I did a thing

[46addict]

Do you have any track times on the NA setup?

 

[RocketcarX]

Do you have any track times on the NA setup?

Never had this one at the track, My first time out will be for the nitrous test once I'm ready. I'll baseline the car of course off the bottle. After the nitrous is functioning as expected I'll get with FTI on the converter and get after this race season in some fashion.

 

[RocketcarX]

Will be installing and finalizing the combo over the weekend, was thinking I should leave the HT1 plugs I have in the car now installed until it's time to start spraying. I have the Ford Racing 3v cold plugs for nitrous, but figured I should save them until I actually need to start pulling timing and what not, .032 on the gap?

 

[702GT]

You can get away with running HT1's on spray on smaller shots (IMO, 100 or less). HT0's are the way to go for extra safety. As for plug gap, I ran up to 150 shot on a .038 gap without issue. Bigger than 150, you'd have to ask the pro's.

Nitrous tunes really aren't a big deal once you wrap your mind around what you're doing. The tune is your baseline, after that, your pill jetting needs to control your AFR. Beyond that, a nitrous tune is simply a de-tuned NA tune (less spark timing). Other than that, VCT and everything else stays the same. There's no comparison to a boosted car, as your MAF is still draw type and you're still dealing in vacuum to atmospheric air pressure, not positive pressure and 1+ engine load.

If tuning yourself, make sure to invest in a pill kit, so you have enough various sized jets that you can start with a fat AFR and trim from there. Keep in mind your operational window for nitrous should be dictated by airflow (cams affect airflow velocity). Slow moving air and nitrous/fuel is a bomb with a short fuse. A window switch at a minimum should be mandatory for nitrous cars. Fancy controller, if you can swing the coin. Typically 3,000rpm is the minimum threshold, but NA cams typically need more rpm the more aggressive the cam profile. Don't ever lean out the base tune, use your fuel jet to dial it in. My nitrous tune was 12.0 AFR (fairly fat) and max 16 degrees spark timing (fairly conservative). That was my base tune, from there I adjusted AFR via jetting (aimed for ~11.2). It was always fairly easy for me, due to the dedicated fuel setup I didn't worry about whether the ECM fuel system could keep up or not, and the 100 octane afforded me some detonation resistance.

Just keep your mind-frame straight when thinking about nitrous. It's Naturally Aspirated, on steroids. NA first, spray on top of. As far as the S197's go, to my knowledge there is no "flip switch" tune chips for the S197. I also looked into that when I started my spray journey. It sucks, but if you want to be ready to spray at the drop of a hat, you have to stay on your spray tune at all times. In regards to performance of driving NA on a spray tune, the only difference is WOT. You'll be down on power and running slightly fat at WOT, otherwise fuel economy would be the same as your NA tune in open loop. Still plenty of passing power. If I had to throw numbers and make a guess, if you made 300whp NA with an optimal NA tune, you'd probably make 270-280whp NA on a spray tune, assuming there's a 10 degree difference in spark advance and 1 degree is worth 2-3hp. Just a hypothetical example, you can always have a comparison done on the dyno once you've established your nitrous base tune to know for sure.

 

[RocketcarX]

You can get away with running HT1's on spray on smaller shots (IMO, 100 or less). HT0's are the way to go for extra safety. As for plug gap, I ran up to 150 shot on a .038 gap without issue. Bigger than 150, you'd have to ask the pro's.

Nitrous tunes really aren't a big deal once you wrap your mind around what you're doing. The tune is your baseline, after that, your pill jetting needs to control your AFR. Beyond that, a nitrous tune is simply a de-tuned NA tune (less spark timing). Other than that, VCT and everything else stays the same. There's no comparison to a boosted car, as your MAF is still draw type and you're still dealing in vacuum to atmospheric air pressure, not positive pressure and 1+ engine load.

If tuning yourself, make sure to invest in a pill kit, so you have enough various sized jets that you can start with a fat AFR and trim from there. Keep in mind your operational window for nitrous should be dictated by airflow (cams affect airflow velocity). Slow moving air and nitrous/fuel is a bomb with a short fuse. A window switch at a minimum should be mandatory for nitrous cars. Fancy controller, if you can swing the coin. Typically 3,000rpm is the minimum threshold, but NA cams typically need more rpm the more aggressive the cam profile. Don't ever lean out the base tune, use your fuel jet to dial it in. My nitrous tune was 12.0 AFR (fairly fat) and max 16 degrees spark timing (fairly conservative). That was my base tune, from there I adjusted AFR via jetting (aimed for ~11.2). It was always fairly easy for me, due to the dedicated fuel setup I didn't worry about whether the ECM fuel system could keep up or not, and the 100 octane afforded me some detonation resistance.

Just keep your mind-frame straight when thinking about nitrous. It's Naturally Aspirated, on steroids. NA first, spray on top of. As far as the S197's go, to my knowledge there is no "flip switch" tune chips for the S197. I also looked into that when I started my spray journey. It sucks, but if you want to be ready to spray at the drop of a hat, you have to stay on your spray tune at all times. In regards to performance of driving NA on a spray tune, the only difference is WOT. You'll be down on power and running slightly fat at WOT, otherwise fuel economy would be the same as your NA tune in open loop. Still plenty of passing power. If I had to throw numbers and make a guess, if you made 300whp NA with an optimal NA tune, you'd probably make 270-280whp NA on a spray tune, assuming there's a 10 degree difference in spark advance and 1 degree is worth 2-3hp. Just a hypothetical example, you can always have a comparison done on the dyno once you've established your nitrous base tune to know for sure.

I went with the Nitrous Outlet ProMax progressive controller and set it up for AFR control. Once I master it I have a a feeling I'll be spoiled by it's features. The coolest part is it basically data logs the entire car from MPH to nitrous and fuel pressure along with TPS and RPM.
What you're saying about the tune makes perfect sense, maximize the N/A tune and pull timing.
I have HP Tuners so running a N/A tune when the bottle is out of the car is a 45 second deal, I'm fine with that. A Cummins truck takes 30-50 minutes to refresh a tune, lol.

 

[702GT]

I went with the Nitrous Outlet ProMax progressive controller and set it up for AFR control. Once I master it I have a a feeling I'll be spoiled by it's features. The coolest part is it basically data logs the entire car from MPH to nitrous and fuel pressure along with TPS and RPM.
What you're saying about the tune makes perfect sense, maximize the N/A tune and pull timing.
I have HP Tuners so running a N/A tune when the bottle is out of the car is a 45 second deal, I'm fine with that. A Cummins truck takes 30-50 minutes to refresh a tune, lol.

That's horrid. Why bother tuning a dodge at all? Last time I was at the dealer with my Super Duty they wanted to flash the computer. I told them if they fucked with anything other than reading codes (didn't have any codes) I'd come back with a 10lb sledge hammer, and meant it. That truck hasn't had any of the stupid DPF/regen problems like so many of the other 6.7's, all I need is for them to update the tune and jack my shit up and try to tell me this that or the other thing was the cause. Jackasses. I brought it in to shake down a tech who told me 2 years ago that my radiator was leaking and wanted to rape me for $2,400 to fix it. Told them to kick rocks then, and brought it back 2 years later to tell them to keep on kicking those rocks, 'cause it hasn't lost coolant yet. I'll bring it by the dealer again next year, for our 3 year bullshit anniversary. OT rant, sorry.

 

[RocketcarX]

That's horrid. Why bother tuning a dodge at all? Last time I was at the dealer with my Super Duty they wanted to flash the computer. I told them if they fucked with anything other than reading codes (didn't have any codes) I'd come back with a 10lb sledge hammer, and meant it. That truck hasn't had any of the stupid DPF/regen problems like so many of the other 6.7's, all I need is for them to update the tune and jack my shit up and try to tell me this that or the other thing was the cause. Jackasses. I brought it in to shake down a tech who told me 2 years ago that my radiator was leaking and wanted to rape me for $2,400 to fix it. Told them to kick rocks then, and brought it back 2 years later to tell them to keep on kicking those rocks, 'cause it hasn't lost coolant yet. I'll bring it by the dealer again next year, for our 3 year bullshit anniversary. OT rant, sorry.

Yeah, I have to use dealer out of Houston when I need stuff from them because our local dealer is trash.
I do a shit load of Cummins tuning and upgrades, the flash time for EFI Live and the 5 position switch set up I like take forever. I usually have to unlock the ECU as well so that takes even more time. I think it's due to the protocol they use in the ECU.
Certain years on the trans it is flashed separately from the ECU, so when folks want trans tuning prior to 2013ish I have to do that part separately yet again, lol.