BBB Winter Build - KISS or...

[BruceH]

Very nice. I'm sure you love it. That's enough power to keep things fun imo. Believe it or not the HP is more than a stock Terminator made and pretty close to what a stock 2007 GT500 put down.

You are doing it all n/a and don't have all the extra parts hanging off the motor. It will respond well to forced induction should you feel like cranking it up.

 

[Boone]

Bruce, I really want to thank you for sharing your knowledge and experiences with the forum. For the record, it was 702GT that first gave me the idea of a BBB, and your build(s) is(are) what really inspired me to go this route.

As a matter of fact... I love all you guys!!!! It's so much easier to pull the trigger on an improvement when someone has already been there, done that, and took the time to share their experiences with a bunch of people they've never seen before. Now this is what Al Gore had in mind!

It's pretty obvious... I'm enjoying my car.

 

[Sky Render]

I love that color.

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[Boone]

I love that color.

Lots of people are surprised to learn the Legend Lime is a factory color ('05 and '06 only). The black top half makes the whole paint job look custom. Even the non-Mustang crowd likes how it looks, but most people say it's just too loud for them. I get it. I waffle back and forth on the major noise level. May get an X-Force Varex to dial it up or down with a remote.

 

[swflastang05]

congrats, well done!

 

[Boone]

Just finished up my first autocross today. I'm not real thrilled with the results - third of five in CAM on a tight and technical course. I believe I'm going to be addicted to the cones in the future, though. It's the competition. It's nothing like an HPDE where there aren't any official times. This is I BEAT you, or you BEAT me, and I don't like losing!! My son even beat me in PAX with his 2002 GTI. This definitely can't happen!! (Proud Papa, though).

I'm not planning to make any changes to the suspension until I learn to hit the lines with pace consistently. I will be getting a new set of tires next spring though. The Invos on the car are several years old, and they set out last winter during the motor build. Neither end of the car will plant now. I'll have to decide whether to put NT01's on an alternate set of 11" wide wheels for the road course and get a better set of 200TW tires for the 9.5" rims, or visa versa. I'm not sure I want my "around town" tires to be 315-18 on all four corners. If I wasn't so competitive, I'd just keep enjoying running courses on these ice skates.

The motor, btw, was totally on point. Top speed on the course was around 48 mph (per Harry's Lap Timer), which made good use of 2nd gear on the 3650 with 4.10's. Driver induced oversteer was always available, and it was a little too prevalent. Sure was fun though.

 

[Sky Render]

RE-71Rs.

RE-71Rs.

RE-71Rs.

 

[BruceH]

Just finished up my first autocross today. I'm not real thrilled with the results - third of five in CAM on a tight and technical course. I believe I'm going to be addicted to the cones in the future, though. It's the competition. It's nothing like an HPDE where there aren't any official times. This is I BEAT you, or you BEAT me, and I don't like losing!! My son even beat me in PAX with his 2002 GTI. This definitely can't happen!! (Proud Papa, though).

I'm not planning to make any changes to the suspension until I learn to hit the lines with pace consistently. I will be getting a new set of tires next spring though. The Invos on the car are several years old, and they set out last winter during the motor build. Neither end of the car will plant now. I'll have to decide whether to put NT01's on an alternate set of 11" wide wheels for the road course and get a better set of 200TW tires for the 9.5" rims, or visa versa. I'm not sure I want my "around town" tires to be 315-18 on all four corners. If I wasn't so competitive, I'd just keep enjoying running courses on these ice skates.

The motor, btw, was totally on point. Top speed on the course was around 48 mph (per Harry's Lap Timer), which made good use of 2nd gear on the 3650 with 4.10's. Driver induced oversteer was always available, and it was a little too prevalent. Sure was fun though.

I'm going to guess that having a large percentage of power available without having to spin the motor to max rpms is an advantage. Your motor has a nice wide powerband.

 

[Boone]

RE-71R

I'm already leaning that way. What kind of life expectancy can I get with the RE-71R? I'm going to put 2K miles around town and 7 autocrosses per year. Garaged in the wintertime, and I'm planning to do separate wheels and tires for HPDE's.

Will the RE-71R stand up to a weekend at VIR until I get the track tire setup over the winter? I know they are autocross Nirvana, but what about HPDE use? I'm trying to decide whether to throw in the towel on the Invos now.

 

[Sky Render]

You don't want to use RE-71R on the street. Get a second set of wheels for autocross and track use and keep the Nittos for the street.

 

[Boone]

You don't want to use RE-71R on the street.

Then I may need to reconsider. If I go with the dedicated autoX and HPDE tires on separate rims, which I like the idea of so I can roll up the street miles and not cut into my performance tire lifetime. I'll need to go with 200TW for CAM requirements.

Oh God, this is becoming a "what tire" thread... OK... Circle one... Suggestions?!?!?!

Rims - Forgestar CF5 Deep Concave 18x11 with 52mm offsets:

315/30/18 (All 200TW unless noted)
Falken Azenis RT615K
BFG Rival S
Michelin Pilot Sport PS2 (220TW)

305/30/18 and 305/35/18
None
Nothing
Nada

295/35/18 (All 200TW unless noted)
Nitto NT05
Michilin Pilot Sport PS2 (220TW)
Toyo Proxes 1 (240TW)
Nitto Invo (260TW)
Michilin Pilot Super Sport (300TW)
Conti ExtremeContact DW (340TW)
Bridgeston Potenza RE760 Sport (340TW)

Rims - Forgestar CF5 Deep Concave 19x11 with 52mm offsets:

315/30/19
None
Nothing
Nada

305/30/19 (All 200TW unless noted)
Bridgeston Potenza RE-71R
Khumo ECSTA V720
Hankook Ventus R-S3 V2
Bridgestone Potenza RE-11
Michilin Pilot Sport PS2 (220TW)
Nitto Invo (220TW)
Khumo ECSTA PS91 (260TW)
Bridgestone Potenza S-04 Pole Position (280TW)
Michilin Pilot Super Sport (300TW)
Hankook Ventus V12 EVO2 (320TW)
Nitto Invo (220TW)
Conti ExtremeContact DW (340 TW)

295/30/19 (All 200TW unless noted)
Michilin Pilot Sport PS2 (220TW)
Khumo ECSTA PS91 (260TW)
Conti ContiSportContact 3 (280TW)
Bridgestone Potenza S-04 Pole Position (280TW)
Michilin Pilot Super Sport (300TW)
Hankook Ventus V12 EVO2 (320TW)

295/35/19 (All 200TW unless noted)
Yokoham Advan Sport V105 (240TW)
Michilin Pilot Super Sport (300TW)

I pulled these from Tire Rack and DiscountTireDirect, so no promises on availability. It would appear my best selection is in the 305/30/19 size which includes the aforementioned RE-71R and the budget friendly V720.

 

[Boone]

I caved in and put MBRP Stainless Steel axle backs on the car this week. Picked them up from an S197 member. Unfortunately, the hangers on my car were modified previously, so the install ended up at a Meineke shop after I disassembled and bagged everything. Looks good, but the mufflers don't help much at idle and startup as I'd hoped. They do seriously reduce the volume at cruise and WOT, which is a bit of a bummer. I guess that's all OK since I'm going to be 50 soon. Gotta' grow up sometime.

I'm having trouble pulling the trigger on wheels because of the 19" choice. I could save a few hundred and get the RTR Tech 7 wheels (10 1/2") from AM, but I like the look of the CF5's in silver (11"). Either will be able to handle the 305/30 tires.

 

[Sky Render]

Why 19s?

 

[Boone]

I want to run 200TW tires for CAM, and I figured I'd use the same set for HPDES. See my previous post for tire availability. Much better selection in 19s. I know that's not the norm, so I'm hesitant to drop $2800 on a wheel and tire setup.

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[Sky Render]

I don't think the selection is really any better for 19s. The tires you'll want to use are available in 18s, and they're cheaper in that size.

Don't try to reinvent the wheel. Look at others' builds.

 

[Boone]

Don't try to reinvent the wheel.

I hope the pun is not lost an any of us here.

My research of 200TW tires shows one 18" tire in 295/35 and two in 315/30. I don't really want the Rival S since all accounts show it to wear brutally fast and heat up quickly on a road course.

My research of 200TW tires shows four 19" tires in 305/30. One of which is the RE-71R that you recommended.

I don't want to put my car (or me) on a diet. I want the most meat I can put under the stock fenders. Whether it is 18" or 19" wheels is of no concern to me. With all the new performance Mustangs coming out with 19" wheels, I would think the selection would only continue to improve in this size.

I can see 18" wheels coming in handy for guys using stickier rubber (<200TW) for road courses and the "used slicks" crowd. I just don't see any advantage for what I'm planning to do, which is stay CAM legal and enjoy 2 or 3 HPDEs per year.

I guess I am trying to reinvent the wheel. The same as when someone put 18's instead of 17's on a performance Mustang. This is all about tire selection for me. Not "stance" or "looks" or anything aesthetic. Someone point me to some options I don't know about, and I'll gladly reconsider. Show me the light, and I'll do my best John Belushi doing back handsprings down the church aisle.

 

[Sky Render]

I use 275s...

 

[Boone]

Went to VIR over the weekend. After a day and a half shaking off the dust and tidying up a few corners, I got down to business and managed to lower my PB by 1.8 seconds.

Water temps were getting up around 240 and oil temps were around 250 when pushing hard. Air temp was 90, and it was humid. Dan at Pro Dyno is going to look at adding a little more fuel at the top end to keep temps down a bit.

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[Sky Render]

Oil temps at 250 are fine. You might need a bigger radiator, though, because those coolant temps are pretty high.

 

[Boone]

To further quantify my water temp concerns at VIR Full this past weekend, I had water temps peak at 240 degrees F, and recover to 220 degrees during the a lap. My cooling system is working well based on a 240 degree to 200 degree drop in the 2 mile cool down with 2:45 seconds elapsing. All data is from an OBD adapter charted with Harry's Lap Timer, so I'm looking at a chart, not just brief glances on track.



I have a Meziere 55 gpm electric water pump on my 5.3L BBB. The radiator is a Mishimoto performance aluminum radiator (3 row, 2.05" thick).

Does this appear to be a flow problem? Do I need more than the 55 gpm during peak power output?

Should I look at additives for the antifreeze? I believe my builder (Pro Dyno) used 100% antifreeze. Should I drain the system and go with a 50/50 mix to lower the viscosity and increase the flow rate?

I have a cowl hood. Could airflow be going stagnant over 100 mph? Do I need to add hood vents? I wouldn't think this is the issue since the rise is linear.

Any advise would be appreciated.