Broken Exhaust Stud Shop charging 400

stang_gang

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Alright guys so I bought a x pipe to bolt up to the stock exhaust manifolds last week. I tried to install it myself but could not break loose the bolts on the header to exhaust. I decided I would take it to a local shop that is well known for working on mustangs. They broke all 4 studs on the header and said they cant drill them out because cast iron is too hard to drill through and tap. So now they decided to take off the headers and said that I am probably looking at 400 bucks. Initially they said it was a 100 dollar job. In the process of taking off the headers they broke 1 stud on each side of the block so now they have to get those out too. CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN TO ME WHY YOU CANT JUST DRILL OUT THE EXHAUST STUD IN THE FIRST PLACE AND REPLACE IT WITH A FUCKING BOLT????
 

fdjizm

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Might be a big job for an easy out, when I did this years ago I hot the studs with a blow torch and PB blaster before attempting to move them.
I got lucky and they popped right off though.
It would have been a $100 job if the studs didn't break but I am sure they are now calculating the labor in removing the manifolds.
 

Dino Dino Bambino

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CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN TO ME WHY YOU CANT JUST DRILL OUT THE EXHAUST STUD IN THE FIRST PLACE AND REPLACE IT WITH A FUCKING BOLT????

The short answer is that you can, provided you have a hard enough drill bit that isn't going to break. Obviously the shop you went to chose to do things the hard way.
 

stang_gang

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The short answer is that you can, provided you have a hard enough drill bit that isn't going to break. Obviously the shop you went to chose to do things the hard way.
SMH If I knew they were gonna do all this extra shit I would have bought long tubes and had them put on. Note to self "anytime you do a exhaust replace the whole thing at one time"

I feel like this Karma. Like I preach to people how I never use shops because they charge too much for things I can do and the one time I decide to use a shop I get completely screwed. They still haven't given me a price because they're still working on it currently and they don't know the amount of man hours it'll take. I bet if we initially agreed that if they go over the "estimated man hours" it takes to put on the x pipe they would have been more careful about taking off the bolts or decided to run to home depot for a drill bit hard enough to drill that out
 
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Dino Dino Bambino

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I'm thinking about getting a pair of shorties but I can't decide whether to get the real JBAs (look crappy quality), Chinese JBA knockoffs at half the price (look much better quality and 304 stainless too), or not bother at all.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/JBA-1675S-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stainless-...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

I don't want long tubes because that entails moving the cats away from their stock location, and I need them to warm up as quickly as possible on cold winter days.
 

stang_gang

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They broke the bolt, they should eat some of the labor to repair it.
That's how I feel apparently they are but I'm still having to pay 4x the price I was quoted. They should have said that if anything happens they would have to charge more. I bet they didn't even use pb blaster or anything on the bolts. They probably just stuck a big ass impact on it and sent it.

Depends on which shorties you buy. Anything other than JBA or BBK, which are functionally mid length headers, would indeed be a waste of time.
I think you should just go long tubes..... Shorties don't really give you much gains.
 
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GlassTop09

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I'm thinking about getting a pair of shorties but I can't decide whether to get the real JBAs (look crappy quality), Chinese JBA knockoffs at half the price (look much better quality and 304 stainless too), or not bother at all.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/JBA-1675S-Shorty-Header-05-10-Mustang-4-6L/293357388679?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Stainless-Steel-Shorty-Exhaust-Header-Manifold-for-05-10-Ford-Mustang-4-6-281-V8/332734689722?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

I don't want long tubes because that entails moving the cats away from their stock location, and I need them to warm up as quickly as possible on cold winter days.

Hey Dino,

If this helps you the LT mid length header\cat design will heat up past cat thermal flash off temp of 450*F pretty quick (I have a set of Kooks 1 5\8" headers w\ catted X-pipe mid pipe). When I was recently chasing around my 2nd round of misfires I noted thru a FF recording my cats had reached an internal temp of 1,128*F in 48 secs after initial cold start so they will heat the cats up very quick for headers (why the PCM uses the engine RPM's & why it's very important for the O2 sensor warmup timer to be set up properly in the tune to reflect the distance between the closest cylinder exhaust port on a bank & the 1st O2 sensor for that bank so the PCM knows when headers are installed). After I rectified the misfires (cheap ass dielectric grease) and replaced the leaking EVAP CPV (making B2 overly lean vs B1 so PCM over corrected putting more unburnt fuel into both B1 & B2 cats making this worse), now in Mode 6 data my cats are hitting a more normal 998*F in the same time frame which is well past the 450*F thermal flashoff threshold w\ engine RPM's staying at\just over 1500 RPM's for approx. 20 secs (when the cats cross the 450*F threshold) then drop down to 1385-1415 until CL status is met (the 48 secs mark for the O2 sensors to start operating so PCM has full control) then drop down to around 813 RPM's until full warmup ECT is reached then drop down to the normal 750 RPM idle (PCM does check the cats for fast warmup as well as for COT protection within a certain time frame for OBDII compliance on every cold start & will adjust the engine RPM's & fueling according to ECT\load at startup & pull spark timing if COT is exceeded...all this is recorded in the Mode 6 data record)...if all cat stuff in tune isn't deactivated or altered to defeat it.

Got w\ my tuner & he showed me all of this in my tune calibration thru HPTuners VCM Editor so I now know it's all enabled in my tune & is set up right for what I have installed.

So if you do go w\ LT headers, make sure that whoever is doing the tune make the proper adjustments in the OL fuel base map, OL fuel cold base map as well as for the O2 sensor warmup timer (stock CL O2 sensor temp threshold setting is 500*F which coincides w\ the cat thermal temp flashoff setting so the O2 sensors will come online at that time) to maintain the cats operational parameters to ensure that they'll have the best chance for OBDII compliance & longevity as well as engine HP\TQ (as long as the CL AFR setting is left at\close to the stock 14.64 AFR/Lambda 1.0 setting) as the PCM goes into OL control then the OL fuel base map is used when going into part/WOT throttle & all the other cat stuff is ignored except for COT when making power.

Hope this helps you out.
 

Dino Dino Bambino

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I already have a free flowing X-pipe with Pypes high flow cats so I'd rather avoid having to modify or replace it. The cost of buying and shipping LT headers with shorty midpipe to Cyprus (plus custom charges & VAT) is ridiculous.
 

stang_gang

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The shit show continues.... They weren't able to install it without it leaking so now they're installing the stock pipe again....
 

GlassTop09

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I already have a free flowing X-pipe with Pypes high flow cats so I'd rather avoid having to modify or replace it. The cost of buying and shipping LT headers with shorty midpipe to Cyprus (plus custom charges & VAT) is ridiculous.
Understand.
I see that you're using Pypes Hi Flow Cats...I'll assume they're the metallic substrate version, correct?
From what I now know concerning OBDII cat design\compliance I would've gone w\ the Pypes full exhaust system (headers, catted X-pipe & catback) instead of Kooks for the cats alone as they're only 1 of a very few handful of retailers that design their aftermarket cats to be as fully OBDII compliant thus Federal compliant as you can get (right down to the O2 sensor placement on the cat shell) for the price.

The shit show continues.... They weren't able to install it without it leaking so now they're installing the stock pipe again....
I do feel for you dude as that type of stuff does suck. I hope the shop will make it right w\ you.
 

RogerC

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Alright guys so I bought a x pipe to bolt up to the stock exhaust manifolds last week. I tried to install it myself but could not break loose the bolts on the header to exhaust. I decided I would take it to a local shop that is well known for working on mustangs. They broke all 4 studs on the header and said they cant drill them out because cast iron is too hard to drill through and tap. So now they decided to take off the headers and said that I am probably looking at 400 bucks. Initially they said it was a 100 dollar job. In the process of taking off the headers they broke 1 stud on each side of the block so now they have to get those out too. CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN TO ME WHY YOU CANT JUST DRILL OUT THE EXHAUST STUD IN THE FIRST PLACE AND REPLACE IT WITH A FUCKING BOLT????
Apparently they weren't known for doing high quality work otherwise it would have been only a minor inconvenience removing your exhaust. I did the whole exhaust on my 06 three years ago on my driveway with the car on jackstands. I soaked the manifold studs before attempting to remove the exhaust. Ended up snapping one stud. I drilled the stud out laying on my back on the driveway. It took a while but I got it.
 

fdjizm

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I heard you can also weld a nut to the broken stud, but that may require a bit of finesse these guys don't sound like they have.
 

Dino Dino Bambino

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Understand.
I see that you're using Pypes Hi Flow Cats...I'll assume they're the metallic substrate version, correct?

They're ceramic. Metallic substrate is recommended on forced induction applications.

I bet they didn't even use pb blaster or anything on the bolts. They probably just stuck a big ass impact on it and sent it.
The shit show continues.... They weren't able to install it without it leaking so now they're installing the stock pipe again....

You're probably right about the first and if they knew what they were doing, the new pipe would have been leak free. Hope they eventually get it sorted.

I think you should just go long tubes..... Shorties don't really give you much gains.

Long tubes don't give you huge gains either if you already have a free flowing midpipe, and I could probably get shorties for 1/4 of the cost.
 

Bullitt2954

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I heard you can also weld a nut to the broken stud, but that may require a bit of finesse these guys don't sound like they have.

I don’t bother welding anything to the broken fastener - just use the TIG torch to concentrate your arc on the fastener, and add a bit of filler rod to the puddle. The key is to build a “knot” or “ball” of metal, you may have to break the arc a few times when doing so - then once it’s sufficiently large-enough, break the arc, grab your visegrip, and clamp on and start twisting IMMEDIATELY after it quits glowing.

I have removed Literally Hundreds of broken bolts this way. Only One failure - on a severely-corroded, 25-year-old bolt in a heater-block on an terminally-abused hot-stamp machine.

A small fastener is trickiest, just because of the diameter. But Dis-similar metals (stainless or ferrous in say, aluminium) is Easy.

The “Trick” is, heating the fastener itself to melting/plastic temp, and adding something to grip it with (the “knot”). This expands it and the threading in the hole a bit, and breaks the corrosion holding it in the threads.

If it doesn’t work at first, hit it again. Two to three welds usually is enough, although I once had a fastener that broke again every few turns - took probably seven or eight times on that one. But I got it out.
 

01yellerCobra

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I don’t bother welding anything to the broken fastener - just use the TIG torch to concentrate your arc on the fastener, and add a bit of filler rod to the puddle. The key is to build a “knot” or “ball” of metal, you may have to break the arc a few times when doing so - then once it’s sufficiently large-enough, break the arc, grab your visegrip, and clamp on and start twisting IMMEDIATELY after it quits glowing.

I have removed Literally Hundreds of broken bolts this way. Only One failure - on a severely-corroded, 25-year-old bolt in a heater-block on an terminally-abused hot-stamp machine.

A small fastener is trickiest, just because of the diameter. But Dis-similar metals (stainless or ferrous in say, aluminium) is Easy.

The “Trick” is, heating the fastener itself to melting/plastic temp, and adding something to grip it with (the “knot”). This expands it and the threading in the hole a bit, and breaks the corrosion holding it in the threads.

If it doesn’t work at first, hit it again. Two to three welds usually is enough, although I once had a fastener that broke again every few turns - took probably seven or eight times on that one. But I got it out.
Because most people have a tig welder in their garage?
 

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