Looking to improve handling without lowering the car

[Miker]

I am sure mine are stock and I have no discernable body roll. However I don't push the limits I guess. Seems like a stiffer setup would lead to its own set of issues on a bumpy corner.

 

[DieHarder]

On the Subject of Improving Handling: Just my humble opinion on what I would change (and have) on an S197 in order of precedence w/my reasoning (may not match yours). If you're not that sure about what you're doing (or very old like me though I still work on my car because I like to save money) I'd take my car into a good alignment shop and have them check everything suspension and steering wise. If they find problems at least you know where to start.
1) Tires - If your tires are old (assuming adequate tread... +5 yrs seems to be the recommendation) change them out if you can afford it. Plenty of great options out there.
2) Struts/Shocks - Bilstein B6 - Best I've run across to date. Firmer yet compliant. Tires must maintain contact patch to be effective.
3) Springs - If you like a lowered look but not absolutely necessary. Do at the same time as struts/shocks if you're going to.
4) Sway bars - Several good options out there. Only thing I would caution is get F/R from the same manufacturer.
5) Front/Rear LCA's (Lower Control Arms) - If yours are original past time to change them out. Bonus - Takes care of ball joint issues as well. Get the GT500 version for the fronts and an aftermarket for the UCA/LCA's in the rear. I like J&M. They articulate better than most and have held up well in my experience. Don't forget an adjustable pan hard bar.
6) Tie rods - I've had to replace both. Steering is now laser focused.
7) Braces - Lot's of opinions out there whether these cars need them or not. Personal preference - I would go with at least a strut tower brace and lower A-arm brace in the front since every S197 out there is already set up for it. In the rear many have commented that adding an X Brace in place of or behind the rear seats significantly improved tracking/handling but I cannot speak to that as I haven't installed one (but I have one that I will install in the spring so more on that later). On my own car I've installed both of these and added a Whiteline lower control arm brace and a rear strut tower brace. Neither of which was likely necessary but I was on a tear at the time after the car tried to swap ends one night when I got on her in the rain... Since I've made all of the changes mentioned handling has improved signifcantly.
8) Lots of other things you can do to these cars and of course manufacturers would sell you a left nostril inhaler if they thought you'd buy it. For the most part my overall recommendation is improve what you can, as you can afford it starting with the obvious to keep your steed on the road and behaving. Good luck.

 

[SilverMustangGT]

Replacing/upgrading the suspension can get complicated. You may want to just go with a suspension package with all the parts already selected to work together. I have heard good things about the Ford Performance handling package. Each change you make affects something else, so you need to have some kind of plan before you start replacing parts (anything besides shocks).

I'm running coil overs along with several other suspension mods, but it's setup for the CAMC autocross class. Most people don't realize that the S197 can be setup to handle really nice.

 

[Pentalab]

I like the adjustability of the Koni Yellows for autocross, but they do ride rough. Not sure I would choose them for a daily driver.

The problem with koni yellow is.... they have hard compression. The adjustable part is ONLY the rebound. The koni orange are hard compression and rebound.

What u want to end up with is..... firm, but not stiff.
Stiffer / bigger front + rear sway bars will eliminate a lot of the leaning on corners. I would start there 1st.

Problem with the D specs is..... only one adjustment for both compression + rebound. Most folks can't find a good setting for street use.

Buddy had roush front springs ( 1/2" lower than oem....and also 20% stiffer) and koni orange. He said it rode like shit.

 

[JC SSP]

I had regular Tokico struts and D spec adjustable shocks on my now defunct 06’. Never had an issue but this was strictly a street car and cruiser.

My 05’ is a different animal. Ford racing front struts with GT500 track pack Bilsteins shocks (default on stiff). Car handles as if it’s on rails but the ride is very stiff.

 

[VGMStudios]

Just throwing this out there but I have Stange shocks. You can adjust them to be a smooth ride or stiff. Maybe something to consider? Oh and Def get the GT500 control arms.

 

[Steve Waters]

I understand where everyone is coming from but apparently you don't want to make a track car. You seem to want a car with a more sure footed ride. Age can cause some of the problems you are experiencing so as one person suggested start with the ware items like bushings. Check them for cracking or worse. If you don't have any rattles in the front end then you probably don't need upper strut bushings. Of coarse replace all the need replacing. If everthing checks out then struts and shocks would be a good place to start as well as good performance tires and a good alignment. Could be just the roads you driving on. Anyway you are the one who will have to decide how far you want to go and how much you are willing to spend.

 

[GriffX]

My D-Spec values:
2007 sway bars: 5 out rear, 4.5 front (7.5 out max and softest)
2014 sway bars: 6 out rear, 5.5 front
Because of the stiffer sway bar I was able to drive softer adjustments
(High speed compression is too stiff for me in any setting)

 

[Midlife Crises]

My D-Spec values:
2007 sway bars: 5 out rear, 4.5 front (7.5 out max and softest)
2014 sway bars: 6 out rear, 5.5 front
Because of the stiffer sway bar I was able to drive softer adjustments
(High speed compression is too stiff for me in any setting)

This is very much the way I ran D Specs on the hi-way. They are just a bit stiff. Current (best setting) for the strip is no front sway bar at all with front struts 6 turns out and rear shocks 1.5 turns out. Rides just awful on the hi-way.

 

[betenoire23]

On the Subject of Improving Handling: Just my humble opinion on what I would change (and have) on an S197 in order of precedence w/my reasoning (may not match yours). If you're not that sure about what you're doing (or very old like me though I still work on my car because I like to save money) I'd take my car into a good alignment shop and have them check everything suspension and steering wise. If they find problems at least you know where to start.
1) Tires - If your tires are old (assuming adequate tread... +5 yrs seems to be the recommendation) change them out if you can afford it. Plenty of great options out there.
2) Struts/Shocks - Bilstein B6 - Best I've run across to date. Firmer yet compliant. Tires must maintain contact patch to be effective.
3) Springs - If you like a lowered look but not absolutely necessary. Do at the same time as struts/shocks if you're going to.
4) Sway bars - Several good options out there. Only thing I would caution is get F/R from the same manufacturer.
5) Front/Rear LCA's (Lower Control Arms) - If yours are original past time to change them out. Bonus - Takes care of ball joint issues as well. Get the GT500 version for the fronts and an aftermarket for the UCA/LCA's in the rear. I like J&M. They articulate better than most and have held up well in my experience. Don't forget an adjustable pan hard bar.
6) Tie rods - I've had to replace both. Steering is now laser focused.
7) Braces - Lot's of opinions out there whether these cars need them or not. Personal preference - I would go with at least a strut tower brace and lower A-arm brace in the front since every S197 out there is already set up for it. In the rear many have commented that adding an X Brace in place of or behind the rear seats significantly improved tracking/handling but I cannot speak to that as I haven't installed one (but I have one that I will install in the spring so more on that later). On my own car I've installed both of these and added a Whiteline lower control arm brace and a rear strut tower brace. Neither of which was likely necessary but I was on a tear at the time after the car tried to swap ends one night when I got on her in the rain... Since I've made all of the changes mentioned handling has improved signifcantly.
8) Lots of other things you can do to these cars and of course manufacturers would sell you a left nostril inhaler if they thought you'd buy it. For the most part my overall recommendation is improve what you can, as you can afford it starting with the obvious to keep your steed on the road and behaving. Good luck.

Thanks DieHarder, I really like your approach. Just one question regarding the Bilstein, are they offering some comfort over potholes? It's sad that I live so far from all of you guys, I would have love that have a ride in your car to see how it feels. Obviously, Quebec is really far away HAHAHAH!!!

 

[betenoire23]

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions, very appreciated. The suspension and alignment of the car was all checked last summer when I bought it and everything was ok (inspected by a good mechanic). That said, I will double check the bushing when it will get out this spring.

I will most probably do a mix of your suggestions: GT500 strut mounts, maybe convertible GT500 springs and... Bilstein dampers... Depending of the feel after installing these parts, will decide if I continue with the sway bars.

I'm kind of surprise that not that much people have tried the Koni Special Active, I thought they would be THE solution. I will install of of these myself. Will keep you inform later this summer when all will be installed.

 

[OX1]

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions, very appreciated. The suspension and alignment of the car was all checked last summer when I bought it and everything was ok (inspected by a good mechanic). That said, I will double check the bushing when it will get out this spring.

I will most probably do a mix of your suggestions: GT500 strut mounts, maybe convertible GT500 springs and... Bilstein dampers... Depending of the feel after installing these parts, will decide if I continue with the sway bars.

I'm kind of surprise that not that much people have tried the Koni Special Active, I thought they would be THE solution. I will install of of these myself. Will keep you inform later this summer when all will be installed.

Those struts look promising

I don't understand why the aftermarket has not come out with even a two position electronic shock/strut setup for the Mustang.
My Fusion Sport has adjustable electronic suspension, but it's really just two settings, Normal and Sport.

But it really makes a huge difference in Sport for damping. You can easily feel the difference even @ steady state on the highway
(switching in and out). With sway bars and only 245, PS4S tires (otherwise, stock suspension), I was able to max out over 1G on the
racetrack. And that's with a 4100 lb pig, super front weight biased, Fusion.

This is one of my better laps @ Thunderbolt @ NJMP. Was a "paced" event, and one of my first time on a road course.
But even with that, most corners I touched into the .9G range.

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/FUSION%20SPORT/NJMP/THUNDERBOLT/31%20MAR%202018/00186.MTS

 

[Petro Leontiuk]

Before buying any struts and shocks i would highly advise you to buy new wheels and low profile tires. I'm telling you this because when i've bought my 2009 GT almost four year ago, i changed struts and shocks to Koni Yellows, GT500 front struts mounts, Whiteline rear control arms (all three of them), Ford Racing rear sway bar links and Energy Suspension front sway bar bushings. All this made a huge difference, no doubt. But i still feel a terrible body roll that makes me crazy. So i think now that my next step will be new set of wheels, wider than my stock 18x8.5 Bullitts, and tires with much lover profile. Maybe someone in this thread will share their success story with the wheels.

 

[DieHarder]

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions, very appreciated. The suspension and alignment of the car was all checked last summer when I bought it and everything was ok (inspected by a good mechanic). That said, I will double check the bushing when it will get out this spring.

I will most probably do a mix of your suggestions: GT500 strut mounts, maybe convertible GT500 springs and... Bilstein dampers... Depending of the feel after installing these parts, will decide if I continue with the sway bars.

I'm kind of surprise that not that much people have tried the Koni Special Active, I thought they would be THE solution. I will install of of these myself. Will keep you inform later this summer when all will be installed.

No need to change the springs if you're looking for a comfortable ride. What the struts/shocks will do is help tighten up handling which is what you want. Unless you're going to lower the car I'd save the money and keep the stock springs. Changing out the springs will likely stiffen the ride. GT500/FRPP/Aftermarket are typically stiffer compared to stock and may make the car ride like a buckboard (ask me how I know). You do need the GT500 strut mounts for the Bilstein B6 as they won't fit the stock strut mounts. My advice is change out the struts/shocks/mounts and evaluate the ride and handling for a while before making other changes.

 

[DieHarder]

Thanks DieHarder, I really like your approach. Just one question regarding the Bilstein, are they offering some comfort over potholes? It's sad that I live so far from all of you guys, I would have love that have a ride in your car to see how it feels. Obviously, Quebec is really far away HAHAHAH!!!

I'm fairly certain you'll like the ride. My advice is try to avoid the potholes.

 

[betenoire23]

No need to change the springs if you're looking for a comfortable ride. What the struts/shocks will do is help tighten up handling which is what you want. Unless you're going to lower the car I'd save the money and keep the stock springs. Changing out the springs will likely stiffen the ride. GT500/FRPP/Aftermarket are typically stiffer compared to stock and may make the car ride like a buckboard (ask me how I know). You do need the GT500 strut mounts for the Bilstein B6 as they won't fit the stock strut mounts. My advice is change out the struts/shocks/mounts and evaluate the ride and handling for a while before making other changes.

Exactly, I want to keep it comfortable and tighten up handling so I will keep the OEM springs (I don't want a buckboard AND I won't ask how you know regarding the change of springs ) So I will follow you advice. Thanks a lot!

 

[betenoire23]

Before buying any struts and shocks i would highly advise you to buy new wheels and low profile tires. I'm telling you this because when i've bought my 2009 GT almost four year ago, i changed struts and shocks to Koni Yellows, GT500 front struts mounts, Whiteline rear control arms (all three of them), Ford Racing rear sway bar links and Energy Suspension front sway bar bushings. All this made a huge difference, no doubt. But i still feel a terrible body roll that makes me crazy. So i think now that my next step will be new set of wheels, wider than my stock 18x8.5 Bullitts, and tires with much lover profile. Maybe someone in this thread will share their success story with the wheels.

Thanks for you your comment - I changed my wheel with the OEM Gt500 Shelby 18'' of 2008 with good tires on them. Much better that original wheels but obviously, I need to do some more changes.

I'm interested to hear succes stories from others.

 

[JEWC_Motorsports]

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