.
For street use, you really need a 305 / 315 rear tire to use that much power.

Even a 2.3 blower + LT's would be ample for street use. As noted, they will probably drop in price within months.
 

eighty6gt

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what?! I've got a 1.9, it was $3500!!! If I had bought bitcoin with that $ I would have enough today to buy a Ferrari F50.
 

mrt2you

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WOW $8K for a supercharger kit.
you could build a department of boost, DOB, kit for significantly less than that. they sell the basic kit for $2500 and you have to add the rest of the parts. you should be able to make a 650rwhp kit for less than $6k with DOB.
i have a DOB intake and bought all the rest of the parts, it cost me less then $4k and i make 650rwhp on pump 93 octane with a .020 over 4.6 3V motor.

now back on topic. the 2.65 will make power more efficiently than a 2.3 hands down. the question is do you want to spend at least $2k more to do it that way?
the 2.65 will be a better purchase if you want to forge your motor and add more power later. if you don't want more power later then a 2.65 in mo opinion is a waste of money.
the only person who can answer that question is you.

a link for some informative reading. from DOB
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...ofboost.com/&usg=AOvVaw2QbyDlmCbmFWCGT5PC76kr
 

fourdegrees11

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Something else to consider, the more efficient the blower is operating the less boost it needs to make the same power (as has been basically stated), which means the IATs are also lower. Boost = heat
 

08sta

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WOW $8K for a supercharger kit.
you could build a department of boost, DOB, kit for significantly less than that. they sell the basic kit for $2500 and you have to add the rest of the parts. you should be able to make a 650rwhp kit for less than $6k with DOB.
i have a DOB intake and bought all the rest of the parts, it cost me less then $4k and i make 650rwhp on pump 93 octane with a .020 over 4.6 3V motor.

now back on topic. the 2.65 will make power more efficiently than a 2.3 hands down. the question is do you want to spend at least $2k more to do it that way?
the 2.65 will be a better purchase if you want to forge your motor and add more power later. if you don't want more power later then a 2.65 in mo opinion is a waste of money.
the only person who can answer that question is you.

a link for some informative reading. from DOB
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjq6ovH1YXYAhWhQ98KHaljCVoQFggnMAA&url=http://www.departmentofboost.com/&usg=AOvVaw2QbyDlmCbmFWCGT5PC76kr

which blower are you using the m122 or 2.3? i assume you are running a 5 sp. what boost? i am buying a manifold this go around to put a kit on my adrenalin basically the same motor as the stang just an iron block. looking to get 600rwhp through the auto 6 spd.
 

Pentalab

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WOW $8K for a supercharger kit.
you could build a department of boost, DOB, kit for significantly less than that. they sell the basic kit for $2500 and you have to add the rest of the parts. you should be able to make a 650rwhp kit for less than $6k with DOB.
i have a DOB intake and bought all the rest of the parts, it cost me less then $4k and i make 650rwhp on pump 93 octane with a .020 over 4.6 3V motor.

now back on topic. the 2.65 will make power more efficiently than a 2.3 hands down. the question is do you want to spend at least $2k more to do it that way?
the 2.65 will be a better purchase if you want to forge your motor and add more power later. if you don't want more power later then a 2.65 in mo opinion is a waste of money.
the only person who can answer that question is you.

a link for some informative reading. from DOB
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjq6ovH1YXYAhWhQ98KHaljCVoQFggnMAA&url=http://www.departmentofboost.com/&usg=AOvVaw2QbyDlmCbmFWCGT5PC76kr

If you want to forge the internals, you may as well toss / sell the eng, and replace it with the FRPP aluminator version. All forged everything, + HD oil pump, strengthened AL block, etc, etc...and only cost $1K more than the oem coyote eng. Aluminator comes in a choice of either 9.5: CR or 11:1 CR. Turnkey, comes with a 2 yr, 24K mile warranty.

On a side note, at the 2012 Sema show, eaton had it's new TVS-3.3 blower on display. The 3.3 never was produced, they had issues with the internal gear train between the rotor packs. So 5 years later, the smaller TVS-2.65 comes to life.

At least with the 2.65 you would probably not have to resort to using real small blower pulleys + 10/12/15% eng crank OD pulleys to achieve desired boost levels.
 
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redfirepearlgt

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FYI - VMP is releasing their 2650 option very soon. It was revealed at PRI in Indy last weekend in the event you weren't aware. The guys down there are always willing to take the time to help you make the best decision on your upgrade needs. They've been good to me over the past 3-4 years on my project.
 

mrt2you

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i have read that the 2650 will be available april 18.


which blower are you using the m122 or 2.3? i assume you are running a 5 sp. what boost? i am buying a manifold this go around to put a kit on my adrenalin basically the same motor as the stang just an iron block. looking to get 600rwhp through the auto 6 spd.

i have a ported 1st gen ford racing TVS 2.3, ported elbow, 72mm L&M throttle body, don't remember what injectors. 20lbs boost with 10.5-1 pistons. tesked block. actually the stock 5 speed didn't like that much power so i upgraded to a 13 track pack 6060 and 2nd gen MGW shifter and carbon fiber driveshaft.
 

mrt2you

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no detonation and run on pump 93 octane reformulated sold in wisconsin

and i forgot to note i have GT500 fuel system with high flow rails
 

702GT

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I've had my hands on some PD blowers, and bigger is almost always better when it comes to PD's. More displacement, higher CFM capability per rotation, and better heat efficiency. I have no clue what the 2650 is, but if it has more displacement than the 2300, it's better. If it's a TVS, it's even better. If cost is a factor, that may be something to closely consider. Go with what fits your budget, but go as big as your budget allows within your power goals (and future power goals, if you think you're going to want to turn it up).
 

redfirepearlgt

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I've had my hands on some PD blowers, and bigger is almost always better when it comes to PD's. More displacement, higher CFM capability per rotation, and better heat efficiency. I have no clue what the 2650 is, but if it has more displacement than the 2300, it's better. If it's a TVS, it's even better. If cost is a factor, that may be something to closely consider. Go with what fits your budget, but go as big as your budget allows within your power goals (and future power goals, if you think you're going to want to turn it up).

2300 = 2.3L displacement
2650 = 2.65L displacement

The 2650 also has 170 degree rotor twist vice 160 degree in the 2300 setup. The case design when it comes to VMP v other makers of PD blowers is where much of the difference is. Many use the same Eaton rotor sets (they make the 160 and 170 degree sets) but incorporate them into their casing....just as Roush and others do in their designs. Of course everyone claims to be the best...
 

Pentalab

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i have read that the 2650 will be available april 18.




i have a ported 1st gen ford racing TVS 2.3, ported elbow, 72mm L&M throttle body, don't remember what injectors. 20lbs boost with 10.5-1 pistons. tesked block. actually the stock 5 speed didn't like that much power so i upgraded to a 13 track pack 6060 and 2nd gen MGW shifter and carbon fiber driveshaft.

How did you manage 20 psi boost on a 2.3 TVS...on your 4.6 L ? What size blower pulley...and what size crank pulley ?
 

Pentalab

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2300 = 2.3L displacement
2650 = 2.65L displacement

The 2650 also has 170 degree rotor twist vice 160 degree in the 2300 setup. The case design when it comes to VMP v other makers of PD blowers is where much of the difference is. Many use the same Eaton rotor sets (they make the 160 and 170 degree sets) but incorporate them into their casing....just as Roush and others do in their designs. Of course everyone claims to be the best...

The roush 2.3 TVS is at the bottom of the pecking order, followed by the VMP gen1 (which has the D shaped blower inlet and mating D shaped elbow ). Next in the pecking order was the oem Ford tvs 2.3 used on the 13/14 GT-500. Top of the pecking order is the VMP tvs-2.3 Gen2. VMP claimed another 2.15 psi for the same size blower pulley. The gen-2 has no separate elbow, the blower casing and elbow are all one casing.

The new ring master will be the VMP TVS-2.65 gen-3.... 170 deg twist vs 160m and bigger displacement..and higher flow rates and better eff...and lotsa $$.

Vmp sold high flow D shaped elbows for the roush blowers. VMP also sold an aftermarket ( not vmp) high flow elbow for the 13/14 GT-500 TVS-2300's.
 
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