1 inch wheel spacers too much for stock rims?

[TGR96]

OP, just chiming in here, but +1 on the 1" bolt on hubcentric wheel spacers. I used the Eibach version on my previous 07 GT/CS with no issues, and I did do several autocrosses with them.

I just put a 1" set of wheel spacers on all four corners of my wife's V6 'vert with the Pony package wheels, which I believe are 18 X8.5. It lined up the edge of the tire perfectly with the fender, and looks awesome. Her car is a DD, with no auto X or track driving, but so far, they are doing great with no issues. And FWIW, I got them used from a fellow forum member, and I think they may be the generic eBay spacers, since there is no logo on them anywhere. But like I said, so far so good.

Nothing wrong with using proper wheel spacers until you get some wheels with the correct offset.

 

[KonaBlueBryar]

I'm glad to see someone else giving accurate advice based off of experience other than saying "spacers are trash"

 

[Rapture]

I'm glad to see someone else giving accurate advice based off of experience other than saying "spacers are trash"

Yeah I feel the same way. The people that had issues must not have torqued to spec, installed with rust all over the hub, not bought hub-centric, or left the retaining clips on... Who knows?

Wheels also fall off without spacers. I read a very scientific report on details and statistics of why and how often wheels fall off. Interesting read

 

[frank s]

I see the utility of spacers for clearance and appearance has been testified and verified.

Has anyone some science about the dynamic effect of adding a small percentage to the track measurement? What perceptible changes can a spacer-user expect, with no other changes? Could the sixty bucks invested Mr eBaY's two-inch track expansion be a worthy investment?

I have some observations after using the Fanblade/RE-01 combination with and without spacers, but they were two very different cars, so it's not likely any attribution of change is valid.

 

[Rapture]

I see the utility of spacers for clearance and appearance has been testified and verified.

Has anyone some science about the dynamic effect of adding a small percentage to the track measurement? What perceptible changes can a spacer-user expect, with no other changes? Could the sixty bucks invested Mr eBaY's two-inch track expansion be a worthy investment?

I have some observations after using the Fanblade/RE-01 combination with and without spacers, but they were two very different cars, so it's not likely any attribution of change is valid.

I watched a "somewhat" scientific analysis of the impact wheel spacers/adapters have. It was on YouTube. I can't remember the name and I don't have a link. It's the guy that has a whiteboard and does different explanations and diagrams about cars and car mechanics. I'll try and find it later. I think he has one about cats vs no cats too.

 

[KonaBlueBryar]

that's a good question, and I don't have solid facts but I imainge it has to be a plus. Added track width has to give your car more stability in some sense. when the car rolls within mid turn its harder for the wheel to roll over on itself.. idk just trying to make a scenario in my head.

 

[frank s]

On forums.pelicanparts.com, Porsche theorizer "John" says:

Here's my $0.02...

It effects handling in a number of ways. Assuming that all other things remain the same...

1) A wider track will make the springs feel weaker since you will be using a longer lever on them. So a wider front track will make the front suspension feel softer, promoting a reduction in understeer.

2) A wider track on one end of the car rather then the other will affect the way that load is transfered when cornering.

[...]

The result was that when cornering, the load would be transfered to the outside front wheel sooner then the outside rear wheel since the front wheels had a wider track and thus were traversing a longer distance for a given amount of body roll. This will tend to reduce oversteer.

3) A wider track will lower the roll center at that end of the car, thus making it softer in roll. This is because the car's CG will not change, and thus the vertical distance between the CG and the roll center at that end of the car will increase, kind of like using a torque-wrench with a longer handle that pivots at the roll center. So a wider track at the front will make the front softer in roll which will once again tend to reduce understeer.

4) A wider track will tend to reduce the load transfer to the outside when cornering, which in general will increase cornering power since you'll be able to get more traction from the inside tires. So once again, increasing the track at the front will tend to reduce understeer.

So in general, making the track wider will increase cornering power -- but -- it is important to maintain an optimum ratio between the front and rear tracks as a means to managing the load transfer from the front to the back, and thus the resulting balance between the two ends of the car.

Now, widening the track using spacers also does a number of other things to the geometry...
1) It increases the front scrub radius, which can increase the steering effort and affect the feel and kickback.

2) It can increase the load on the bearings since the load will be cantelivered further out then the suspension designer may have intended.

3) Without working out the geometry, I'd also be concerned about causing the suspension to pick up a tendency to change track under bump/rebound which can cause all sorts of sudden strangeness in the handling as the suspension loading is changed.
__________________
John

Does that cover it? Should a spacer-user be apprehensive about bearings wear?

 

[Rapture]

On forums.pelicanparts.com, Porsche theorizer "John" says:

Here's my $0.02...

It effects handling in a number of ways. Assuming that all other things remain the same...

1) A wider track will make the springs feel weaker since you will be using a longer lever on them. So a wider front track will make the front suspension feel softer, promoting a reduction in understeer.

2) A wider track on one end of the car rather then the other will affect the way that load is transfered when cornering.

[...]

The result was that when cornering, the load would be transfered to the outside front wheel sooner then the outside rear wheel since the front wheels had a wider track and thus were traversing a longer distance for a given amount of body roll. This will tend to reduce oversteer.

3) A wider track will lower the roll center at that end of the car, thus making it softer in roll. This is because the car's CG will not change, and thus the vertical distance between the CG and the roll center at that end of the car will increase, kind of like using a torque-wrench with a longer handle that pivots at the roll center. So a wider track at the front will make the front softer in roll which will once again tend to reduce understeer.

4) A wider track will tend to reduce the load transfer to the outside when cornering, which in general will increase cornering power since you'll be able to get more traction from the inside tires. So once again, increasing the track at the front will tend to reduce understeer.

So in general, making the track wider will increase cornering power -- but -- it is important to maintain an optimum ratio between the front and rear tracks as a means to managing the load transfer from the front to the back, and thus the resulting balance between the two ends of the car.

Now, widening the track using spacers also does a number of other things to the geometry...
1) It increases the front scrub radius, which can increase the steering effort and affect the feel and kickback.

2) It can increase the load on the bearings since the load will be cantelivered further out then the suspension designer may have intended.

3) Without working out the geometry, I'd also be concerned about causing the suspension to pick up a tendency to change track under bump/rebound which can cause all sorts of sudden strangeness in the handling as the suspension loading is changed.
__________________
John

Does that cover it? Should a spacer-user be apprehensive about bearings wear?

That pretty much sums it up. Thanks for that. I'm no expert about bearing wear but I can't see a 1 inch or less spacer shortening the longevity of the bearing by that much. I have no proof of this though. Just my thoughts only. Now a 5 inch spacer seems like it would be a different story

 

[KonaBlueBryar]

good find! that's exactly what I like seeing! I too could understand why it would be more stress on bearings, but shoot, with how hard I push my car,and it being a daily, I'm ready for nearly anything to fail at anytime haha! I feel its not bad to use spacers, you just need to be aware of the added stress on bearings, just like any other modification you do to the car, its going to most likely negatively affect another part. you just gotta choose which bag you want to put your marbles into lol

 

[Rapture]

good find! that's exactly what I like seeing! I too could understand why it would be more stress on bearings, but shoot, with how hard I push my car,and it being a daily, I'm ready for nearly anything to fail at anytime haha! I feel its not bad to use spacers, you just need to be aware of the added stress on bearings, just like any other modification you do to the car, its going to most likely negatively affect another part. you just gotta choose which bag you want to put your marbles into lol

True

 

[Rapture]

So I installed the eBay rear spacers today. Spacers looked like they were machined well. I installed them in the parking lot behind big lots lol. Bought a $20 torque wrench at Walmart. The spacers fit so good and the torque wrench worked great. I'm really not used to things like this going so smoothly. I just hope my wheels don't fall off. I will check torque after work tomorrow.