Sta-bill longevity

Shotokan1509

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The blue Marine stabil is better than regular red stabil, for the few bucks it costs I use it in all lawn equipment jugs and mustang gets it with full tank for winter storage

Never been a Sta-Bil believer. I park stuff for winter. Come spring, fill up with higher octane to mix with what may have been lost (octane-wise) over winter and just burn it up. Has worked very well for 25+ years for me. 60+ years for my Dad.

Now if I could buy 10 gallons of gas with ethanol in it and drop a few once of something to cause the fuel and ethanol to separate that would be nice. Then have an easy way to draw off the ethanol.

We have a Toro 521 snowblower from 84 (when I was born), every damn year when I was little it wouldn't start come fall had to be all torn down but then ran flawlessly. Started using Stabil and it now fires first pull out of summer storage.

As far as separation, think I just ran in to that with my chainsaw. I don't use it that much, same mixed tank for while now and it went from always firing first pull off idle to needing wide open and settles bit smokey. Drained tank and theres orange separation layer at bottom... both the oil mix I use & the stabil is blue. I'm guessing the orange is ethanol with water settling.
 

06 T-RED S/C GT

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That sucks!
Perhaps I can find out if any of the Shell stations in the area offer non-ethanol 91 octane fuel, as we do have 2 Shell stations here in my area. But if not? then it appears I'll just have to stick with using Sta-Bill 360 as an ethanol treatment :shrug:
 

Pentalab

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The Federal ethanol mandate needs to go.

10% ethanol is silly at the best of times. It will lean out the eng by .3 to .5 afr..... so you have to use MORE of it. 85% ethanol results in way lower BTU per gallon..so even more has to be used.... hence your mileage drops 30% min....so you better be buying it cheap...and more often..pita. The only thing 85% ethanol has going for it is it's 105-107 octane....essentially race gas. But then the injectors, fuel rails etc, have to be made from SS.... and your fuel pumps have to be upgraded to handle the extra 30% flow requirements. Dual GT-500 pumps etc, + dual BAP setup, etc.
 

tjm73

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My Dad only runs non-ethanol fuel in his old cars. They don't need the higher octane, but he just doesn't see the risk of trouble as worth saving a few cents per gallon on fill up.
 

06 T-RED S/C GT

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I was under the assumption that all modern/late model cars were all designed to run on fuels that contain 10% ethanol without any potential risk to neither the fuel system nor engine components. However if running fuels that include 10% ethanol may lead to potential fuel system and engine component damage, then what options are available other than using fuel stabilizer products such as Sta-Bill 360 and Sea-Foam if non-ethanol gas stations aren't locally available within your particular area or region :shrug:
 
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tjm73

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Modern cars are built to run the stuff. The issue is it dilutes the quality of the fuel and reduces the power and efficiency a gallon of fuel delivers. I am not against farmers, far from it, bu this was nothing more than throwing money to Midwest farmers under the "renewable energy, biofuel independence" banner during a time when "biofuel" was the hot thing buzz word that lots of people thought was going to get us off oil based fuels. There were also claims that adding the corn juice would clean up emissions a little bit too. Well as soon as some studies broke light and showed that the ethanol played a roll in forming smog, that talking point disappeared.

A couple years after ethanol fuel got pushed on the public rural Western NY, which never had air quality issues, started having high ozone days. Are they directly related? Don't know, but the timing is/was suspect.

If you take 10 gallons of non-ethanol fuel and 10 gallons of 10% blended ethanol fuel. and put them in the same car with the same driver under the same or similar driving conditions, and the non-ethanol fuel will return better economy.
 

Juice

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And thats pretty much why I quit worrying about ethanol at 10% or less
 

1950StangJump$

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If you take 10 gallons of non-ethanol fuel and 10 gallons of 10% blended ethanol fuel. and put them in the same car with the same driver under the same or similar driving conditions, and the non-ethanol fuel will return better economy.

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but there are some real world problems with this statement. Gas companies put the technology, cleaning agents, etc into their main products, which are 10% ethanol.

When you buy non-ethanol, it's very hard to know what the overall quality of the fuel is, to include cleaning agents.
 

Pentalab

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Story I got was Ford started factoring in 10% ethanol into their oem tunes by 2009 /2010. Their tune is designed around 10% ethanol.
 

06 T-RED S/C GT

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What about prior to 2009-10? IIRC 10% ethanol blended fuels were being implemented long before 2009. Therefore if oem tunes were neither designed nor compatible to run 10% ethanol prior to 2009-10 then what are the potential risks involved for vehicles that were manufactured prior to 2009-10? Also another reason for concern is what do aftermarket tuners such as Lito, VMP, Lund and JDM design their tunes around, do they factor in for fuels that include 10% ethanol or for only fuels that are non-ethanol :shrug:
 

Juice

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Most engines not designed for e10 will tolerate e10 and run ok, but they will be running a bit lean. At low loads this isnt a big deal, but full throttle may melt pistons.
 

tjm73

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Every S197 was designed for and can handle E10. Cars like my Foxbody, can likely handle E10 as far as the fuel system components are concerned, but they are not setup to run E10. E10 showed up in the early 2000's I want to say shortly after 9/11 when we got all excited and worried about energy independence.

But if you run non-ethanol fuel the S197 will return better fuel economy. My brother has a Dodge Magnum wagon 5.7 AWD. He ran regular E10 in it for a couple years after he got it. Then he tried ethanol free gas. Car runs better and gets better fuel economy. And the 4-6-8 cylinder deactivation works better and at slower speeds without hiccups. He put E10 in it to see if it was his imagination and it was not. He only runs non-ethanol.
 

06 T-RED S/C GT

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Most engines not designed for e10 will tolerate e10 and run ok, but they will be running a bit lean. At low loads this isnt a big deal, but full throttle may melt pistons.

I had JDM write my tunes for 91 octane, but always run 93 octane fuel just in order to prevent any potential lean conditions from the 10% ethanol blend.

The only non-ethanol gas around here is some old mom-n-pop shop with no-name gas. And it's only the 87 octane.

Unfortunately our old mom and pop shops around here are a thing of the past. The closest gas station that still sells non-ethanol branded fuel is approx 93.4 miles from my area.

Every S197 was designed for and can handle E10. Cars like my Foxbody, can likely handle E10 as far as the fuel system components are concerned, but they are not setup to run E10. E10 showed up in the early 2000's I want to say shortly after 9/11 when we got all excited and worried about energy independence.

But if you run non-ethanol fuel the S197 will return better fuel economy. My brother has a Dodge Magnum wagon 5.7 AWD. He ran regular E10 in it for a couple years after he got it. Then he tried ethanol free gas. Car runs better and gets better fuel economy. And the 4-6-8 cylinder deactivation works better and at slower speeds without hiccups. He put E10 in it to see if it was his imagination and it was not. He only runs non-ethanol.

What you posted about E10 showing up in the early 2000's sounds about right. I just couldn't recall from memory if it was before 2005 or after? Anyhow prior to owning my first S197, my last fox body was a 93 SVT Cobra that I owned until 2005 which was bone stock and ran nothing but 93 octane. At any rate, I never noticed any hiccups or hesitation issues, but fuel economy most definitely could've been better than what it was, just as it could be better with my current S197 at the present lol. Guess I'll just have to stick with using Sta-Bill 360 as an ethanol treatment or whenever coming across a gas station that has non-ethanol fuel while "on the go" during a road trip :shrug:
 

Pentalab

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What about prior to 2009-10? IIRC 10% ethanol blended fuels were being implemented long before 2009. Therefore if oem tunes were neither designed nor compatible to run 10% ethanol prior to 2009-10 then what are the potential risks involved for vehicles that were manufactured prior to 2009-10? Also another reason for concern is what do aftermarket tuners such as Lito, VMP, Lund and JDM design their tunes around, do they factor in for fuels that include 10% ethanol or for only fuels that are non-ethanol :shrug:

When I got the tune from VMP, the drop down box asked if... 'does ur fuel contain 10% ethanol, yes or no..... or... 'don't know'. And also what octane is being used. So I asked for a 94 no octane tune.
 

06 T-RED S/C GT

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JDM's tune sheet doesn't have anything in their fuel/octane selection list regarding fuels that are non-ethanol. Therefore I'm assuming they do not provide tunes for non-ethanol fuels in 87, 89, 91 and 93 octanes. The only other fuel selection options are: (100) (C16) (MS103) and (MS109) for which I have no idea what they are :shrug:At any rate, I've posted a sample of the JDM tune sheet.

JDM Engineering, Inc. [email protected] or [email protected] www.TeamJDM.com

Ph- 732-780-0770 Fax- 732-780-6924

CUSTOMER INFORMATION TUNE SHEET



Tune File Name : ___________________________________________________



NAME : _____________________________ DATE : ______________________

ADDRESS:_________________________________________________________

Phone : __________________ Email : _________________________________



Year: _______________ Make & Model: ____________________________________________

Engine: (2V) (3V) (4V) (5.0) (5.2) (6.2) (Eco-Boost) Other: _________________________

Octane : (87) (89) (91) (93) (100) (C16) (MS103) (MS109) Other : ________________

Computer Code: _____________ Strategy/PCM part#:_________________________________

Cold Air Kit Brand: ______________________________________________________________

MAF Sensor: (Stock) (80) (90) (2400) (2800) (2600)(3000)(Saleen)(Edelbrock) Other: ________

MAF Housing Size (Stock) (80) (90) (95) (100) (108) (110) (113) (123) (140) (148) Other:______

Injector Size: (stock) (36) (38) (39) (42) (47) (52) (60) (72) (78) (80) (ID1050) Other: ______

Supercharger: (N/A ) (Roush TVS) (Roush M 90) (Saleen) (Edelbrock ) (Whipple) (KB) (TVS)

(Eaton) ( Magnum Powers) (Procharger) (Vortech/Paxton) Notes_______________________

Upper Pulley Size: _________________Lower Pulley Size:______________________________

Throttle Body : (Stock) or Aftermarket : Brand ______________Size _____________________

Intake Manifold: _______________________________________________________________

Gear Ratio: (3.15) (3.31) (3.55) (3.73) (3.90) (4.10) (4.30) (4.56) Other:________________

Tire Size : _________/______/__________ Tire RPM:_______________Tire mm:____________

Torque Converter : (Stock) or Brand : ____________________ Stall: _____________________

Transmission Shift kit / Valve Body : ________________________________________________

Headers : (Stock) or Brand: __________________________________ (Shorty) or (Long Tube)

Catalytic Converters : (Stock) ( High Flow) ( Off-Road) (Green) Brand: ___________________

Spark Plugs: (Stock) (TR6) (HTO) (FR 12mm) (FR16mm) (FR5.0) (NGK 6510) Other:___

Spark Plug Gap: ______________________________________________________________________________________

Oil Breather: (Yes) (No) Electric Fan : (Yes) (No) Boost Bypass: (Yes) (No)

Fuel Pumps : (Stock) or (Dual) Brand: _____________________________________________

Fuel Rails : (stock ) or (aftermarket ) Brand : ________________________________________

Motor: (Stock) or (Built) Specs: __________________________Compression ratio:_________

Cams : (Stock) or (Aftermarket ) Brand : ___________________Lift_______Duration:_______

Transmission : Manual or Automatic / (Built) Or (Stock) /

Other : _______________________________________________________________________



Serial # for SCT Device __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __



Vin#_______________________________________________ (2017+ Vehicles)



If you have any questions feel free to contact us.

Please send this completed tune sheet to [email protected] for us to process your order
 
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