* Oil pump worth the upgrade along with lockouts. *

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

NjsGT said:
For your bold print question... I asked JimIII from JDM the same question... Heres his response, word for word

"If the timing marks were off and you spun it over by hand there is a good chance you would still have clearance. If the valves hit you would feel it. The difference however with a running motor is the VCT is operating, now if the cams went into full retard or advance its posssible the valves would touch."
Most likly you cant hit the pistons just by turning the motor over by hand, again the 6 oclock crank position makes sure of this.... I only pulled my rockers for a piece of mind knowing there was no way that I hit pistons..... Just me being paranoid

How did you remove the rockers? Tool?

Scared of the release of the cams moving so much to hit the valves without removing the rockers. Then getting them back to put the chains back on with tension. But if there is no chance of the valves coming close this would be the way to do it. I guess if the marks are correct crank and sprocket there is no chance it is timed wrong.

NjsGT · Jun 4, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
How did you remove the rockers? Tool?

Scared of the release of the cams moving so much to hit the valves without removing the rockers. Then getting them back to put the chains back on with tension. But if there is no chance of the valves coming close this would be the way to do it. I guess if the marks are correct crank and sprocket there is no chance it is timed wrong.

Valve spring compresser. I got mine from freedom custom tools right off the forum..... compresser the spring, then just remove the rocker, it pops right up.... If you do this, YOU HAVE TO MARK ALL THE ROCKERS! THEY HAVE TO GO BACK EXACTLY THE WAY THEY CAME OUT.....

Exactly, just make sure you have all the slack taken up on the straight chain guide side, then adjust the cam sprocket to the timing mark on the chain.... Your tensioner will take up whatever slack is left

Corpo · Jun 4, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
So will the motor be at TDC when the crank mark is at 6 o'clock position and the phaser will be at the 11 o'clock and 12 o'clock position? Yes

If I loosen up the cam bolts with the chains connected on and then slowly release the tensioners on the guides. Make sure the car is in gear then loosen the phaser bolts. And there is two bolts holding the tensioner. Loosen both, wiggle it to make sure the oring is free. Then remove one bolt, just pull it out. Let er buck. The chains should start to release and the cams is going to release and jump the chain at some point on bothsides one side at at time the scary part. Will the valves hit the pistons by any chance at all? How much movement will there be? I suppose there is a chance but I highly doubt it. The movement isnt substancial. The valves that want to be open will jump toward more open, and the closed ones will want to jump more closed. In my theory. Like I mean the valves that are closed on the piston that is in full compression aren't gonna jump open in to contact

Then replace the pump and install the lockouts. Start by running the chains to the phasers. Assemble one side at a time, driver side first They are not going to line up due to the release of the cams and the tension when released during taken them off. The will line up closer then you think Do I just get a socket on the cam bolt and move the cam until it lines back up with help of a friend to the marks on the chain? You can rotate the engine a few degree's back and forth as well, just use the transmission to hold it in place. the drivers side is easy Then release the pins in the tensioner to keep it in place and then the other side? After the drivers side is timed pull the pin. Double check the timing marks! Then do the passenger side you will have to turn the engine backwards a few degrees and the cam forward a few degrees to get the chain in place. When the marks are lined up, pull the pin. Double check the timing marks! Mark the engine builder at jdm does it this way, this is based off his advice when I did my heads

Another question comes up with this. How do I keep the cam bolt from getting over torqued if there is alot of tension on the cam, or not a issue? Mark uses this method while the phaser bolts are torqued. Do I torque the cams bolts to the correct spec once everything is lined up and installed by hold the crank with a ratchet or putting the car into gear? Have the car in gear with the park brake on.

see above

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

NjsGT said:
Valve spring compresser. I got mine from freedom custom tools right off the forum..... compresser the spring, then just remove the rocker, it pops right up.... If you do this, YOU HAVE TO MARK ALL THE ROCKERS! THEY HAVE TO GO BACK EXACTLY THE WAY THEY CAME OUT.....

Exactly, just make sure you have all the slack taken up on the straight chain guide side, then adjust the cam sprocket to the timing mark on the chain.... Your tensioner will take up whatever slack is left

Yeah I would like to keep from removing all the rockers and buying a tool to do it one time, I hope.

So just move the sprocket to line up with the marks on the chain. Not enought tension on the cams to make impossible to get lined up or move with a ratchet on the cam bolts.

Thanks for all your help!!! :beerchug2:

Corpo · Jun 4, 2011

Did I mention you can reuse your arp crank bolt? Torque is 100ft/lb

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

Corpo said:
Did I mention you can reuse your arp crank bolt? Torque is 100ft/lb

Cool, Thanks.

Corpo said:
I suppose there is a chance but I highly doubt it. The movement isnt substancial. The valves that want to be open will jump toward more open, and the closed ones will want to jump more closed. In my theory. Like I mean the valves that are closed on the piston that is in full compression aren't gonna jump open in to contact

I think I understand what you are saying. As long as the movment of the crank is not messed with, pistons up and down no clearance problems. The valves are not going to a position of open when the cam is released, it will be going to the position of rest or least resistance which is closed.

Corpo · Jun 4, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
Yeah I would like to keep from removing all the rockers and buying a tool to do it one time, I hope.

So just move the sprocket to line up with the marks on the chain. Not enought tension on the cams to make impossible to get lined up or move with a ratchet on the cam bolts.

Thanks for all your help!!!

Just break the phaser bolts before you pull timing components on removal. The nature of the cams is when the engine turns, as one set of valves is getting opened, one is also pushing to close. So technically it's not any harder for the crank to turn if you have huge springs installed. They cancel eachother out. So it should never be impossible to turn the engine over by the crank bolt.

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

Corpo said:
Just break the phaser bolts before you pull timing components on removal. The nature of the cams is when the engine turns, as one set of valves is getting opened, one is also pushing to close. So technically it's not any harder for the crank to turn if you have huge springs installed. They cancel eachother out. So it should never be impossible to turn the engine over by the crank bolt.

Gotcha, makes sense.

Then just torque the cam bolts to spec once everything is back on and lined up with car in gear?

Corpo · Jun 4, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
Gotcha, makes sense.

Then just torque the cam bolts to spec once everything is back on and lined up with car in gear?

That's what I did

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

Corpo said:
That's what I did

Cool.

Now just got to get out there to do it and hope nothing gets broke in the process.

Pike2244 · Jun 4, 2011

You'll be good... Let us know how it goes!!!!

Corpo · Jun 4, 2011

After your done you will wish you did the whole install yourself, lol. Save a pile in shop labor. I mean beside building the short block and machine shop work.

SherrodMustang · Jun 4, 2011

Pike2244 said:
You'll be fine... Let us know how it goes!!!!

Will do! Thanks for all your help.

Corpo said:
After your done you will wish you did the whole install yourself, lol. Save a pile in shop labor. I mean beside building the short block and machine shop work.

Yeah, probably so.

SherrodMustang · Jun 5, 2011

Really good video of a how to on installing cams.

At 2:25 into the video he release the cams from the VCT sprocket and you can see the cams release to a rest position. The cam moves a little bit very quickly from the tension placed on them from the followers.

It gave me some insight on my scare of releasing the cams from the tension placed by the followers and letting them buck or release. What is the difference in letting them go with the VCT sprocket on, I would imagine nothing. They do it all the time to swap cams.

silverpoison · Jun 5, 2011

Melling oil pump with billet gears and lockouts!

GI Joe · Jun 5, 2011

in that video where he says as a last resort grab the cam with a pair of pliers.....(LOL) well that what I made the tool for...here it is..

SherrodMustang · Jun 5, 2011

GI Joe said:
in that video where he says as a last resort grab the cam with a pair of pliers.....(LOL) well that what I made the tool for...here it is..

LOL... I heard that. Rag and pliers to turn the camshaft to line up with the key way of the sprocket at last resort.

Still think it is the best uninstall the followers first. Will I need a spring compressor to do this?

The video shows the cam being relesed to rest on it own tension. Would be the same if I just released the tension for the tensioner guides and let it jump to rest and then just moved the sprockets back with alittle force from a extra set of hands to line it back up and release the new tensioners on it to hold it.

GI Joe · Jun 5, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
LOL... I heard that. Rag and pliers to turn the camshaft to line up with the key way of the sprocket at last resort.

Still think it is the best uninstall the followers first. Will I need a spring compressor to do this?

The video shows the cam being relesed to rest on it own tension. Would be the same if I just released the tension for the tensioner guides and let it jump to rest and then just moved the sprockets back with alittle force from a extra set of hands to line it back up and release the new tensioners on it.

and pulling the cam tower caps into place against the load of 12 valve springs :roflmao:

SherrodMustang · Jun 5, 2011

GI Joe said:
and pulling the cam tower caps into place against the load of 12 valve springs

Taken it is not possible to do as in the video made it out?

GI Joe · Jun 5, 2011

SherrodMustang said:
Taken it is not possible to do as in the video made it out?

just like with the "pliers on the cam" there are ways to do things that can and have worked and then there are those who have horror stories because they tried them. NO Thats not the proper way to remove or install the caps and cams. And he may be a mechanic and do it all the time but it is dangerous. There is a risk of stripping the threads in a cam tower. Them you get to remove the head or try to retap it there. I'll just say this because its certainly open to argument....All the professional shops I know and have dealt with since 1996 when I bought my first modular say its a NO NO. I think they kinda acknowledge that in the video..

*** Oil pump worth the upgrade along with lockouts. ***

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* Oil pump worth the upgrade along with lockouts. *