Corner Balancing for all you Road Course people

[Stephen31201]

I am looking for somewhere to take my car near Greensboro, NC to have it corner balanced. I know that you want to cross balance so that LF+RR = RF+LR. My question is do you try to move the weight to the rear as much as possible while obtaining 50% cross weight, or is where the weight ends up just a byproduct of trying to get the corners at 50% for each diagonal? I weighed at the track with me in the car and this is what I ended up with.

1016..........994

3544

874............660

Keep in mind I am 260lbs on a good day so my car isnt the pig, i am. The car turned in great but oversteer on exit was an issue.

Can someone post there numbers so that I can see what I should be looking for in %s?

 

[Boone]

Check out SRI Racing in K'Vegas. They specialize in Euro sports cars, but they can do corner balancing. Referred to me by Eurobahn, but I've haven't done it to date. Phone number is 336-423-4792, and the website is sriracing.com if you'd like to look them up.

Let me know how it goes.

 

[Stephen31201]

Thanks! Ill give them a call. I found another in Gboro called Korman. They were very informative but wanted $600-800. If that is the price I am going to have to pay I may just purchase my own scales for $700 and do it myself. Then Ill have it when I make spring changes and S197 forum people need it. lol. Just not wanting to drop that kind of cash right now.

 

[zeroescape]

Car is nice and light for a s197. Does it have an interior still?

 

[Stephen31201]

Yeah I was surprised with 3284 w/out me considering the supercharger and all. I have race seats, rear seat delete home-made door panels, and a glass hood. Plus the wheels are really light. That's about it probably.

 

[2Fass240us]

They were very informative but wanted $600-800.

That price better include a sesh with a high-class hooker. Gbus.

I'd offer a recommendation, but the shop I use is in Monroe, NC.

 

[Stephen31201]

Its a BMW shop and maybe that explains it, I don't know. He said they do Mustangs but I don't think he realized that the coilover adjustments can be reached really easy. How much is the shop in Monroe?

 

[DevGittinJr]

My question is do you try to move the weight to the rear as much as possible while obtaining 50% cross weight, or is where the weight ends up just a byproduct of trying to get the corners at 50% for each diagonal?

Cliff's Notes on the difference between left-weight, rear-weight, and cross-weight.

http://www.hotrod.com/how-to/chassis-suspension/113-0309-corner-weights-correction/

They were very informative but wanted $600-800. If that is the price I am going to have to pay I may just purchase my own scales for $700 and do it myself. Then Ill have it when I make spring changes and S197 forum people need it.

I can easily see a shop charging that much to corner weight balance a car. It can pretty much take all day (or longer), and should include an alignment and a bumpsteer adjustment. My understanding is that each one effects the next, so they should go from cross weight, to bumpsteer, to alignment until nothing changes. Then reattach sway bars and adjust out any preload.

I think buying your own scales is a great plan that's likely to pay for itself as soon as you use them a second time. You might consider getting a few tools for alignment and bumpsteer as well. This is a topic I'd like to know more about, and something I plan to do in the near future. Keep us up on your results. Good luck.

 

[CobraRed]

Its a BMW shop and maybe that explains it, I don't know. He said they do Mustangs but I don't think he realized that the coilover adjustments can be reached really easy. How much is the shop in Monroe?

There's some "famous" corner weighing diva's here in LA that mainly do BMW's and S2K' that are $800+ and 2 month wait

 

[2Fass240us]

Its a BMW shop and maybe that explains it, I don't know. He said they do Mustangs but I don't think he realized that the coilover adjustments can be reached really easy. How much is the shop in Monroe?

I did it so long ago I honestly can't remember but it was nowhere near $6-800. All they did is adjust the coilover heights to balance the car; I didn't have them do an alignment or bumpsteer correction because 1) I didn't feel it was necessary, and 2) I wasn't going to track the car. They have the equipment to do both though, if that's what you want.

It's a BMW/Porsche shop called Zuffenhaus: 704.821.2546. Ask for Jack or Aaron and tell them Andy Crawford sent you.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I am looking for somewhere to take my car near Greensboro, NC to have it corner balanced. I know that you want to cross balance so that LF+RR = RF+LR. My question is do you try to move the weight to the rear as much as possible while obtaining 50% cross weight, or is where the weight ends up just a byproduct of trying to get the corners at 50% for each diagonal? I weighed at the track with me in the car and this is what I ended up with.

1016..........994

3544

874............660

Keep in mind I am 260lbs on a good day so my car isnt the pig, i am. The car turned in great but oversteer on exit was an issue.

Can someone post there numbers so that I can see what I should be looking for in %s?

Do you have any plans to move components around to achieve better numbers? Like the battery for example?

Good total weight. That's impressive. I'm really curious where my 2007 is. I have done a lot of weight savings.....and a lot of weight gainings.

Savings:

-Race buckets, 16lb/
-Real harnesses so no stock seat belts.
-No A/C
-Battery in trunk
-Aluminum DS
-Coilovers
-Big vents in hood (holes)
-Relatively light wheels for their size
-No airbags
-Sparco race wheel
-Rear seat delete
-Hood and trunk latch mechanisms replace d with Aero Latches
-No bumpers
-No radio


Gainers:

-Big brakes
-Roll bar
-3.4L Whipple which weighs as much as a house
-A shocking number of heat exchangers/coolers/water/pumps
-Full belly pan with splitter and diffuser
-Rear bulkhead
-T-56 Magnum
-Watts link
-Dynamat (which I want to scrape out now)
-Massive triple pump fuel system. But with braided fabric hose

No idea what it weighs.

 

[Stephen31201]

Dang you've gone all out! Yours should be less than mine for sure. The HP you have probably makes the car feel like its as light as a Miata. I have already moved the battery to the back right in the trunk. I wish I had something I could move from left to right rear but there is nothing left. My plan is to make a car that will run AIX competitively on the track but still be a daily driver. Its getting closer and closer with time, money and seat time. I don't know what headliners and the plastic moldings weight but I don't think it ways enough to justify the ugliness of it being out of the car. I'm sure as time goes on Ill keep taking junk out until its a full fledge race car. This winter a full cage is going in so I need to find something to take off to offset that.

 

[Mach2burnout]

So if you have adjustment on all corners you change your cross weight percentages by adjusting opposing corners. But you can't change the amount of actual weight you have front to rear or left to right with out physically moving the weight.

You have approx.
56.7% front
43.3% rear

53.3% left
46.7% right

52.7% RF-LR cross
47.3% LF-RR cross

How much fuel was in the car at the time it was scaled? This will affect rear % a great deal.

All adjustments affect your corner weights/percentages. Now there are static corner weights and dynamic corner weights. Static weights aren't affected so much by alignment, etc.. But dynamic weights are. Especially caster. When you turn the steering wheel the caster setting will add corner weight on the opposing rear corner. This can affect cornering tremendously.

Now, where are you getting new scales for 7-800$? If you do find some for that price then you need to spend 3-500$ more for turn plates and 1-200$ for some decent caster/camber tools and toe plates. And this can go on and on. What I do is offer fellow races to come to my shop and use my scales/tools (with my supervision of course) and scale their car for about 2-300$. Usually will spend 3-5 hours. They do the work and I offer the knowledge I have. Most times they know more than me.


Sent from iPhone

 

[Department Of Boost]

Dang you've gone all out! Yours should be less than mine for sure.

I expect it to weigh a ton. Maybe i'm wrong??? I'll scale it this spring. This winter the car is getting gone through. It's almost down to the chassis now. I'll try and take more weight out if I can. And put less stuff back in.

The HP you have probably makes the car feel like its as light as a Miata.

It's pretty sketchy!!!

I don't know what headliners and the plastic moldings weight but I don't think it ways enough to justify the ugliness of it being out of the car.

Agreed.

I'm sure as time goes on Ill keep taking junk out until its a full fledge race car.

Yep, that's how it happens!!!

This winter a full cage is going in so I need to find something to take off to offset that.

What's going in for a cage? They get HEAVY quick. I was picking a fully welded cage up at Rehagen last time I was there. Wow, it was not light!!

 

[Stephen31201]

So if you have adjustment on all corners you change your cross weight percentages by adjusting opposing corners. But you can't change the amount of actual weight you have front to rear or left to right with out physically moving the weight.

You have approx.
56.7% front
43.3% rear

53.3% left
46.7% right

52.7% RF-LR cross
47.3% LF-RR cross

How much fuel was in the car at the time it was scaled? This will affect rear % a great deal.

All adjustments affect your corner weights/percentages. Now there are static corner weights and dynamic corner weights. Static weights aren't affected so much by alignment, etc.. But dynamic weights are. Especially caster. When you turn the steering wheel the caster setting will add corner weight on the opposing rear corner. This can affect cornering tremendously.

Now, where are you getting new scales for 7-800$? If you do find some for that price then you need to spend 3-500$ more for turn plates and 1-200$ for some decent caster/camber tools and toe plates. And this can go on and on. What I do is offer fellow races to come to my shop and use my scales/tools (with my supervision of course) and scale their car for about 2-300$. Usually will spend 3-5 hours. They do the work and I offer the knowledge I have. Most times they know more than me.


Sent from iPhone

It had a full tank of gas. IF I had DOB's HP I would just throw 3-400lbs in the trunk for that 50-50 weight ratio and let it rip. I am just trying to get it close and I found several name brand scales for sell on a few websites. I am just trying to get it close. So much can change the balance and until I decide on spring rates I'm just not going to spend that kind of money. Maybe at the beginning of the season next year.

 

[Stephen31201]

What's going in for a cage? They get HEAVY quick. I was picking a fully welded cage up at Rehagen last time I was there. Wow, it was not light!![/QUOTE]

I am hoping to have enough for chrome molly. Richard Petty's garage in Randleman quoted $2400 for a 10 point installed cage. I still need a suite, gloves, net, battery disconnect and on and on by next Feb. Need more $$$$$$$$.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I am hoping to have enough for chrome molly. Richard Petty's garage in Randleman quoted $2400 for a 10 point installed cage. I still need a suite, gloves, net, battery disconnect and on and on by next Feb. Need more $$$$$$$$.

That actually doesn't seem that bad. That's a ton of work.

 

[Norm Peterson]

What's going in for a cage? They get HEAVY quick. I was picking a fully welded cage up at Rehagen last time I was there. Wow, it was not light!!

Ballpark estimate for 1.75" x 0.120" tubing, 2.75 lbs per foot . . . times how many feet, exactly?


Norm

 

[Mark Aubele]

IF I had DOB's HP I would just throw 3-400lbs in the trunk for that 50-50 weight ratio and let it rip.

Nothing magic about 50/50 weight distribution. Short of street racing or on a track with no prep, there is no reason to ADD weight to a car. Moving weight is one thing, I would never add it.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Nothing magic about 50/50 weight distribution. Short of street racing or on a track with no prep, there is no reason to ADD weight to a car. Moving weight is one thing, I would never add it.

If I add anymore weight to my car I'm going to have to get a CDL.