Track package stock brake pads?

kcbrown

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From what I've seen about the brake pads in the 2013/2014 GT track package, they're something of a mystery. There's some indication that they're different than the pads that come with the Brembo brake package, but I've not seen anything terribly specific.

Many messages refer to them as "performance friction" pads, but whether that means they're manufactured by Performance Friction or that the designation is just a designation is difficult to ascertain.

And so I have to ask a couple of simple questions about them:


  1. Who makes them, and what is the manufacturer's designation for them?
  2. What kind of compound are they? What temperature range?
  3. How well do they hold up on the track (be sure to specify the tires you were using if you answer this question)?

I'm going to be switching to the Stoptech pads since they appear to be excellent on both street and track (1300 degree max temperature means they should hold up reasonably well as long as I stick with street tires, which is my intention), but it would be nice to know if these pads can act as fallbacks.
 

2013MustangGT

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I did one HPDE on the track package brake pads with stock tires (perrili p zeros). They held up well. However, my braking zones were longer than using a track specific brake pad. I went with Motul 600 for brake fluid before that event. Also, for events after that I went with Hawk DTC 60 for the front and HT 10 for the rear. My suspension for all events has been Whiteline every thing and ASTs from Vorshlag.

I would say you could get away with the track package brakes if you want to find out if you would like to do auto x or road courses, but if you decide that's what you want to do you will need to upgrade your brake pads. As far as who makes them and what there are made of, I have no clue.
 

csamsh

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My stock brembo pads said "brembo" on the backing plates...so I'm guessing that's who made them. You could pull them off and look, the front pads are very easy to yank and put back in.
 

Vorshlag-Fair

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Don't expect any pads that ever came on an S197 from the factory to be worthwhile at a track event, unless you are driving at 50% or less of the car's potential. And that happens in some cases, but most folks can cook the OEM pads quickly. I've taken brand new factory pads down to the backing plates in less than 10 minutes of hard track use. They got so hot they crumbled and fell apart...

IMG_6222-M.jpg


Track worthy pads have a higher heat tolerance, higher friction coefficient, and all will make more noise and duct than the OEMs would allow for stock pads. They also don't work well when dead cold, so panic stops when first driving are compromised. This is why brake pad manufacturers recommend not using them on the street - to cover their butts if someone rolls through a stop light on dead cold race pads. With some forethought it isn't a big deal, but they like to be safe.

http://ctbrakes.com/brake-compounds.asp - Carbotech brake pad compounds

The difference in a good "track pad" vs a street compound or even an autocross compound brake pad is dramatic on track. If you do NOTHING else to your S197 before going out on track, put in good brake fluid and a set of track worthy pads. Swap them at home before your event and swap back to your "daily driver" pads when you return. With Carbotech brand pads we skip the 1521 (street pad) and the AX6 (autocross pad) and go straight to XP10 front and XP8 rears on a 14" Brembo equipped S197, at a minimum. As your speeds and grip levels increase you could end up moving up the scale...

_DSF2953-M.jpg


On our 3770 pound TT3 Mustang we've moved up the compound scale to XP20 front and XP16 rear compounds, and get excellent heat resistance, wear and braking power. That's a fairly extreme pad and more than most Mustang folks need by a long shot, and it does make a LOT of dust and a LOT of noise. I've also been able to get them to "glowing cherry red" in daylight conditions and still had excellent stopping power and longer brake pad replacement intervals. I've tried a dozen brands over the years and I finally found one I can trust.

_DSC2747-M.jpg


The one other clue to a pad's track worthiness, beyond a claim of "don't use these on the street!", is the cost. The lower cost brands of brake pads use a lot of FILLER MATERIAL, which turns to goo and allows the actual brake pad compound to come apart in high heat situations. I cannot count how many sets of Hawk and other brands of "lower cost" pads I've taken off of my cars and had them crumble and break apart with 3/4 of the pad material left. The old adage applies to brake pads: "you get what you pay for". The more respected, more expensive brands that you see on race cars tend to work better and last a lot longer on your track car also: Ferrodo, Pagid, Carbotech, PFC, etc.

Good luck,
 
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csamsh

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Semi-Related- the AX6's really are fantastic for autox. No dragging necessary. More bite than street pads. They are noisy beasts though.
 

jayel579

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What makes a good race car does not make a good street car and visa versa....

Whatever/whoever made those pads are for the street, not intended for track use.
 

TheViking

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I have take-off's from a 2012 GT500 and the stock front pads say Ferodo 4448, along with the Brembo logo. I have heard the stock rears are a PFC pad. I did one track event last year at NJMP with the stock front and rear pads and they held up under moderate braking but you could sure smell them when pushing it harder. FYI, I also have brake ducts up front.

For the Summit Point Shenandoah event last weekend I switched to PFC08's and dedicated rotors. I'll start by saying I've never run any other track pad (on cars) so have little point of comparison amongst brands. But compared to the stock stuff they were incredible and even when cold the amount of brake available vs stock is dramatic. They are a bit grippy but still progressive enough for me to easily dial in the level of braking desired. As a bonus they made very little noise cold or hot. Will have to see how they wear over time but otherwise for my level of track driving they were terrific.
 

wiperblade

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I ran the stock brembo pads on summer street tires on a few tracks. If you just want to drive the track like a fun country road (maybe 6/10ths), they will hold up for a while (I have no brake ducting).

If you want to push harder (8/10ths+) their bite will decrease as they get too hot and your braking distance will increase. At that point it's time to cool them down.

Switching to carbotech xp 10s front 8 rear, they have a stronger initial bite and were consistent. I drive at 8/10ths, sometimes creeping towards 9/10ths, and so far they have been great. They are school bus loud on the street.
 

NoTicket

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While I can't verify it, the stock pads seem the same on the Brembo package, Boss 302 package, and the track pack. The only time I tried to verify it I called a local dealer and they said they sold the same pad for all 3 in the parts department, and they were the same pads as for the 2007 era GT500.

I wanted to just put my 2 cents in. A lot of people in the track day group that I participate in use Carbotechs. Some have switched to Raybestos ST-43/47 and Performance Friction pads. I ended up using Raybestos ST-43's and they are spectacular, and they seem to last about forever. There is almost no visible difference in pad size before and after a track day.

While I have not used them, from everything I have read the Carbotech pads will not last you nearly as long.

Either way, if you want to track your Mustang I would recommend swapping out at least your front pads to track only pads every time. The stock pads are actually not awful, but they are not up to more than 1 or 2 HPDE days and they will be gone.
 

19COBRA93

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Yes, all the 4 piston Brembo equipped Mustangs from 07-14 run the exact same pad. This includes GT track pack, GT500, and Boss.
 

DPE

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Terry summed up most of what I would say, but I'll put in my 2 cents.

If going Carbotech, just start with XP12s up front and XP10s in the rear. Other than a slight increase in cost, I can't see a disadvantage in doing this. In my experience, which is roughly 4000 track miles in 9 different cars, Carbotechs are usually great but simply don't last very long once you get comfortable driving the car at 10/10ths (and using the brakes accordingly). Starting with more aggressive compounds seems to help this somewhat. And all of their compounds (up to XP12 at least) are fine on the street; it takes a few feet to get some heat in them, and on cold days maybe a few more, but if it weren't for the noise one could drive them year-round with no issues provided you're not threshold braking up to stop signs on a cold morning.

I've had good luck with Hawk DTC-60s. I like the feel of the Carbotechs a little better (more progressive vs. being on-off), but the Hawks seem to last longer for me. Have not done scientific comparisons (same car, same conditions, same track, etc.), but over time you get a feel for longevity and I would surmise that the Hawks have notably more of it. I was a Carbotech dealer for a few years and had a good relationship with them until my company went bust (I still personally have a fine relationship with them too, just to be clear), so I'd certainly encourage people to try their products. I've just also had good experience with Hawk.

To the point, unless you are a noob I wouldn't bother tracking the car on OEM pads or fluid. It just leads to sadness and despair when you really start building up speed and then get held back by brake issues. On a track day for us non-competing types, to get the most out of it for your own driving benefit, you want to be able to focus on driving; proper line, heel-toe, trail-braking, etc. You don't want to be driving around some handicap that the car has. And the single biggest problem with the majority of street cars on track (assuming they at least have decent summer tires already) is brakes. Getting those squared away with real track pads and good fluid (heartily endorse Motul RBF600; just great stuff) goes a long way toward a track day being fun instead of frustrating.
 

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