S550 Mustang Suspension and Powertrain Discussion

[Gray Ghost GT]

I think one of the most important investments you can make in an IRS equipped car are the coilovers with sway bars that compliment the setup. These are what I run on my C5 track car from LG Motorsports. Not cheap, but worth every penny with performance sway bars and camber kits.

 

[jmauld]

I was crawling around under my wife's challenger this afternoon and noticed that the front suspension is very similar to what is pictured for the new mustang. I guess it's a pretty popular design. It's probably the same design on most Mercedes.

 

[ArizonaGT]

Probably works better when it's not shouldered with 4300lbs of Chrysler.

 

[Vorshlag-Fair]

These are what I run on my C5 track car ... Not cheap, but worth every penny with performance sway bars and camber kits.

Oiy, let's not glorify $1995 Chinese built coilovers and say they are 1) "not cheap" (they probably cost less than $500 to import) and 2) a huge improvement over a C5's stock shocks/suspension. Performance dampers are not made in Far East sweat shops. Their Bilstein ASN based coilovers are a MUCH better shock for Corvettes than that flashy red Chinese stuff, and not much more money (although that Bilstein is a non-adjustable damper). These use real Bilstein/German built parts with massive 46mm pistons. They do have some good stuff, you just have to wade through low end the import stuff to find it.

 

[Gray Ghost GT]

Oiy, let's not glorify $1995 Chinese built coilovers and say they are 1) "not cheap" (they probably cost less than $500 to import) and 2) a huge improvement over a C5's stock shocks/suspension. Performance dampers are not made in Far East sweat shops. Their Bilstein ASN based coilovers are a MUCH better shock for Corvettes than that flashy red Chinese stuff, and not much more money (although that Bilstein is a non-adjustable damper). These use real Bilstein/German built parts with massive 46mm pistons. They do have some good stuff, you just have to wade through low end the import stuff to find it.

I have to agree that the additional $400 (actually more $$$ than that because I purchased my adjustable set on sale with shipping) for the Bilstein non-adjustable coilovers would have been a better performance buy over the LG 'adjustable' coilovers - hind sight being 20/20. You're claiming they're built in "Far East sweat shops", really?? I'm not aware of these falling apart on the street or road course like some other suspension (WL) products we're familiar with on this forum.

When you say Bilsteins are made with German parts.... Oiy, you don't think the Germans subcontract components to China... the new Mustang 5.0 Getrag MT82 transmission? Are they coming from "Far East sweat shops"? Before you blast LG Motorsports coilover, you might want to check how that coilover was designed and engineered by a company that's been in the racing business a little longer and at a higher level than yourself. Want to compare your Whiteline products?

According to Lou at LG Motorsports regarding their GT2 adjustable coilovers (red): "The GT2 uses inner pistons and shafts from a Bilstein manufacturer and we had the middle valving on the GT2 shocks built to match the Bilstein for a starting point. We build the top mounts here at LGM and the shock bodies come from a company that builds the internals for Bilstein. I will accept any challenge from any other similarly priced coil over shock package in any head to head test."

 

[Whiskey11]

S197 track 62.3F/62.9R, S550 track 62.3F/64.9R.





That was a false assumption by a few magazine editors when they saw a little bump in the combustion chamber. When you look at the top side of the head you see there is actually no room for a DI piezo injector. The heads would need to be completely redesigned for DI still.

So I was just watching Jay Leno's Garage on the 2015 Mustang and Dave Periack just said that the front track is extended 15mm and the rear track 70mm. Mr. Periack is the Mustang Chief Engineer so... yeaaah....

 

[Whiskey11]

Alright, because I'm sick of seeing rear suspension shots (seriously, who cares, it's another integral link IRS ), I asked some of the Mustang6G guys at the Detroit autoshow to take pictures of the front and they brought me this gem instead:



I can't hotlink the pictures without rehosting but here is the thread with more photos:

http://www.mustang6g.com/forums/showthread.php/s550s-double-ball-1322.html

Front knuckles look like they have a center bore through them? I don't remember seeing that on the S197 uprights. Some were speculating that these were AWD/FWD front knuckles so I wonder what platform this is shared with? Fusion? Those uprights certainly look like they'll take those rotational forces a bit better than the S197 uprights will, less distance between the "face" where the hub is at and the ears for the strut bolts.

 

[csamsh]

Yeah it definitely looks like a FWD knuckle- strut raised up to let halfshaft go through. Looks just like my Equinox.

So...problems...I'm speculating, maybe somebody else can confirm/deny that these may actually be problems.

1- the springs will be shorter than on an S197, so it will eat up bump travel even more than the S197 when lowered

2- The double balljoint setup- the tension link's balljoint cannot be lengthened to correct for lowering, so how low will we be able to go without binding it during suspension travel?

 

[jmauld]

Springs generally sit above the wheel, so they won't be different due to the knuckle. If the strut is forced to be shorter than ours, then it will likely have less travel, which is rarely a good thing.

 

[Boaisy]

Probably works better when it's not shouldered with 4300lbs of Chrysler.

 

[modernbeat]

...I'm speculating, maybe somebody else can confirm/deny that these may actually be problems.

1- the springs will be shorter than on an S197, so it will eat up bump travel even more than the S197 when lowered

2- The double balljoint setup- the tension link's balljoint cannot be lengthened to correct for lowering, so how low will we be able to go without binding it during suspension travel?

Springs generally sit above the wheel, so they won't be different due to the knuckle. If the strut is forced to be shorter than ours, then it will likely have less travel, which is rarely a good thing.

If the tire-to-tower-top distance was shorter, then I'd worry about the spring length. It does not look like it is shorter even though all the components are different than the S197. But like Jmauld mentioned, if the strut is noticably shorter then it will have a shorter stroke stock, and a similarly shorter stroke when a shortened strut is used when lowering it.

We already lower and adjust the camber and caster on E90/E80 series BMWs with similar front suspension without any issues.

 

[Whiskey11]

Alright folks, I'm going to be at an autoshow this weekend here in Omaha and the 2015 Mustang is supposed to be there. Are there any shots of anything you guys would like specifically? I plan on taking pictures of of the front suspension attachment points to see if we get camber adjustment from the factory or if it is even possible. I'm hoping I can get that close to the car to begin with.

 

[Boaisy]

I know when Vorshlag was taking the pictures, the front suspension was the area that they wished they got more of since the ones they had didn't turn out right.

 

[Whiskey11]

I know when Vorshlag was taking the pictures, the front suspension was the area that they wised they got more of since the ones they had didn't turn out right.

I'll try, my buddy just posted a picture of the display and I don't think I'm going to be able to get close enough to get pictures... it's the Guard colored Mustang.

 

[NoTicket]

Shit: http://autoblog.com/2014/06/01/2015-ford-mustang-weight-gain-300-pounds/

According to Steeda the S550 has put on 2-300 lbs.

 

[05yellowgt]

Shit: http://autoblog.com/2014/06/01/2015-ford-mustang-weight-gain-300-pounds/

According to Steeda the S550 has put on 2-300 lbs.

Maybe it is just my fight against believing it but honestly, where would that weight be coming from? The only MAJOR differences in the chassis are the front and rear suspension. The IRS is largely aluminum vs the 99-04 IRS and the front suspension may in fact be a bit heavier, but I have no data there to back that up. The core of the chassis is largely a carry over from the S197 (at least I recall reading that) and the overall dimensions and the drive trains are both carryovers. The brakes and tires are going to be bigger but that is all I can think of that could effect the weight.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Sounds like bull to me. If Steeda weighed it why would it be 200-300# and not XXX#. Do their scales just guess? Secondly Steeda gets a huge favor getting cars early. Running thier mouths about the cars weight won't be getting them any favors in the future.

And Steeda has a bunch of hacks working for them.

 

[NoTicket]

IRS adds weight. The imprecise 2-300# could be attributable to the fact that different trims weight more and less (V6, GT, Premium, Track Pack).

Secondly the car is wider, and longer. The chassis is absolutely not a carry over.

I want it to way the same or less. Usually when there is something good to announce, a company will tout that figure. The weight has yet to be revealed, which makes me think it likely is going to weigh more.

 

[Boaisy]

http://www.steeda.com/blog/2014/05/2015-mustang-product-development-update/

dat engine cover yo.

 

[Department Of Boost]

IRS adds weight.

Internet myth. IRS can weigh more, less or the same.

The imprecise 2-300# could be attributable to the fact that different trims weight more and less (V6, GT, Premium, Track Pack).

Steeda has one car in each trim package and weighed them all? Um, no.

Usually when there is something good to announce, a company will tout that figure. The weight has yet to be revealed, which makes me think it likely is going to weigh more.

EVERYONE I know at Ford, and that is a lot of people say it is lighter. They are not exactly sure how much at this point so no announcement. Same thing with the power. It will make more power, but they haven't locked the tune that will be used. So no announcement.

I'm not saying it won't weigh more, or it will weigh less. I'm just saying that the above source sounds like bullshit.