2 things

[pieperz06]

so im wondering 2 thing obviously

where do i start when i want to adjust my d-specs and how will i now when they are to hard/to soft what will that feel like. and i need to know things like if they should be different settings front to rear and what bigger gaps in damping will do and how all this effects the car so when i go to autox and test things out i will know what i need to do to get them adjusted just rite.

second im thinking about doing long tubes now and im wondering what yall think about long tubes and shitty tires. im thinking that i may get to much power and i will just be spinning when i dont want to and im worried that i will move my power band to high in the rpm for autox because as of now i rarley get in to 3rd. i dont know if im just dumb or just miss informed

 

[DusterRT]

so im wondering 2 thing obviously

where do i start when i want to adjust my d-specs and how will i now when they are to hard/to soft what will that feel like. and i need to know things like if they should be different settings front to rear and what bigger gaps in damping will do and how all this effects the car so when i go to autox and test things out i will know what i need to do to get them adjusted just rite.

I would run them mid-adjustment for a while (or some other suggested starting point), and get to know how the car acts with the new dampeners as a sort of baseline. Then, I would highly highly suggest you find an instructor and/or someone else experienced with these kinds of cars to drive and/or ride along to help you out in getting them dialed in (they'll know better how the chassis should respond to work well on the course). You're pretty new to all of this and IMO, drastically changing your car before every event or every run isn't going to be beneficial at all.

second im thinking about doing long tubes now and im wondering what yall think about long tubes and shitty tires. im thinking that i may get to much power and i will just be spinning when i dont want to and im worried that i will move my power band to high in the rpm for autox because as of now i rarley get in to 3rd. i dont know if im just dumb or just miss informed

Oh, this one's easy. Skip the headers and spend the money on some decent tires! All the horsepower in the world is useless if you can't control it.

 

[pieperz06]

lol yha i am new to all this that is why i am trying to figure all this out.

i dont know that i want tires yet but i know i need them

 

[darkstar november]

good tires and suspension on a stock car will net a better times than shitty tires and full bolt ons

 

[DusterRT]

i dont know that i want tires yet but i know i need them

In that case I would DEFINITELY skip the headers and start looking towards a blower. You're going to need some serious horsepower to overcome bad tires.

But seriously man..I think you're severely underestimating the value of some good rubber under your car. And you just said it yourself..you need them anyway.

 

[darkstar november]

In that case I would DEFINITELY skip the headers and start looking towards a blower. You're going to need some serious horsepower to overcome bad tires.

lots of power+shitty tires+turns+inexperienced road racer=wall impacts

 

[pieperz06]

In that case I would DEFINITELY skip the headers and start looking towards a blower. You're going to need some serious horsepower to overcome bad tires.

But seriously man..I think you're severely underestimating the value of some good rubber under your car. And you just said it yourself..you need them anyway.

yeah i know i need tires but the thing is that since autox is only 1 time a month i dont wana spend the money until i get more experienced with my car so im just blowing money away

if i was to get some thing i would get some houiser a6's on some 18's but im going to have to get rims and the tires because i like having cheap street tires that i can burn away when the time calls for it

 

[Cookiemonster]

Just a heads up. Those hoosier A6s are only gunna last you about 40 runs..

 

[DusterRT]

Well I guess I have to ask..what do you mean by "shitty tires"? Are they old, hard and worn out, or are they just not R-compounds?

I was going to recommend something like the NT05 or Star Specs that are a good compromise between grip and treadwear..something you can use (and enjoy!) every day rather than once a month. Many would argue they're better to learn on than R-compounds as they'll give way more audible feedback when at or approaching the limits of adhesion.

 

[Vapour Trails]

Just a heads up. Those hoosier A6s are only gunna last you about 40 runs..

They do wear out fast, but not that fast. Kumho V710s are probably a better choice in terms of longevity, while giving up a tiny amount of grip to the A6, which isn't an issue for someone starting out, there are much bigger variables.

As far as D-spec settings, it's going to depend on the surface you race on. In my case, the surface is bumpy and I found 3 turns out front and 3 turns out rear was the best compromise. At stiffer settings (2 out front, 1 out back) throttle on oversteer was more pronouced and the car felt skittish. Softer settings, (4 out front & rear) produced a sloppy feel.

Despite the 0-7.5 turn range of the D-specs, I've found only a narrow range really useful for street or race use. Anything softer than 5 turns out is just terrible for anything other than a highway trip. The sweet spot is 2-4 turns. Experiment in that range.

 

[RedMosesSC]

with D-Specs, i find pretty wide range of usefull settings, this is most liikely due to the shitty roads in NYC.

In general, you always want the front of the car to be more stiff than the rear, when the settings are eqaual or close, i find the rear is far too tail happy.

At the Autox - I find that the stiff it is the better but too stiff will not allow enough travel on uneven surfaces, so you have to adjust based on the venue. Ive had most luck with the front at 1.5 - 2 turns and the rear at 3, i generaly adjust after each run if i feel the car is not even, Sumn as little as a 1/4 turn will affect the manner of the car when turning hard.

On the street - NYC roads vary so much, from smooth to miles craters. Because my car is a vert and the Steeda springs are lower in the rear i think its much more harsh in the back, the front has more travel so i keep it relatively firm. For cruising on crappy streets ive found that 5 Front and 7 rear is the most tolerable but the rear tends to get jumpy when pushing the limits on turns.

On the country roads - 3 in the front and 4 at the rear seems to be the cars happy medium for the twisties and chicanes.

As for tires, they will def make a huge difference but theres no reason you cant learn to drive your car and improve your times with shitty tires, this way when you step up to performance tires or R comps your technique will be correct. Everytime you change parts you have to relearn to drive the car to a certain degree, so drastic changes will set you back a bit. As long as your times are imporving throught the day then it really doesnt matter what type of mods you have, Autox is a rece against yourself, so you dont have to be as concerned with the gear until you want to become competative against other in your class.

 

[pieperz06]

with D-Specs, i find pretty wide range of usefull settings, this is most liikely due to the shitty roads in NYC.

In general, you always want the front of the car to be more stiff than the rear, when the settings are eqaual or close, i find the rear is far too tail happy.

At the Autox - I find that the stiff it is the better but too stiff will not allow enough travel on uneven surfaces, so you have to adjust based on the venue. Ive had most luck with the front at 1.5 - 2 turns and the rear at 3, i generaly adjust after each run if i feel the car is not even, Sumn as little as a 1/4 turn will affect the manner of the car when turning hard.

On the street - NYC roads vary so much, from smooth to miles craters. Because my car is a vert and the Steeda springs are lower in the rear i think its much more harsh in the back, the front has more travel so i keep it relatively firm. For cruising on crappy streets ive found that 5 Front and 7 rear is the most tolerable but the rear tends to get jumpy when pushing the limits on turns.

On the country roads - 3 in the front and 4 at the rear seems to be the cars happy medium for the twisties and chicanes.

As for tires, they will def make a huge difference but theres no reason you cant learn to drive your car and improve your times with shitty tires, this way when you step up to performance tires or R comps your technique will be correct. Everytime you change parts you have to relearn to drive the car to a certain degree, so drastic changes will set you back a bit. As long as your times are imporving throught the day then it really doesnt matter what type of mods you have, Autox is a rece against yourself, so you dont have to be as concerned with the gear until you want to become competative against other in your class.

thies are the tires that i have
http://www.sumitomotire.com/cars/products/HTR/htrz2.aspx

they very hard

i have been improving almost every run at autox until the last month i kind of hit a dead spot and just hovering around the same times

 

[pieperz06]

im also living in a college dorm so i dont have much room to keep them. but by summer i should have a house and a garage so that would be a better time to get them lol. that's a kinda important reason that i don't want them that i just realized while i was cleaning out my room today

 

[SoundGuyDave]

Piperz06: 220 treadwear really isn't all that hard of a tire... The Dunlop Star-Spec is a 200 treadwear tire, and so is the NT05, and both are pretty popular with the HPDE/AutoX crowd. No, neither are as grippy as the Hoosier R6, never mind the A6, but you'll get some decent wear out of them. If you have good tread on the Sumi tires, I would call that good. I ran ONE SET of Nitto 555's for nearly 3 years, with a 300 treadwear rating. I ran them until they were completely heat-cycled out and would get greasy after 5-7 minutes on track, BUT, because I did run them, I learned car control skills that I wouldn't have with sticky rubber. Now that I do have sticky rubber (Star Spec wets, Hoosier R6 drys), I know what the car itself feels like at the edge, and can run it there a lot more consistently and confidently.

As for your run times stabilizing, assuming that you're not extracting 100% from the car right now, you've hit a plateau. Throwing kit at it is not going to do anything but make that plateau slightly faster. If you are running consistently, hitting your marks EVERY run, and each run is within a couple of tenths of each other, then it's time to hit a drivers school to learn the more advanced techniques, and ditch the bad ones you've picked up. What you learn at a school will stay with you for life, unlike a set of tires or new dampers, or a blower, or whatever. You may want to think about investing in a Traqmate, or another DA unit like that, so that you can study what you were doing on-track with hard data. You may just find that there were periods that you were just coasting, for example, and if you can extend your acceleration right into the braking zone, that technique right there could net you a half-second on an autoX course, or a full second or more on an open track.

For the car, identify what specific handling or driving issues you have, and then work on eliminating them, one by one, AFTER you have trained yourself to drive it at the limit of what you have. If you're not using ALL of your braking potential, for example, you're throwing away time. Going to race brakes will not get you all that time back, it will just give you more confidence to use 70% of them. That last 30% (or 10%) is where you're giving up lap times...

 

[Vapour Trails]

I don't undestand the comment about getting the same times. Aren't your courses changing every event? Time is only relevant to a specific layout. Judge your performance relative to the usual drivers you encounter and the best in your local club/group.

And throw those tires in the trash.

 

[Kaldar142]

While those tires are not the best, just stay with them until they've run their course.

If you can drive fast with shitty tires, imagine what you can do with good tires

I know an instructor who drove his foxbody into the ground and didn't want to spend a dime on it unless he had too, tracked the piss out of it... even used the stock tires, just kept rotating them to help tire wear! When the time came to switch to R-comps, he was able to take FULL advantage of the tires.

 

[darkstar november]

While those tires are not the best, just stay with them until they've run their course.

If you can drive fast with shitty tires, imagine what you can do with good tires

I know an instructor who drove his foxbody into the ground and didn't want to spend a dime on it unless he had too, tracked the piss out of it... even used the stock tires, just kept rotating them to help tire wear! When the time came to switch to R-comps, he was able to take FULL advantage of the tires.

i started autoxing with sway bars springs and rikken raptors lol. i ran like that for a while til i bought a set of hoosiers

 

[pieperz06]

I don't undestand the comment about getting the same times. Aren't your courses changing every event? Time is only relevant to a specific layout. Judge your performance relative to the usual drivers you encounter and the best in your local club/group.

And throw those tires in the trash.

we do a weird thing down here and we run the same course 3 months in a row then change it i like it because it allows me to change things and see the real track difference

 

[Vapour Trails]

we do a weird thing down here and we run the same course 3 months in a row then change it i like it because it allows me to change things and see the real track difference

That is strange. Part of the fun of autocross is that the course always changes so you have to figure out the fastest line each event, and quickly. This makes it as much as a mental task as a physical one. Being able to visual the entire course in my mind prior to racing helps a lot in anticipating the next element before it is reached.

I would ask to go on a ride-a-long with a fast driver, it should open your eyes to were you are losing time. But in the end, if your rubber isn't up to par, you won't be running near the top no matter what you do and you will likely get frustrated. You can become an expert running on shit tires but when you get a sticky tire, you'll have to learn all over again, especially with R-comps. The slip angles will be completely different! Your brain and eyes will need a complete recalibration. And since you can't push nearly as hard with a crappy tire, you won't learn the absurd aggression necessary to be fast in the S197 on the autocross course. The first time I had a ride in an S197 driven by a national level driver on R-comps, I had to change my shorts. Track and autocross are completely different beasts, with the latter placing more importance on grip.

 

[pieperz06]

That is strange. Part of the fun of autocross is that the course always changes so you have to figure out the fastest line each event, and quickly. This makes it as much as a mental task as a physical one. Being able to visual the entire course in my mind prior to racing helps a lot in anticipating the next element before it is reached.

I would ask to go on a ride-a-long with a fast driver, it should open your eyes to were you are losing time. But in the end, if your rubber isn't up to par, you won't be running near the top no matter what you do and you will likely get frustrated. You can become an expert running on shit tires but when you get a sticky tire, you'll have to learn all over again, especially with R-comps. The slip angles will be completely different! Your brain and eyes will need a complete recalibration. And since you can't push nearly as hard with a crappy tire, you won't learn the absurd aggression necessary to be fast in the S197 on the autocross course. The first time I had a ride in an S197 driven by a national level driver on R-comps, I had to change my shorts. Track and autocross are completely different beasts, with the latter placing more importance on grip.

yah i have done several ride along with the guy that consistently way faster than every one. im 2 seconds behind him now and he has ridden with me and told me that the one thing keeping me back is that im not pushing the car as far as i can and that there were a few places that i was coasting through that i didn't need to.

for me it is nice to do the autox the same 3 months in a row for now because i can work on specific things and so i can get better at them faster. we don't have much room because we race on an air strip so we cant do to much and so they only have like 3 or 4 different tracks they they can run.