Saleen SC still a good idea?

[Enitalp]

#1 on my mod list (with a new trans)

 

[95PGTech]

Hey Chris, I love my Saleen, but like many others, 10-11s 1/4 satisfy us for only a short time and then we want to go faster! With my stroker, a Saleen SC just won't get me where I dream to go! Just bringing up the point that if there is any chance that someone wants better 1/4 times, than another system is a better choice IMO.

we've gone 9.85 on a full weight street car, 10.05 and chuggin' this season (the car is not legal to go 9s in competition). if we wanted to enter a real race class and get 500 lbs. out of the car, how much faster do you want to go?

At some point, you're going to have to give up weight. The solution to going faster by simply adding bigger turbos and more power has its drawbacks. At some point, you're going to have a 4000lb., 1000HP street car because you're hellbent on keeping the interior in it and you won't be able to keep it held together.

IMO the Saleen blower is perfect for racing in that it goes fast on a little power, which means very little stress on your parts. I'd rather go 10.05s with 620whp than 10.05s with 800whp because I know I'll be able to keep a trans in the car and it's a lot less stress on the chassis and suspension. If you really want to go much faster than the high 9s we've been able to achieve, you're going to have to give up the street car status, largely because of the need to ditch weight, but also the safety certifications required for going that fast. You start to question your streetability and why you have an interior in the car when you have one seat and a funny car cage and a window net.

ken - it stayed there for quite some time until guys like Justin came along with monsters, lol. that car is impressive (catch his interview in race pages). we take pride in setting up cars that our customers can turn-key take to NMRA and FFW events and be competitive with - if we broke down the ET list based on class restrictions, I bet you'd find a host of street-car and entry level bracket racing absolutely dominated by Saleen blown cars.







Everyone has their , but mine is that if you want to go FAST and you don't care about some dyno graph to show some dorks you don't know at a car show, and you want something you can walk outside, crank right over, drive to work and never know it's not stock and not be having to fix week in and week out, the Saleen blower is your choice. It goes fast for relatively cheap and insanely reliable. For me, that's the perfect blower for my needs, I wish there was a way to swap one onto my SN95 without having to do heads, cams, front dress.

 

[PNR Welding]

Also another JDM car here. I went a 10.84 and a 10.86 last night and then drove the car home. Not too many cars doing that. Weight without me in it is 3525.

 

[akula52]

good points

Chris, you make some good points and I agree tha HP is not everything and who wouldn't want to go fast with less hp. I did not realize that if you go to a car show, you are suspose to bring a dyno graph? If I ever go to one (with all the dorks), should I have it blown up to poster board size?

P.S. I wonder what car would win; say a powerhouse turbo vs. Saleen SC, both with 10# of boost and the cars are the same weight with identical suspension/tires. It would be interesting don't you think?

 

[95PGTech]

That's a rule at the car show, show off your 303whp dyno for your 05MGT with K&N intake and flash tune and catback with your 400lbs. of painted and chrome accessories on the car.


To make it fair, both cars couldn't be the same. The converters on both cars and the gear/tire selection would have to be different. You'd need a tall (3.31) gear on the turbo car to really load the snail up. Also, turbo selection would be huge. A GT30R car at 10psi for example would make a lot different powerband than a GT42R car. Not only what cfm that snail moves at 10psi, but what kind of cfm it moves up to the point of spooling 10psi.

It would be interesting though, it'd be close. The Saleen car would hit the tires hard and get out a few cars but the turbo car would have the backhalf. It really doesn't matter what form of racing you are in, what kind of car you buy, how you make your power, using quality parts and the people setting the car up and doing the tuning are far more important to the outcome.

 

[jymontoya]

I've been reading and watching a little bit more.... DOH!

Now I'm really really concerned the Saleen is too whiny!

My DD is a 2005 Mini Cooper S with an upgraded S/C pulley and intake, and I have long grown tired of the whine that once fascinated me.

Is there a twin-screw that I'd barely hear over our Bullitt with ARH LT's and off road H ???

Should I consider the Paxton, or Vortech?

 

[95PGTech]

The centris are louder in my opinion.
The Cooper has the typical stock blower pullied really hard screaming super loud sound.

It all depends what pulley you run on the Saleen S/C, what your exhaust is like, etc. We have customers that sound like N/A cars and some that sound like KB Cobras.

 

[don_w]

My 2.4L KB is quieter than any other supercharger I have heard.

 

[Deviant]

I have a saleen 475hp kit that i am about to put up for sale. It is brand new in the box and i am going to be asking $4500 ($4600 Shipped). Traded in my mustang for a tahoe and i have no use for this now.

Austin

 

[PNR Welding]

I wish I could hear my whine on my car. I cant hear it at all. Ever since I put the headers on I cant hear it, every once in a while I might think I hear it.

 

[jymontoya]

The centris are louder in my opinion.
The Cooper has the typical stock blower pullied really hard screaming super loud sound.

It all depends what pulley you run on the Saleen S/C, what your exhaust is like, etc. We have customers that sound like N/A cars and some that sound like KB Cobras.

Do you have any video of a N/A sounding Saleen equipped car?

I'm talking about keeping the default 475 kit and pulley....

 

[jymontoya]

I wish I could hear my whine on my car. I cant hear it at all. Ever since I put the headers on I cant hear it, every once in a while I might think I hear it.

What's your header and exhaust setup?

 

[95PGTech]

Kooks long tubes almost completely eliminate the sound on any car, not to mention pick up about 25 at the wheels on our dyno.

 

[Al Guapo]

We have full weight street cars going mid tens with 480whp. Other blowers and turbos are taking mid 600s HP to get there.

How?

Do the other blower and turbo cars have the same suspension?

What were the trap speeds?

Were they all manuals or autos?

Just wanted to know if you're comparing apples to apples. Thanks.

 

[95PGTech]

How?

Do the other blower and turbo cars have the same suspension?

What were the trap speeds?

Were they all manuals or autos?

Just wanted to know if you're comparing apples to apples. Thanks.

a turbo to P/D T/S isn't an apple-apple as I pointed above.

againstallodds1 is a perfect example of a JDM stock motor 10 second car.
Many are well under 500whp.


ALL are full weight street cars.
ALL are automatics.
ALL use off-the-shelf suspension parts and torque converters.
One has a trans brake - most do not.

 

[Al Guapo]

a turbo to P/D T/S isn't an apple-apple as I pointed above.

againstallodds1 is a perfect example of a JDM stock motor 10 second car.
Many are well under 500whp.


ALL are full weight street cars.
ALL are automatics.
ALL use off-the-shelf suspension parts and torque converters.
One has a trans brake - most do not.

I meant apples to apples as far as suspension, weight, trans and boost.
Were they all running the same boost?

 

[94tbird]

my 2.4 never made a peep. my 2.6H loves to whine and i LOVE it

 

[don_w]

I meant apples to apples as far as suspension, weight, trans and boost.
Were they all running the same boost?

I'm not going to speak for Chris, but IMO what your asking for is of no relevance (with the exception of weight). If we assume all of the cars check in between 3500 and 3600 lbs (empty), then obviously there are some significant differences between a <500whp car and a >600whp car if they are running the same ET.

I've always felt that "less is more" when it comes to the power needed to run a given ET. I've seen so many cars with oodles of "peak" horsepower, but can't seen to get better than high 11s (and some even stuck in the 12s). And I've seen cars with much less power, run consistent 10s. Why? Because they have the correct supporting parts in the driveline, chassis/suspension and tires/wheels.

Bottom line is that some guys have dyno sheet goals and some guys have ET goals. Me? I prefer to get the lowest ET possbile using the least amount of power I can. It's just a lot less stressful on all the other parts of the car.

 

[Al Guapo]

I'm not going to speak for Chris, but IMO what your asking for is of no relevance (with the exception of weight). If we assume all of the cars check in between 3500 and 3600 lbs (empty), then obviously there are some significant differences between a <500whp car and a >600whp car if they are running the same ET.

So suspension doesn't help with et?

More boost doesn't help with trap speed?

A manual ETs quicker than a built auto?

And if you see Chris's original post #6 he says 480 RWHP doing more than mid 650ish FWHP. With all cars being the same weight, wouldn't that make the 650ish FWHP faster than a 480RWHP with about 20% drive train loss in an automatic?

If so and so is going XXX et @ XXX MPH I'd just like to know what's making them tick. Not trying to start a thread war here guys. Just looking for the facts.

 

[don_w]

So suspension doesn't help with et?

More boost doesn't help with trap speed?

A manual ETs quicker than a built auto?

And if you see Chris's original post #6 he says 480 RWHP doing more than mid 650ish FWHP. With all cars being the same weight, wouldn't that make the 650ish FWHP faster than a 480RWHP with about 20% drive train loss in an automatic?

If so and so is going XXX et @ XXX MPH I'd just like to know what's making them tick. Not trying to start a thread war here guys. Just looking for the facts.

I don't see where Chris mentioned "FWHP" anyhwere... I'm betting a buck he meant RWHP when he said "HP".

And absolutely suspension matters... that was my point. A 480rwhp car can often kick the ass of a 650rwhp car, if the higher HP car is setup wrong. Happens all the time. People spend a gazillion dollars building a forced induction engine that will look great on a dyno, but then can't even keep up with a well built N/A car on the track.

So what's "making them tick" is the ability to convert the maximum amount energy from the engine into forward motion of the car. It requires that traction, weight transfer, etc. are as optimized as possible. That takes some effort, money and usually some trial and error.

p.s. Oh yea... a manual quicker than an auto??? hahah That's a good one!