Blown Up Motors: Specs on when it blew requested.

[BruceH]

This is for those who have blown their motors. I'm wondering about a few things and if it's not too painful I'd like to know what happened.

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?

3. Stock block or built?

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?

5. Spark advance and a/f?

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere inbetween?

7. What component failed?

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?

Please add any other info you think applies or is needed. I just switched my motor back to gasoline. It's wastegated at 14psi with my 10.76:1 pistons and 15 degrees of spark advance at wot. I've thought of going to 10-12psi but it might stay at 14. FWIW an online boost compression calculator says that my boost/compression ratio combo is about the same as 17psi on stock compression. Gas is 92 octane.

 

[AnotherS197GT]

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?

N/A

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?

Pump, 93 only

3. Stock block or built?

Stock short block. Comp 127500 cams with 26125-24 springs

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?

Stock

5. Spark advance and a/f?

No clue

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere inbetween?

WOT, then normal driving for a few minutes before the car shut off

7. What component failed?

Broken valve spring

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?

No cats

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?

I've only ever run Motorcraft 5W-20

 

[TurboX]

This is for those who have blown their motors. I'm wondering about a few things and if it's not too painful I'd like to know what happened.

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?

Turbo, 19psi,800RWHP

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?

E85

3. Stock block or built?

Built 323 by John Tymenski of Modular Performance

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?

10:1

5. Spark advance and a/f?

18 degrees with 11.6 A/F

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere inbetween?

Left drag strip, had 1 20-150 run on highway. I have to assume that is when it broke. I had no idea anything was wrong, it was all discovered when I took the heads off to be sent for porting.

7. What component failed?

I had both pivoting timing tensioners break into multiple pieces and cracked the crank on number 4 rod journal. After tear down, I was told the crank was walking, it looked like the caps were moving and piston skirts were very worn. Michael@L&M could not say with certainty that the motor was built wrong or guarantee it wouldnt happen again. He told me he feels L&M has a great engine program and they build motors to the strictest tolerances but at 800RWHP anything can happen.

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?

No Cats

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?

No spun bearing but I used Valvoline 5-30 Conventional Racing oil.

Please add any other info you think applies or is needed. I just switched my motor back to gasoline. It's wastegated at 14psi with my 10.76:1 pistons and 15 degrees of spark advance at wot. I've thought of going to 10-12psi but it might stay at 14. FWIW an online boost compression calculator says that my boost/compression ratio combo is about the same as 17psi on stock compression. Gas is 92 octane.

I wish somebody could have given me some better information on what happen, I paid almost $1000 to have this motor shipped to/from TX-PA and have it torn down. I hate not knowing what happen or what could prevent from happening again. New mill is going to be couple hundred more HP and Ive replaced every component hoping to not have same results. While Im hearing that E85 is more forgiving in a tune, the fact that it doesnt show signs of detonation means you are screwed when the tune does go wrong. For this reason, Im still considering going back to pump gas and spraying the shit out of meth to cool the charge.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Please add any other info you think applies or is needed. I just switched my motor back to gasoline. It's wastegated at 14psi with my 10.76:1 pistons and 15 degrees of spark advance at wot. I've thought of going to 10-12psi but it might stay at 14. FWIW an online boost compression calculator says that my boost/compression ratio combo is about the same as 17psi on stock compression. Gas is 92 octane.

Oh just pound on that thing!

My blue car’s motor is nothing special. Just your standard forged bottom end, 9.25:1. I have been kicking it’s ass for a couple of years now with 20psi, bouncing off the rev limiter, running crazy high engine/IAT’s. I did a track day last fall, it was 100deg out and I was running the car for 20min sessions with the IAT’s at 180-200deg and the engine temps in the 240-250deg range!

I change the oil, I beat on it.

 

[striker 5]

Oh just pound on that thing!

My blue car’s motor is nothing special. Just your standard forged bottom end, 9.25:1. I have been kicking it’s ass for a couple of years now with 20psi, bouncing off the rev limiter, running crazy high engine/IAT’s. I did a track day last fall, it was 100deg out and I was running the car for 20min sessions with the IAT’s at 180-200deg and the engine temps in the 240-250deg range!

I change the oil, I beat on it.

self built , shop or ford frpp motor .

 

[Department Of Boost]

self built , shop or ford frpp motor .

DSS bottom end. Self built the rest.

 

[8306gt]

Engine failure

This is for those who have blown their motors. I'm wondering about a few things and if it's not too painful I'd like to know what happened.

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?

Forced induction, Paxton 2200, 17 lbs

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?

93 octane Pump Gas

3. Stock block or built?

Stock

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?

Stock

5. Spark advance and a/f?

14 degrees, 11.6-11.7

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere inbetween?

6900 rpm through the traps on a 10.80 pass

7. What component failed?

2 bent rods slight knock, nothing broke

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?

Long tube headers, off road X-pipe


9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?

Bearings all looked like new

Please add any other info you think applies or is needed. I just switched my motor back to gasoline. It's wastegated at 14psi with my 10.76:1 pistons and 15 degrees of spark advance at wot. I've thought of going to 10-12psi but it might stay at 14. FWIW an online boost compression calculator says that my boost/compression ratio combo is about the same as 17psi on stock compression. Gas is 92 octane.

If you have good rods and pistons I wouldn't worry to much about it of course as you know, there are no guarantees when it comes to this sort of thing. Also I am currently running 21 psi on 93 octane with out issue with 14 degrees.

 

[BruceH]

If you have good rods and pistons I wouldn't worry to much about it of course as you know, there are no guarantees when it comes to this sort of thing. Also I am currently running 21 psi on 93 octane with out issue with 14 degrees.

What's your compression ratio?

I was doing some driving today with gasoline and I'm not going to go less than 14psi for now.

I'm still interested in the raw data associated with blown motors. We all know that everything is important at higher hp and the window for error becomes smaller.

 

[05moneypit]

Well Bruce you had to ask so here it is. I have a bunch of carnage pictures also if you want me to post them also......

All motors have been built with all ARP hardware, OEM head gaskets, Paxton Novi 2200 and Comp 127550 cams and Comp associated hardware, heads have been extensively ported. Manley H beam rods, dynotech long tubes. Always use Clevite bearings, total seal rings and Mobil 1 10w30 oil. Tune has always been race fuel.

Motor #1 (it was a turd)

16PSI boost, 16* max spark. Teksid +.020 Manley -17cc pistons (8.7:1 approx.) Kellogg 3.75 crank. Dynotech cats
Comp limiters for cams

Left bank cam jumped a couple teeth, bent all the exhaust valves.

Motor #1A (also a turd)

Replaced bent exhaust valves and went to livernios lock outs. Ran for a month or so and then went to hell. Found cats had melted and was sucking cat material back into engine. Tore engine down and found cylinders scored and main bearing were in bad shape from bad line bore.

Motor #2(still a turd)

Same Teksid but with a fresh line bore on the crank and cylinders honed. Replaced lock outs with Paschel adjustable cam gears and gutted cats. 2 days after getting back from dyno tune the right bank adjustable failed and bent most of the valves and broke 10 followers.

Motor 2A (polished turd)

Replaced Paschel adjustable gears with a set of steel adjustable units I made myself. Motor ran three months and then lost oil pressure at track. Car was running mid 10's then. Tore it down, spun #2 and 3 main bearing and ruined crank.

Motor #3 (good running motor)

Switched to return fuel system. WAP block. Standard bore (+.002) CP pistons 10.3:1 Kellogg 3.800 crank. Ran a full season at 20psi still max spark of only 17* Car ran a best of 10.23 @ 135. Over winter changed blower belt configuration and got boost up to 25psi at 7200. Spark still at 17* max but turning motor to 7200. Car went 9.76 @ 140 next race we started seeing water in the oil, found block was cracked at bottom of #4 cylinder.

Motor #4

NVH block all the same hardware as above engine, installed the waste gate set-up and boost controller. Engine didn't see more than 15psi.

See this thread for results...

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101666

Motor #5

TBD

 

[retfr8flyr]

This is for those who have blown their motors. I'm wondering about a few things and if it's not too painful I'd like to know what happened.

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?
FI Twin turbo at 15 psi

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?
Pump gas

3. Stock block or built?
Built engine

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?
-17cc dish

5. Spark advance and a/f?
11*, 11.4

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere in between?
WOT

7. What component failed?
The POS Comp Cams phaser limiter came apart

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?
Cat free

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?
No spun bearings just bent valves and damaged pistons on the pass side from the cam jumping time


Earl

 

[KillrStang]

This is for those who have blown their motors. I'm wondering about a few things and if it's not too painful I'd like to know what happened.

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?
FI Twin turbo at 15 psi

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?
Pump gas



3. Stock block or built?
Built engine

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?
-17cc dish

5. Spark advance and a/f?
11*, 11.4

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere in between?
WOT

7. What component failed?
The POS Comp Cams phaser limiter came apart

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?
Cat free

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?
No spun bearings just bent valves and damaged pistons on the pass side from the cam jumping time


Earl

How did the limiter come apart?

 

[8306gt]

What's your compression ratio?

I was doing some driving today with gasoline and I'm not going to go less than 14psi for now.

I'm still interested in the raw data associated with blown motors. We all know that everything is important at higher hp and the window for error becomes smaller.

My big bore engine is 9.5:1 compression, stock stroke Kellog crank, Oliver billet rods, 127350 cams locked out, .042 Cometic gaskets.

 

[skwerl]

This thread is depressing.

 

[Department Of Boost]

This thread is depressing.

Not really, there aren’t many blown motors when looked at as a percentage.

 

[555]

This thread is depressing.

Tell me about it. I just finished putting my motor together and I'm hoping I don't make this list.

 

[Seer]

1. Forced induction or na? If forced induction what type and how much boost?

Forced Induction, Whipple 2.9, 18psi, 746rwhp on pump, 818 on race gas

2. Pump gasoline, E85, or other?

Pump gas (93) with VP100

3. Stock block or built?

Stock GT500 5.4L

4. Compression ratio or piston dish?

8.4:1

5. Spark advance and a/f?

20* and 11.6

6. WOT, normal driving, or somewhere inbetween?

WOT

7. What component failed?

Rod snapped

8. Cats or cat free? If cats were they stock or aftermarket?

No cats

9. If it was a spun bearing what were the motor clearances and what oil was used?

It was not a spun bearing but at time I was using Amsoil AMO 10w40, I since switched to Amsoil Dominator 10w30 for the new build.

 

[lethe]

Tell me about it. I just finished putting my motor together and I'm hoping I don't make this list.

Same here.

 

[retfr8flyr]

How did the limiter come apart?

The design of the Comp phaser limiter doesn't allow enough of the bolt to come through to really hold the spring in place, on the newer versions on the phasers. It may work on the older version, I don't know but on the new versions I have on mine, the design allowed the spring to come loose, fly around and do lots of damage. http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92049



Earl

 

[555]

The design of the Comp phaser limiter doesn't allow enough of the bolt to come through to really hold the spring in place, on the newer versions on the phasers. It may work on the older version, I don't know but on the new versions I have on mine, the design allowed the spring to come loose, fly around and do lots of damage. http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=92049



Earl

Did you choose different limiters or did you go with lock outs this time?

 

[retfr8flyr]

I don't want to sidetrack the thread. Shoot me a PM.


Earl