TR-3160 Possible on a 05-09?

blacknsilver05

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If someone was staying N/A, is the 3160 an option? Or does the swap not work? Was looking at 6060's but came across a 3160 for sale.
 

Racer47

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yes / no, its not a simple bolt in, the clutch, flywheel, pilot bearing (and probably more) are different. But it may work if you buy everything. Its probably not worth the effort over a tr6060
 

blacknsilver05

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yes / no, its not a simple bolt in, the clutch, flywheel, pilot bearing (and probably more) are different. But it may work if you buy everything. Its probably not worth the effort over a tr6060
On a 6060 swap, don’t you need clutch, flywheel, and pilot bearing as well?
 

Norm Peterson

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If someone was staying N/A, is the 3160 an option? Or does the swap not work? Was looking at 6060's but came across a 3160 for sale.
Make sure that the 3160's gear ratios are something you can live with - they're more like the MT82 where 5th is a 1.00:1 and 6th is a really big jump, meaning that you might not want deep axle gears. Unlike the 5.0 guys who have 7000 rpm to play with, you don't have that option, so 3.31's might actually be best overall.

Compared to the TR3650, the 3160 puts five ratios into about the same overall space as the 3650 puts only four.


3160
3.25
2.23
1.61
1.24
1.00
0.63


MT82
3.66
2.43
1.69
1.32
1.00
0.65


TR3650
3.38
2.00
1.32
1.00
0.68


Norm
 

1950StangJump$

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Make sure that the 3160's gear ratios are something you can live with - they're more like the MT82 where 5th is a 1.00:1 and 6th is a really big jump, meaning that you might not want deep axle gears. Unlike the 5.0 guys who have 7000 rpm to play with, you don't have that option, so 3.31's might actually be best overall.

Compared to the TR3650, the 3160 puts five ratios into about the same overall space as the 3650 puts only four.


3160
3.25
2.23
1.61
1.24
1.00
0.63


MT82
3.66
2.43
1.69
1.32
1.00
0.65


TR3650
3.38
2.00
1.32
1.00
0.68


Norm

My complaint with the 3650 was always that 1st was nice and low, then it felt like a HUGE gap to 2nd and 3rd. You wind out first quick, then it feels like you have to let the RPMs climb from way low when you hit 2nd and 3rd.

It was a big consideration in my T-56 Magnum and 4.10 selection for the car -- I wanted closer ratios. What you list with the 3160 seems to support that concept. I guess that's not surprising since it was designed for road course racing.
 
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Norm Peterson

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My complaint with the 3650 was always that 1st was nice and low, then it felt like a HUGE gap to 2nd and 3rd. You wind out first quick, then it feels like you have to let the RPMs climb from way low when you hit 2nd and 3rd.
Trust me, I notice the same things. Actually, with 3.55's and 26" tall tires (comparable to OE tires and 3.73's), 1st feels too short for at least one specific street driving situation that I encounter on a fairly regular basis. And out on the road courses, 2nd is itself too short with too big of a step down from 3rd to be very useful (using 2nd for less than 10 mph or 1000 rpm when you're still in the corner for much of that and can't use WOT anyway . . . just doesn't seem worth the trouble for HPDE).


It was a big consideration in my T-56 Magnum and 4.10 selection for the car -- I wanted closer ratios. What you list with the 3160 seems to support that concept. I guess that's not surprising since it was designed for road course racing.
I'm curious about the T-56 gearing you chose. I know I've seen a 2.66 low/4.10 combination mentioned somewhere, but I don't remember where or by who.


Norm
 

1950StangJump$

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Trust me, I notice the same things. Actually, with 3.55's and 26" tall tires (comparable to OE tires and 3.73's), 1st feels too short for at least one specific street driving situation that I encounter on a fairly regular basis. And out on the road courses, 2nd is itself too short with too big of a step down from 3rd to be very useful (using 2nd for less than 10 mph or 1000 rpm when you're still in the corner for much of that and can't use WOT anyway . . . just doesn't seem worth the trouble for HPDE).



I'm curious about the T-56 gearing you chose. I know I've seen a 2.66 low/4.10 combination mentioned somewhere, but I don't remember where or by who.


Norm

I went with the 2.97 and 4.10s. Keep in mind, this is a street car.

But, I did lots of research before coming to a decision. On the street, goosing the car at about 2000 RPMs is common for me, so I used that as a starting point to decide. I then prepared an Excel spreadsheet showing the cars speed in each gear at 2000 RPM using my (then) stock 3650 and 3.55s.

I then did the same with about every rear end gear combination and both T-56 combos (2.66 and 2.97).

I knew I liked the feel of 1st with the 3650 and 3.55s, but I wanted shorter 2nd and 3rd -- while keeping the final drive gear of the new trans (6th) similar to the current final drive gear of the 3650 (5th).

That's how I ended up with 2.97 and 4.10s. 1st is nearly identical to what I had and 6th is very close to the old 5th. But, 2nd and 3rd are wonderfully better :)
 

Norm Peterson

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Even 4th looks better than it was, even though the step up to it from 3rd is a little bigger than in the 3650. But by 4th you're just cruising in most street driving so it probably doesn't matter much.


Norm
 

fdjizm

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I went with the 2.97 and 4.10s. Keep in mind, this is a street car.

But, I did lots of research before coming to a decision. On the street, goosing the car at about 2000 RPMs is common for me, so I used that as a starting point to decide. I then prepared an Excel spreadsheet showing the cars speed in each gear at 2000 RPM using my (then) stock 3650 and 3.55s.

I then did the same with about every rear end gear combination and both T-56 combos (2.66 and 2.97).

I knew I liked the feel of 1st with the 3650 and 3.55s, but I wanted shorter 2nd and 3rd -- while keeping the final drive gear of the new trans (6th) similar to the current final drive gear of the 3650 (5th).

That's how I ended up with 2.97 and 4.10s. 1st is nearly identical to what I had and 6th is very close to the old 5th. But, 2nd and 3rd are wonderfully better :)
Nice I got the same gearset on my magnum and it's perfectly spaced, no more black hole between 4th and 5th.
I went with 4.30's though, to make up for that bit lower 1st gear. run's nice and shifts like butter!
 

1950StangJump$

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Nice I got the same gearset on my magnum and it's perfectly spaced, no more black hole between 4th and 5th.
I went with 4.30's though, to make up for that bit lower 1st gear. run's nice and shifts like butter!

Great! Do you have a blower? With my KB setup and 20” rims, the 4.10s don’t hook up well :)

Going to start upgrading suspension this summer ....
 

blacknsilver05

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Make sure that the 3160's gear ratios are something you can live with - they're more like the MT82 where 5th is a 1.00:1 and 6th is a really big jump, meaning that you might not want deep axle gears. Unlike the 5.0 guys who have 7000 rpm to play with, you don't have that option, so 3.31's might actually be best overall.

Compared to the TR3650, the 3160 puts five ratios into about the same overall space as the 3650 puts only four.


3160
3.25
2.23
1.61
1.24
1.00
0.63


MT82
3.66
2.43
1.69
1.32
1.00
0.65


TR3650
3.38
2.00
1.32
1.00
0.68


Norm
I guess my follow up question then is how high can 3 valves spin with let’s say a JDM 298 Rotating assembly? Cause my plan was just to have a 350-400whp N/A street car. I figured cams were going to shift the power band up top and as long as I kept the car breathing, the 3160 would be useful compared to the 6060.
 

blacknsilver05

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You can get by with just a 26 spline clutch disk as the minimum on the 6060. But there are actual design differences in the 3160 layout. Read this.

https://trackmustangsonline.com/threads/mustang-tremec-tr-3160-trans-upgrade.9719/#post-197557
Wow read through that whole thread. Seems like more of a pain then it’s worth for just a weekend street car. Well then Racer do you think a 6060 will align with my goals for the power I shooting for? Or do you think the 6060 gearing is too long and will actually slow the car down? I have 3.73’s right now in the rear end.
 

fdjizm

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Great! Do you have a blower? With my KB setup and 20” rims, the 4.10s don’t hook up well :)

Going to start upgrading suspension this summer ....
Nope, just a little baby NA car. And keeping it that way. Got tired of destroying TR3650's at the track.
 

Norm Peterson

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I guess my follow up question then is how high can 3 valves spin with let’s say a JDM 298 Rotating assembly? Cause my plan was just to have a 350-400whp N/A street car. I figured cams were going to shift the power band up top and as long as I kept the car breathing, the 3160 would be useful compared to the 6060.
You need to get in touch with the 4.6L 'engine guys' for an answer to that one. Assuming long-term street use is in the picture, I hope you can find somebody who's not just into drag racing.


Norm
 

eighty6gt

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TR3650 ratios + 3.73 + stock height tires + 12 psi/cams/exh = 3rd gear keeps pulling like a rocket ship.

I wouldn't try to rev a 4.6 3v over 6700.
 

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