Just bought 2012 GT, looking to add a blower

[Turbo 6]

Took delivery of an A6 base GT this past Friday. I've been seeing these 5.0's and "secretly" liking them. I'm from the GM camp, mainly campaigning GN's for the past 15 years (hence the screen name). Having gotten bored with those, I moved on to the LS scene, no fun there. Back into a GN for a while, got bored again. Tried my hand at some AMG performance (that was real easy).
After wanting a 5.0 for a while, especially after seeing what they do with little mods, I decide to pull the trigger and get one. Overall it's a very nice car, by far better than the competition.
Now on to my questions:

I'm looking to somewhat duplicate the times the ST (red A6 with KB blower) car ran. That test car alone has me pretty much sold on the Kenne Bell. Does anyone have results with an otherwise stock auto and a centrifugal blower? Can anyone give me some data on the FRPP, Roush, ect?

What would you guys suggest is the best way to make reliable power? I'm open to doing the normal bolt on's and keeping it NA, but that should cost around $5k, or I could put a blower on it, mount some tires and run 10's all day.
Thanks for any help!

 

[96blowncobra]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYX_0YjvGS0
blowers are so much more fun then tinkering with bolt ons.... quick easy power and you dont loose realiability.

 

[chuck@evoperform]

You could do the FRPP kit, and run 9's.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=siqUezuWSyE&feature=player_embedded#at=30

Lots of other ways you could go about it.

 

[r.barn]

Kenne Bell

 

[KJGT]

My last couple cars were LS as well (8.90 and 9.20 firebirds), after 10 years and 7 LS f-bodies I cant even look at a 4th gen f-body anymore lol.

I went the roush/TVS route on my 2011 auto. I liked the OE look and fit of everything, except for the timing cover grinding it was a simple install. The grinding wasnt hard, it was just something that you cant hide if you put the car back stock. The FRPP uses the same drive so same grinding.

Any of the PD blowers should run about the same, I am more than happy with the TVS/VMP tune. VMPs car runs very well and thats what made my decision to the roush/tvs. Bolted the blower on with 1200 miles on the car, loaded the tune, some 18" DRs on stock wheels, rear springs, took out the spare and ran 10.83 @ 127.5 the first time out.

I drive the car every day and it is one fun car to drive, plus the 2.3 tvs is capable of putting the car in the low 10s/high 9s with some headers, drag wheels, pulley swap etc so it has some room to grow.

I was going to do headers, converter, drag wheels/tires, sway bar delete, light battery, intake, tune etc and try to run low 11s but after adding everything up it wasnt cheap. Plus its not exactly driving like stock anymore.

Lots of choices out there and most of them work well, hard to make a decision for sure..

 

[r.barn]

I went the roush/TVS route on my 2011 auto. I liked the OE look and fit of everything,

Thats a nice feature to me as well

------

I like the KB the most for couple of reasons.

1. Liquid cooling. Heat soak is a problem for all PD blowers. Not sure its really good for any power but I would think long term the blower will like operating with 200 degree oil instead of 400+ degree. It just makes a ton of sense to me.

2. The KB basically has unlimited growth potential with nothing but pulley swaps. The higher the hp levels the more you would start to see it pulling away from the TVS and Whipple running same psi levels or making same psi on a bigger pulley. But I'm talking north of 750rwhp levels.

3. The KB has the largest intercooler in the intake manifold out of the 3. Getting that heat out is critical.

4. KB has a billet case and is just an all around stronger unit.

5. KB comes with mammoth rear inlet. Again a huge plus if you ever want to get nuts with the power levels.




I really like the power levels people are putting down with Prochargers too, but cant stand that whistle at idle they make.

 

[chuck@evoperform]

Unless KB redesigned the intercooler since I saw one last, the FRPP or Roush kits come with a much larger intercooler.

 

[r.barn]

Unless KB redesigned the intercooler since I saw one last, the FRPP or Roush kits come with a much larger intercooler.

hmmmm, good to know. They did increase core size with this 5.0 unit over cores they used in previous mod-motor systems.

See if I can find the pic...... artcl says " KB really took advantage of the coyote's deeper valley and no center mount alternator to increase intercooler size "

 

[chuck@evoperform]

I'm a dumbass. It's late and I got my terminology mixxed up. I meant heat exchanger. Sorry bout that.

 

[r.barn]

I'm a dumbass. It's late and I got my terminology mixxed up. I meant heat exchanger. Sorry bout that.

I'm pretty much sold on using a Killer Chiller and a large reservoir and no HE, if I go PD, myself.

And KB did add a gigantic heat exchanger to this new kit too.

 

[SilentScope]

Unless KB redesigned the intercooler since I saw one last, the FRPP or Roush kits come with a much larger intercooler.

bigger isnt always better. pump flow rate, transfer efficiency etc all comes into play.

 

[chuck@evoperform]

This is the heat exchanger used in the FRPP/Roush kits, minus the fan and coolant resevoir. It is almost the same dimensions as the radiator.

Oh, and its shown upside down in the pic for some reason.

 

[KJGT]

Thats a nice feature to me as well

------

I like the KB the most for couple of reasons.

1. Liquid cooling. Heat soak is a problem for all PD blowers. Not sure its really good for any power but I would think long term the blower will like operating with 200 degree oil instead of 400+ degree. It just makes a ton of sense to me.

2. The KB basically has unlimited growth potential with nothing but pulley swaps. The higher the hp levels the more you would start to see it pulling away from the TVS and Whipple running same psi levels or making same psi on a bigger pulley. But I'm talking north of 750rwhp levels.

3. The KB has the largest intercooler in the intake manifold out of the 3. Getting that heat out is critical.

4. KB has a billet case and is just an all around stronger unit.

5. KB comes with mammoth rear inlet. Again a huge plus if you ever want to get nuts with the power levels.




I really like the power levels people are putting down with Prochargers too, but cant stand that whistle at idle they make.

The helical gear prochargers are pretty quiet, I dont think thats offered on anything larger than a D1SC though.

I didnt care for blowing a hole in the inner fender for the KB intake, thats one of the reasons I DIDNT choose the KB. Sure it works at higher power levels but a bit of overkill for what I wanted.

9 second potential at nearly stock weight is all the room to grow I'd need and the TVS will do it. Quicker than that and I'd get back into a F1+ procharger or turbo.

At 9psi or less I dont think a larger IC will make that much of a difference, so far the downstream IATs look pretty good at 7.5psi with the TVS.

Like I said there are a lot of good choices out there, not trying to say the TVS is better than the KB (or anything else for that matter). But for me its doing exactly what I wanted. At 5-6K a pop I'm not going to try every PD blower and verify claims of bigger this or that

 

[SilentScope]

just buy a twin turbo kit and call it a day.

/end thread.

 

[r.barn]

Agreed, same thing has me on the fence on what to pull the trigger on. I know I dont EVER need more than 9-10 psi so why worry about having a blower that will do 20psi if needed ........

and the "hole in the fender" is a bit of a misconception. All you do is trim about 2 inches off a couple of lips inside the fender well and it goes thru an existing factory hole and down into the front bumper.

just buy a twin turbo kit and call it a day.

/end thread.

I'm a big turbo nut, and other than a rear mount system there is just no "good" place to mount a turbo on these cars. This engine bay and underbody are crazy tight on space. I've seen one kit with them down by the trans and thats not a great place to put them.

 

[SilentScope]

I'm a big turbo nut, and other than a rear mount system there is just no "good" place to mount a turbo on these cars. This engine bay and underbody are crazy tight on space. I've seen one kit with them down by the trans and thats not a great place to put them.

The rear mount turbos are shit.

IDK about the 10+ mustangs, but i know of a particular TT system that mounts right next to the trans...

 

[r.barn]

The rear mount turbos are shit.

IDK about the 10+ mustangs, but i know of a particular TT system that mounts right next to the trans...

Exactly, rear mounts suck.

There is room for the turbos down next the trans but there is no room to run a intake hose up front so you dont have to put little dinky airfilters on the bottom of the car. Unacceptable in my book. I'm waiting for the BMR tublar k-member to come out and see how much room it opens up under there before calling the idea dead.

I'd be all for building a set of compact Schd 40 stainless headers and hanging a pair of turbos down there, but it's gonna be tough to do "right" for trouble free long term use. Only way I would do it is if I could run some air intake hoses up to the front bumper.

 

[SilentScope]

Exactly, rear mounts suck.

There is room for the turbos down next the trans but there is no room to run a intake hose up front so you dont have to put little dinky airfilters on the bottom of the car. Unacceptable in my book. I'm waiting for the BMR tublar k-member to come out and see how much room it opens up under there before calling the idea dead.

I'd be all for building a set of compact Schd 40 stainless headers and hanging a pair of turbos down there, but it's gonna be tough to do "right" for trouble free long term use. Only way I would do it is if I could run some air intake hoses up to the front bumper.

at this time, TT is a difficult option for you.
Wait a few months and see what gets developed. Set a "deadline" say 6 months, If nothing is out by then, you will have had plenty time to decide firmly on a blower.

 

[r.barn]

at this time, TT is a difficult option for you.
Wait a few months and see what gets developed. Set a "deadline" say 6 months, If nothing is out by then, you will have had plenty time to decide firmly on a blower.

I would develop my own kit. Ive put the car up on the lift and measured and scratched my head and there is just flat out nowhere to put the turbos that I would find an acceptable location. I actually have to take my hat off to the 2 or 3 kits that are out already, for them being able to squeeze that piping in there. I dont really like how they did it on any of them, but I understand why they were forced to do what they did though.

Again, need the BMR tubular k-member to come out and see how much room it opens up down there.

 

[KJGT]

Agreed, same thing has me on the fence on what to pull the trigger on. I know I dont EVER need more than 9-10 psi so why worry about having a blower that will do 20psi if needed ........

and the "hole in the fender" is a bit of a misconception. All you do is trim about 2 inches off a couple of lips inside the fender well and it goes thru an existing factory hole and down into the front bumper.

I never seen the instructions or a car with the KB on it person, just by looking at the inlet it appeared there needed to be a good sized hole cut under where the stock airbox is. The only existing hole is on the vertical part of the inner fender up kid of high. Its kind of moot anyhow, Roush/FRPP you have to grind the timing cover, KB needs to cut some sheet metal.

Like I said its hard to go wrong with any of them, it took me a month to make a decision on what to do have a nice low 11/high 10 second daily driver with the least amount of other mods that impact the way the car drives every day. The car I seen out there getting it done was VMPs so I went that route, I honestly didnt think it was possible to run 10s with so little mods besides the blower but its for real. Granted I ran mine in exceptional weather (-500 DA) but it still ran what it ran..