Mid-mount muffler setups-how's the drone?

[ghunt81]

I can never leave the exhaust on my car alone, but anyway I've had the thought of doing mid mounted mufflers (since I still have the pipes with Magnaflows on them that I was using as resonators), except this time possibly with a muffler delete out back, or maybe small mufflers? I'm not sure.

Anyway I'm sure this setup would be stupid loud with the longtubes so I probably couldn't even run it, but I always wondered- how's the drone on a setup like this? Is it better with no mufflers in back?

 

[46addict]

Adding to this thread instead of starting a new one. I've wondered if it's possible to run one dual in/dual out muffler instead of the usual two round muffler setup near the DS tunnel. There probably isn't enough ground clearance for this but has anyone tried?

 

[drive_55_not]

Adding to this thread instead of starting a new one. I've wondered if it's possible to run one dual in/dual out muffler instead of the usual two round muffler setup near the DS tunnel. There probably isn't enough ground clearance for this but has anyone tried?

I know a few people have used the Dynomax Ultra FloWelded-X muffler with a delete, Unless you're slammed I don't think ground clearance will be an issue.

As far as mid mounted mufflers and drone ,, the drone will be dependent on the axle back, if they drone, mid mounts wont cure it.

I initially installed a pair of DroneMaster American Classics on my car, The drone was absolutely un-freakin bearable, I had a set of mid-mounted glaspac's and that did nothing for the drone, just quietened my exhaust down to where it wasn't much louder then stock.

I swapped out he Flowmasters for a set of Boomtubes and SLP LM2's and with my LT's that was the best sounding exhaust I've had on the car. I did have to remove the mid mounted SLP's cause my car is low and they drug on the dips into/out of our parking lots at work, I had to avoid speedbumps at all costs.

I installed a well worn set of Borla S-types and that's what I'm sticking with.

/

 

[ghunt81]

Adding to this thread instead of starting a new one. I've wondered if it's possible to run one dual in/dual out muffler instead of the usual two round muffler setup near the DS tunnel. There probably isn't enough ground clearance for this but has anyone tried?

Actually I'd be more worried about driveshaft clearance with such a setup. It might be possible, there's just not a ton of room to work with back there.

I think it would actually work better if you could get it right behind the H pipe, but you'd have to have the muffler inlet spacing dead on for that to work, and again, not a lot of room.

 

[Sky Render]

I've never actually seen a midmount setup on the S197, and I assume that's due to driveshaft clearance issues.

 

[Brandon08GT]

I had pypes M80s for a couple years and I liked them. No drone, but I also had the FR500S axlebacks so that may have been why. When I put longtubes in, the M80s were closer to the ground and I started having a lot more ground clearance issues, to the point of finally getting rid of them. So if you don’t have longtubes, ground clearance is fine, drone was zero and I liked them with my o/r x pipe. Longtubes, if you are lowered at all... good luck.

 

[ghunt81]

I put Magnaflows in my factory pipes and was able to tuck them up where ground clearance wasn't an issue, but really I feel like a mid mount setup on these cars should have hangers near the axle. I made some that kinda worked, but it wasn't ideal.

 

[07gts197]

Ive been running mid mounted m80s for years and love them. Not going to lie they do drone at highway speeds but under that its not bad. The only issues Ive run into are the clamps will vibrate loose and the flow tubes from the x pipe to mufflers have fallen off lol. But I think part of the reason is because Im running 79-04 flow tubes with the flanges cut off so I dont think they sit perfectly square in the clamps.

Since you have long tubes I bet the exhaust will be somewhat toned down though. Anyway I would try it, its different and cool imo. People love my exhaust and always ask what Im running. When I tell them its like I performed a magic trick on them lol.

And the best part is that you can remove the axleback deletes so its dumped if you wanna get crazy lol. Ive had mine like that for a few months now because the exhaust came off when I went through a hell of a puddle and I said F it. It sounds mean as hell but is loud. I can post videos if you'd like.

Last but not least, yes you can mid mount a dual in/out muffler. Theres actually more room than you would think.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

Have any of you heard of Solo Performance ? They make an exhaust system for the 2011-14 and current S550 cars which include a mid X muffler and adjustable J-pipes that eliminate 100% interior resonance drone.. Although they don't list any of their systems for the 2005-10 3v.. They'll custom fabricate a system on an individual basis, providing your willing to set up an appointment and have them custom install a one off kit on your 2005-10 3v if you choose to do so.. At any rate, I've already spoken with Rich who's one of the custom installers for Solo Performance that strongly recommends having their shop install a pair of J-pipes with my current O/R pro chamber and Borla S-type setup and has also assured me that installing adjustable J-pipe extensions will eliminate all interior resonance drone by cancelling out their frequencies altogether.. Needless to say at least in theory anyhow this would seem as being the best possible solution for getting rid of that annoying cabin drone and most of all, you don't have to give up nor upgrade your current exhaust setup in order to do so either.. Therefore I think this is an option really worth looking into IMHO.. In the meantime, I plan on taking my car up to Solo Performance for the custom J-pipe installation as soon as I'm able to get an appointment set up..

 

[ghunt81]

I saw a couple people selling their axle backs used at Carlisle when I was up there over the summer. I've heard of the "resonance chamber" idea before but never seen it on a production axle back, so that's kinda cool.

I guess you can actually do the same thing yourself with the correct length of pipe, people have done it.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

Fourdegrees11 has the Solo exhaust setup on his 12 GT and says the J-pipe (resonance chamber) design got rid of his drone and hasn't experience any since adding his Solo setup.. There's also someone on TMS who had a local shop custom fabricate/install J-pipe "resonance chambers" on his 2008 Bullitt who also claims they got rid of his drone issues as well.. So if adding "resonance chambers" to an existing exhaust setup eliminate drone as claimed, then IMHO they should work on any axle back/LT header setup without the need for having to swap out or upgrade to either Corsa or FR500S mufflers for getting rid of resonance drone..

 

[702GT]

There are plenty of mid-muffler setups out there done with various muffler brands. The most prominent of them by design is likely the Pypes M80 Mid-muffler System and by default the Eleanor side-exhaust mid-muffler system. There's actually more room than you might think to mount mid-mufflers. Obviously the 2-piece drive shaft will allow the most clearance, but even the 1-piece D/S will clear. About the only time you'll have to worry about contact is when jacking up the rear while the axels hang. Almost any time you mount mufflers under the cabin you're going to experience more drone/exhaust tone. I ran the Pypes MMS for 4-5 years and loved it. Ultimately I switched because I swapped back to stock cams, and it just wasn't as much fun to be loud anymore.

One of my favorite sounding 3v custom mid-muffler setups by exhaust note alone is the Flowmaster single chamber race series. It's a very short flowmaster, not very big at all. But it just sounds ridiculously sexy. Also the Bassani sport mufflers, they have an ungodly mellow thump at idle and just scream at WOT. A single dual in/dual out muffler might actually sound pretty cool. If the chambers mix, you could eliminate the mid-pipe and let the muffler serve as the balancing chamber, essentially a large prochamber midpipe. Personally I wouldn't add any additional mufflers in the factory locations, to me it would defeat the purpose of doing a mid-muffler setup to dampen the sound further.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

You mention that almost any time you mount mufflers under the cabin, you're going to experience more drone/exhaust tone.. Therefore where's the real advantage over mounting mufflers in the factory locations if you're going to still experience interior resonance drone.. From what you just described goes to show that moving the location of the muffler alone isn't going to solve the drone issues, as the sound frequencies that produce drone are still going to be a factor unless something is done to cancel them out.. By adding resonance chambers aka (J-pipe) adjustable extensions are designed to cancel out the frequencies that produce drone altogether and can be effective with any existing exhaust setup either mid mounted or in the factory locations.. Solo Performance includes these resonance chambers ( adjustable J-pipes) with their mid mounted exhaust systems that also include a mid mounted X muffler which is essentially as you put it, a large pro chamber midpipe.. Therefore unless you intend on upgrading to Corsa's which are the only mufflers that are designed to cancel out the frequencies for producing drone in the factory locations along with possibly FR500S mufflers, IMHO it would seem the Solo exhaust system design would be the most effective solution for eliminating the frequencies that produce interior resonance drone.. Anyway just saying

 

[Speedboosted]

I've been fiddling around with different exhaust setups for awhile now. The constants are Comp 127400 cams, Pypes longtubes, and offroad H.

First was Ford Racing Stingers, they sounded great but droned on the highway/cruising. One thing I didn't care for was how muffled the exhaust pulses were, couldn't even hear the cams lope. It was weird.

I swapped them out for FR500S and there was zero drone but the car was very noisy for me, especially at WOT. Sounded like a NASCAR race lol. They emitted an incredibly crisp and deep sound and you could certainly hear the lope from the cams.

Leaving the FR500S out back, I added a pair of Magnaflow race bullets (aka Magnapacks) to the OTA's about 6 inches from where the H pipe ended. This sound was very good, incredibly deep (would shake/vibrate the walls at the shop when I was warming it up), could still hear the lope, and while cruising it was great. I actually felt this got a touch louder inside, but only the SLIGHTEST bit. The noise level at WOT was reduced a little but not much, cruise was much much better however and most of all pretty much no rasp. I was worried about them not passing sound tech at a local road course so I ultimately shelved them.

I then found a deal on some SSS Adrenaline axle backs and decided to give them a shot. My one regret before this was never trying the Stingers out with the "resonators" before I sold them. The SSS is louder than the Stingers and when paired with resonators does not drone at all cruising down the road. Extremely pleased with how it sounds, except I still feel they are a little too muffled, again like the pulses are just kinda mushed together. Also can't really hear the car lope as much as the FR500S setup.

At this point I'm on the hunt for either MBRP Pro Series or Bassani Race/Sport/whatever they call it. I think the Bassani's are what I am looking for based on some Youtube clips so far. If anyone has firsthand experience with the MBRP or Bassani along with the Stingers, I'd love to hear your thoughts!

 

[702GT]

You mention that almost any time you mount mufflers under the cabin, you're going to experience more drone/exhaust tone.. Therefore where's the real advantage over mounting mufflers in the factory locations if you're going to still experience interior resonance drone.. From what you just described goes to show that moving the location of the muffler alone isn't going to solve the drone issues, as the sound frequencies that produce drone are still going to be a factor unless something is done to cancel them out.. By adding resonance chambers aka (J-pipe) adjustable extensions are designed to cancel out the frequencies that produce drone altogether and can be effective with any existing exhaust setup either mid mounted or in the factory locations.. Solo Performance includes these resonance chambers ( adjustable J-pipes) with their mid mounted exhaust systems that also include a mid mounted X muffler which is essentially as you put it, a large pro chamber midpipe.. Therefore unless you intend on upgrading to Corsa's which are the only mufflers that are designed to cancel out the frequencies for producing drone in the factory locations along with possibly FR500S mufflers, IMHO it would seem the Solo exhaust system design would be the most effective solution for eliminating the frequencies that produce interior resonance drone.. Anyway just saying

The muffler design can in itself reduce drone. The hard part is finding the balance between drone canceling and exhaust note. The MBRP mufflers are great at canceling drone, I ran their street series for about a year. The problem for me was I went from a Pypes MMS to the MBRP Street series in the factory location. It was a huge step down in exhaust note, but also carried virtually no drone. I ended up going with the Magnaflow standard mufflers with custom 4" tips. It gave me back some exhaust note with no noticeable drone. I admit though, with the red race BOV it was hard to tell if the exhaust had a drone over the BOV.

As far as superior exhaust note, nothing sounds better than a mid mounted muffler, in my opinion. The only way I can see to have a desired exhaust note without the drone, is to have an electronic bypass valve system in the exhaust, much like the GT350R uses. It could be set up to open/close at specific TPS voltage. Not sure how far someone really wants to go to engineer the perfect exhaust. What is acceptable drone to one may differ to another. The same goes for exhaust note. A lot of people can't stand the Pypes M80's. I loved them, just not on a stock cam. The car had a terrible drone at specific rpm's, I simply didn't cruise at those rpm's lol. Electronic cutouts and more exhaust piping will add weight to a car, so I can't say it's the best in performance options.

Beyond that, the only other known way to control drone is via resonators. Resonators are typically placed after the midpipe but before the mufflers. The Challenger's use resonators after the muffler, but I'm not sure how well they perform that far rear of the cabin. We are, after all, talking about drone the driver will hear, not necessarily what someone outside the vehicle hears. It's all theory here, as not many people go that route in an effort to reduce drone, it's usually done to enhance the exhaust note. I think if you want to reduce drone, mid-mounting the mufflers is the worst thing you could do. The best thing would be to stick with the factory muffler location and add resonators after the midpipe. Beyond that, it's choosing the least drone prone muffler type/style.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

The muffler design can in itself reduce drone. The hard part is finding the balance between drone canceling and exhaust note. The MBRP mufflers are great at canceling drone, I ran their street series for about a year. The problem for me was I went from a Pypes MMS to the MBRP Street series in the factory location. It was a huge step down in exhaust note, but also carried virtually no drone. I ended up going with the Magnaflow standard mufflers with custom 4" tips. It gave me back some exhaust note with no noticeable drone. I admit though, with the red race BOV it was hard to tell if the exhaust had a drone over the BOV.

As far as superior exhaust note, nothing sounds better than a mid mounted muffler, in my opinion. The only way I can see to have a desired exhaust note without the drone, is to have an electronic bypass valve system in the exhaust, much like the GT350R uses. It could be set up to open/close at specific TPS voltage. Not sure how far someone really wants to go to engineer the perfect exhaust. What is acceptable drone to one may differ to another. The same goes for exhaust note. A lot of people can't stand the Pypes M80's. I loved them, just not on a stock cam. The car had a terrible drone at specific rpm's, I simply didn't cruise at those rpm's lol. Electronic cutouts and more exhaust piping will add weight to a car, so I can't say it's the best in performance options.

Beyond that, the only other known way to control drone is via resonators. Resonators are typically placed after the midpipe but before the mufflers. The Challenger's use resonators after the muffler, but I'm not sure how well they perform that far rear of the cabin. We are, after all, talking about drone the driver will hear, not necessarily what someone outside the vehicle hears. It's all theory here, as not many people go that route in an effort to reduce drone, it's usually done to enhance the exhaust note. I think if you want to reduce drone, mid-mounting the mufflers is the worst thing you could do. The best thing would be to stick with the factory muffler location and add resonators after the midpipe. Beyond that, it's choosing the least drone prone muffler type/style.

I actually considered MBRP pro series, Pypes MMS, Roush extreme MMS, Borla Atak, FR500S and Corsa sport mufflers..Therefore I know exactly how difficult finding the right balance between drone cancelling and exhaust note really is.. I also know thru personal experience about the Magnaflow street mufflers, as I ran those for the past 4 years until I replaced them just recently with the Borla S-type mufflers.. Although the Magnaflows didn't drone nearly as much as my current Borla's, IMO they were just too quiet for my liking, so they now sit down in my basement lol. As for adding resonators, I actually purchased a pair of Vibrant resonators, part # 1793 and was nearly in the process of having a shop weld them in just before the mufflers.. However after upon further research, I discovered that a bottled resonator will only dampen resonance drone and does so by reducing the exhaust note (volume) by up to 25% or by 2-3 decibel levels in the process.. At any rate, I was not willing to sacrifice losing exhaust note (volume) only to end up still experiencing resonance drone despite being reduced, dampened or whatever.. Needless to say, I returned the Vibrant resonators back to Summit Racing where they were originally purchased from.. Shortly after returning the Vibrant resonators, is when I came across some posts on another forum about Solo performance.. Once I read about how well they worked by not just dampening resonance drone, but actually eliminating it altogether by cancelling out the sound frequencies that produce drone, I was then convinced this would be the best solution for controlling resonance drone without the risk of losing exhaust tone/volume in the process.. Perhaps I forgot to mention earlier, but the exhaust systems that Solo performance includes are resonance chambers (J-pipes) which actually are referred to as a " Helmholtz Resonator/Chamber" design that have been proven scientifically in lab tests to cancel out sound frequencies that produce resonance drone.. That being said, I'm more than willing to give the Solo design a real shot

 

[07 Boss]

I don't have any drone. Headers, O/R H, mid mounted Cherry Bombs and Outlaws out back. I don't think it is the exhaust set up though. My car rarely sees that 2000-2200 RPM range. Auto gear shifts at 15 MPH intervals at light throttle and no OD until about 70. This keeps the RPM's out of the drone zone and a blip away from the power band.

 

[808muscle]

Cams, blower, LTs Offroad H, borla s types. I added dynomax resonators mid mounted. Gets rid of all the raspy ugly notes of no cats. My car is loud, some drone but not the ear splitting kind. Without them the tone is too raspy and not as good. Had pypes m80s for a while but then they started rattling so I got rid of them.

 

[06 T-RED S/C GT]

I run Borla S-types with Mac O/R pro chamber, Saleen blower and stock manifolds.. I haven't noticed any rasp since adding the pro chamber, but my car is loud and I do experience ear splitting drone from 1500-2200 RPM's when under load and mostly when at idle sitting in traffic.. Other than that, the drone is tolerable.. As for your dynomax resonators, do you have them mid mounted staggered or side by side ?

 

[sc517hp]

Ok I just looked at this today and only scanned through the posts, but here is my experience- I have changed my exhaust so much on my S197 that I had to retap my stripped out hanger threads... I had the Roush Extreme mid mounts. They were very loud and the drone was more than I wanted. I replaced my x pipe with a custom made two in two out chambered exhaust with different axle backs (straight pipe, MBRP cans, etc)- straight pipes were loud raspy and loud drone, everything else was too quiet with different tones. The BEST sound I found for my S197 was mid mounted 24" Thrush glasspacks after an offroad H pipe. Almost zero drone, and not raspy at all. Great tone and not too loud. Here is a link to a vid of my car with offroad x and mid mounted 18" Flowtechs. The other specs of my build are posted with the video: