Building a cam n/a 3v combo

[BruceH]

But im doing zex wet kit.

Then why did you say you were going for 350 na?

 

[marcspaz]

What kind of times did you run with that setup?

My car was 100% full interior... no weight savings parts at all. No stripping stuff to save weight. With me in it it weighed 3890 lbs measured at MIR. I could get it down the track consistent 12.1's. I have 100% certainty that if there was a driver that weighed 200 lbs or less (I'm 400 lbs), it would have done 11's. If I did weight savings and set the car up to drag race, I know i could have been much faster.

When I built the car, I wasn't focused on drag racing. I built a car that could drag race, corner carve, or take my family from DC to SoCal in the middle of summer in comfort.

 

[K_Brogoitti]

I'm almost maxed out on N/A with mine. Lots of fun but I tend to agree with saving the money for a blower. Getting a dyno tune is more important than a lot of parts, seems like that would help a lot of guys here that aren't seeing the results they expected from mods

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[jmauld]

12.1 sounds pretty quick to me, especially for a car that isn't prepped for drag racing.

 

[BruceH]

I'm almost maxed out on N/A with mine. Lots of fun but I tend to agree with saving the money for a blower. Getting a dyno tune is more important than a lot of parts, seems like that would help a lot of guys here that aren't seeing the results they expected from mods

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Just because a shop has a dyno doesn't mean they can tune. Good data logging is better than a dyno imo. FYI this is meant in a friendly way. Choose your tuner wisely.

 

[marcspaz]

12.1 sounds pretty quick to me, especially for a car that isn't prepped for drag racing.

Thanks bro... The car was a blast to drive and was my daily driver. I would say it was my favorite car of all the cars I've owned.

Here are a couple pics with the street/road race tires...

This is with the Drag tires...

My favorite idle video...




A very nice guy an acquaintance of mine put this together...

 

[08GT_kid]

Then why did you say you were going for 350 na?

Cause its not good to spray alot so sometimes i would like to run all motor.

 

[K_Brogoitti]

I agree Bruce, just cause shop has a dyno doesn't mean squat. Datalogging doesn't mean beans either unless you got someone behind the screen that knows what they're looking at

 

[BruceH]

I agree Bruce, just cause shop has a dyno doesn't mean squat. Datalogging doesn't mean beans either unless you got someone behind the screen that knows what they're looking at

Very true. Where in the Columbia basin are you?

 

[YoungBlood]

you can get ported/polished heads fully assembled with beefier springs for 2k. cams for $700. $2700 and you could see mid to mid high 300's I bet. cmpd's would be a good idea for either setup. But boosting the car you gotta worry about the engines strength, add in extra for gauges, around here getting a dyno tune for boosted applications is $150 more, it all starts to add up. I'm not versed in adding more fuel to a cam like hotrods with just basic bolt ons however. If it yeilds good results I'd be all for it but I don't think the car is going to be running out of fuel with those mods. Hell you can run ported/polished heads, a big cam, and an intake manifold on the stock fuel system from what I've seen

 

[marcspaz]

The stock fuel system is okay for an NA car up to about 370 - 375.

If you look at the dyno sheet I posted in this thread, regardless of what I commanded, I was running out of fuel in the high revs, starting at about 5750 RPM. The higher it revved, the more it would lean out.

If you are going to go over that 370-375 mark, upgrade to 39lbs injectors and get a BAP. I didn't, kept racing, burned 2 valves at the same time (same cylinder) and lost the motor. I saved $300 on a BAP and it cost me $15k for a complete new engine build (not including labor).

 

[jmauld]

If you're doing heads and cams, is there a good way to raise the compression? Without doing work to the bottom end. Or would it just be best to replace the pistons?

 

[Jason09GT]

^^ not sure if serious??

 

[Lowfast]

I would assume you could mill the heads slightly but replacing the pistons would be the more sound route and would have the benefit of better internals. Of course if you are doing pistons might as well throw in at a minimum some Boss rods if not aftermarket forged units.

 

[BruceH]

you can get ported/polished heads fully assembled with beefier springs for 2k. cams for $700. $2700 and you could see mid to mid high 300's I bet. cmpd's would be a good idea for either setup. But boosting the car you gotta worry about the engines strength, add in extra for gauges, around here getting a dyno tune for boosted applications is $150 more, it all starts to add up. I'm not versed in adding more fuel to a cam like hotrods with just basic bolt ons however. If it yeilds good results I'd be all for it but I don't think the car is going to be running out of fuel with those mods. Hell you can run ported/polished heads, a big cam, and an intake manifold on the stock fuel system from what I've seen

What was your experience with the different mods? One thing I learned is that heads and cams need long tubes. You also need a good tuner to tune for them driveability wise. A supercharger with no other mods is fairly simple to tune for driveabiltiy imo. The supercharger is also only making power when you want it to.

The stock fuel pump is fairly stout. I was able to make 408rwhp with a non intercooled whipple, the 32lb injectors that come with the kit, and the stock fuel pump on an otherwise stock 4.6 3v. Add a bap, bigger injectors, and a power feeder wire upgrade and the stock pump will handle over 500 supercharged hp.

If you're doing heads and cams, is there a good way to raise the compression? Without doing work to the bottom end. Or would it just be best to replace the pistons?

A thinner head gasket, milled head, and decking the block will all add compression.

Play around with these calculators and see what affects what.

http://www.wallaceracing.com/Calculators.htm

 

[jmauld]

Do you know how much you can safely mill from the heads with the 127500 cams?

 

[BruceH]

Can you take 1mm off the head?

That's a good question. 1mm is about .040" iirc. The Livernois/FRPP stage 3 heads have a 48cc combustion chamber. The stock chamber is 51.3cc and the stage 2 heads are 53cc.

Taking .040" off of the stock heads should be worth about one full point not counting what it does to the combustion chamber.

 

[jmauld]

Do the stage 2 heads lower the compression ratio?

 

[BruceH]

Do the stage 2 heads lower the compression ratio?

Yes.

 

[jmauld]

Well, that should be some serious motivation to go straight for the stage 3 heads.