Differentials--for corner carving

AutoXRacer

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what type of oil did you use when the TruTrac was installed.

The shop that installed it used 80W-90 gear oil...non-synthetic...
I wished they would have used 75W-140 instead...

But I only ran it for about 200 miles and then swapped it out with Red Line Shockproof gear oil. I mixed 80% light with 20% heavy. I think I should have used 100% heavy.

When the 80W-90 was cold, you could barely hear anything, but as soon as it started warming up, it was clearly audible. The Shockproof has helped keep it almost quiet...you faintly hear it.

According to Eaton, they are supposed to be silent...though they did admit to getting a ton of calls from Mustang owners complaining about the noise.
 
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Back from the dead..

Welp..mine's toast. One wheel wonder as I came around a corner today. It was never so obvious before. These last few weeks, I've noticed that the car is just getting more difficult to predict when I'm trying to drive like "an asshole" in these half snowy, half salted roads.

As long as I'm in there, I might as well up the gear ratio. There one turn at Blackhawk and one turn at Milwaukee mile where second gear winds up way too quick, while third is just lugging the car through. I know 3:73 would help, but I was toying with the idea of 3:91. I rarely ever go more than 135ish, so I don't think I'll be too concerned with top end. I also haven't pulled out a rev calculator to see what rpms at what speeds yet, so I'm not seriously considering it yet. Just throwing it out there.

Few questions:
Is it really the just the installer or would you trust a non-frpp gear? I'm talking about whining/noise. Seems like there's a majority of people that say it's the gear, while there also a small group that have run motive without issue. I ask that because frpp doesn't make a 3:91.

Assuming I'm paying 5 bills for the diff. What's the range you guys have been quoted for install? Is that including a new gearset?

How many track days would you guesstimate an Eaton LSD would have in it? This is with an extremely aggressive driver on 9.5 wide wheels and 140 treadwear rubber that does at least 2 full track days and 6-7 time attacks a year. You're probably not familiar to the time attack format I run is, so just say that the 6-7 time attacks equate to 3 track days for a total of 5.

Thanks
 
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Gray Ghost GT

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I'm getting my new Eaton LSD (not the Trutrac version) installed next week using BG Products 80W90 conventional oil to compliment my 3.73 gears that I'll be using at VIR this May for a two day road course event.
 
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SoundGuyDave

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Bummer, Carl!

Install should be between 500-750 for the whole shooting match. They have to pull the gears off the stock diff and reset the pinion depth anyway, so changing ratios should be the same labor cost.

As far as the ratio goes, what size tire are you running? 3.73 with 275/35-18 feels pretty good to me, at BHF I drop to second only on the last corner, the rest is 3-4, with plenty of grunt. I COULD drop to second at 3d, but I don't seem to lack grunt into those two left-handers that follow, so... Never run Milwaukee, thus no data, and at Road America, it's all 3-4 except for T5, and I don't remember hitting 5th on the straights. Winding out 4th, yes, but that was with taller tires.
 
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Bummer, Carl!

AND IT WILL HAPPEN TO YOUUU!!!
lol.

Install should be between 500-750 for the whole shooting match. They have to pull the gears off the stock diff and reset the pinion depth anyway, so changing ratios should be the same labor cost.

I was thinking about 12 hund-0 for the whole shebang. So looks like I was ballparkin' pretty close. God dammit. Debt...it consumes me.

Who did your 3:73 install, Dave? Or did you do it yourself? If someone else, do you recommend them? You used frpp gears, yeah? I've set pinion depth ONCE..but it never went into a working car. So I'll shell out the coin.


As far as the ratio goes, what size tire are you running?..275/35-18..

You are correct, sir.
 

SoundGuyDave

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AND IT WILL HAPPEN TO YOUUU!!!
lol.

Of that I have no doubt... REALLY want a Torson T2R, but I've been hearing the scuttlebut, so.... Address that issue when it comes, if I don't have Poe build me a car instead!


Who did your 3:73 install, Dave? Or did you do it yourself? If someone else, do you recommend them? You used frpp gears, yeah? I've set pinion depth ONCE..but it never went into a working car. So I'll shell out the coin.
I've done R&P a few times, but I REALLY hate the smell of gear lube with friction modifier... like as in it makes me puke, no joke. I had Suburban Drive Line do it, but I wasn't all that happy with them. They did the install, used Royal Purple with no modifier (but...it's already in there), and when the clutches started moaning after about 70 miles, I had to go to Ford, buy the OE lube, and the modifier, and they did the swap. Clutches continued to groan. Finally got it taken car of at the dealer under a TSB. Try going to Elmhurst Auto Care, the owner runs with Council in an ex-Craftsman truck, and he knows how to do all that fun stuff the right way. Not the cheapest, but he's VERY good, and a racer, so we can kind of support "our own," if you follow.


Assuming stock trans ratios and the 275/35 tires, here's how your speeds will work out with the different gears, 3000RPM-6750RPM, except fifth is shown coming in at 4250, which is 6250 out of fourth (just for comparison), and max speed is aero limited with all gear ratios. Aero limit, for our purposes is 150mph.

.....................1.............2.............3.............4.............5

3.55...........0-43.........32-72........49-109.....64-144.....134
3.73...........0-41.........31-69........46-104.....61-138.....128
3.90...........0-39.........29-66........44-100.....59-132.....122
4.10...........0-37.........28-63........42-95.......56-125....116

I wouldn't presume to make a recommendation, but for me, it would either be 3.73 or 3.90. 4.10 is just too nuts, you'd spend more time shifting than you would anything else... Most of the tracks in our area seem to have intermediate straight speed right around 100mph, which is meat range for the 3.73, but perhaps marginal for the 3.90. If you can crack 102-103 heading into T5 at Putnam, you either short shift into fourth, then back down again in the braking zone, then right back up again heading into T6, or you whack the car into the limiter for a second or two, which can't be healthy. How would that plot out at Milwaukee Mile? I haven't driven that one yet. I would think about the tracks you run, and where the 3-4 shift comes in, and take it from there. Also think about the corners where you need to drop to second, and think if you can make up time coming out in third, where you didn't before.
 
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No, I've asked about 4:10's before in my first started thread when I didn't know how to drive the car. :crazy:

Turn 7 at Blackhawk is 3rd gear. The only time you use second is when leaving the grid. You can get the car comfortably quick through through turn seven in third gear with some finesse, but it's not easy. Especially considering you're coming off the fastest stretch of the track.

The biggest thing that's making me think about 3:90s is the hairpin at milwaukee. I just can't for the life of me get through there quickly. It's either me or I'm stuck exactly in the middle of what gear ratio the car wants. Slowing the entry speed down and ramping the revs right back up in second while the rear end wants to flick out made for good watching, but not fast. Doing the opposite in that turn felt like the car was just barely moving along and made me wanna downshift again.

Judging by the mph above, I'm most likely gonna just stick with a tride and true 3:73 because a 3:90 is not going to fare me well on the banked turns. I'm teetering 98-99mph part throttle and exiting at 101mph when I get it right. That's the only sweet spot of the track I've figure out that gets me back what I lost everywhere else. But I wish I had the disposable income to try both. :evil:
 

Rubrignitz

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Wellll, you could throw some cams in your car and increase the rpm by 500 with some 3.90s would be perfect. I had FRPP cams and zinging along at 6800rpm was no problem. I know its not "recommended" with the stock springs but I couldn't detect any float at that rpm (with my car fwiw). hell, it made power on the dyno all the way to 7k...
 
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SoundGuyDave

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Turn 7 at Blackhawk is 3rd gear. The only time you use second is when leaving the grid. You can get the car comfortably quick through through turn seven in third gear with some finesse, but it's not easy. Especially considering you're coming off the fastest stretch of the track.

Big brass ones that clank when he walks... The runoff from T7 if you DO butch the turn is F'n brutal. Undulating, rocky, with tall weeds that hide a berm and a creek. You're most likely right, I probably COULD motor through in third, but more brakes and second gear felt SOOOOOO much more comfortable. OTOH, last time I was there was on the old Nittos, so the *specs or Hoosiers might give me the confidence in the grip to try the corner a bit harder. We shall see!
 

SoundGuyDave

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Wellll, you could throw some cams in your car and increase the rpm by 500 with some 3.90s would be perfect. I had FRPP cams and zinging along at 6800rpm was no problem. I know its not "recommended" with the stock springs but I couldn't detect any float at that rpm (with my car fwiw).

I've been looking at cams myself, and basically came to the conclusion that the top-end power gain isn't worth the loss of the mid-band torque to pull you out of the corner. The speed chart that I posted up was based on 6750 redline, and 6875 revs will only buy you two mph on the shift point with 3.90's, up to 102. That's still too close to the speeds we're seeing on the medium-speed straights for comfort, and 7000RPM (104mph) is probably a little unrealistic for a stock bottom end to handle for any duration.
 
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Big brass ones that clank when he walks... The runoff from T7 if you DO butch the turn is F'n brutal. Undulating, rocky, with tall weeds that hide a berm and a creek. You're most likely right, I probably COULD motor through in third, but more brakes and second gear felt SOOOOOO much more comfortable. OTOH, last time I was there was on the old Nittos, so the *specs or Hoosiers might give me the confidence in the grip to try the corner a bit harder. We shall see!

LOL. It's not so bad. So what if you are coming up 90 degree turn with a swamp directly behind it? I guess the young and dumb ones are the bigger risk takers. But seriously, it's not THAT bad. I do it all day..on stock brakes and street rubber. Gotta enter the following straight fast as possible to get those legs stretched out...It's how you make life hell for the guys with z06s:roflmao:
 

Rubrignitz

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I see you've worked the numbers. I didn't notice the PRO50 gears were a 28 pinion. They were top of my list for 3.90 ratio...

Richmond are second on the list.
 
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I've been looking at cams myself, and basically came to the conclusion that the top-end power gain isn't worth the loss of the mid-band torque to pull you out of the corner. The speed chart that I posted up was based on 6750 redline, and 6875 revs will only buy you two mph on the shift point with 3.90's, up to 102. That's still too close to the speeds we're seeing on the medium-speed straights for comfort, and 7000RPM (104mph) is probably a little unrealistic for a stock bottom end to handle for any duration.

I really wanted to give cams a try, but now the diff needs the most attention next to dings and dents. So, unless I get some major sponsorship or win the lottery, it's one or the other. Fuckin racing and the damn costs. Maybe I should just buy a spec miata and call it a day..:gay:
 

Rubrignitz

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I ran/raced etc a turbo miata a few weeks ago. Made me want one....badly lol. ONLY for a weekend car though. My mustang is as utilitarian as a lincoln. Maybe I'll turn the mustang into the "hotrod/beater" DD and get a spec miata for the weekends :thumb2:.
 

SoundGuyDave

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I ran/raced etc a turbo miata a few weeks ago. Made me want one....badly lol. ONLY for a weekend car though. My mustang is as utilitarian as a lincoln. Maybe I'll turn the mustang into the "hotrod/beater" DD and get a spec miata for the weekends :thumb2:.

Wait, the Mustang as a beater, and the Miata as a racer????? Seriously?????

Son, put the bong down, and slowly back away.....:crazy: Driving a Miata is like screwing a fat chick: Lots of fun to drive, but you don't want your friends to see you doing it!!!

Actually, the Miatae aren't that bad. They only take two laps to get up to speed, and brakes are apparently optional...
 

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