Tires

[CammedS197]

Thanks fast Ed!

Our two piece driveshafts are good at high speeds right? Just want to make sure lol!

 

[Norm Peterson]

Our two piece driveshafts are good at high speeds right? Just want to make sure lol!

Seems to be. Mine repeatedly sees upward of 6000 rpm - down the faster straights my 5900 upshift indicator is blinking and I'm in 4th gear (1.00:1). That's about 125 mph on tires that are listed at 25.9" tall, or about where you'd be with 3.73 axle gears and 27" tall tires.

265's will get you started, but I think you'll outgrow 265's on 9.5" wheels soon enough, on 9" wheels even faster. That's actually a decent street combination - I'm currently running 265/40-18's on 18x9.5 wheels for street duty. But even though the actual tread width of these 265/40's is the same as my 285/35's and they're the same make and model tire, the grip, response, and general "feel" are all noticeably "off" from what the 285/35's on 18x11's provide (same day, same road testing). So which will it be, two small steps up from 235's or one giant step now?


I'm surprised you could still source the blue brake fluid, as it was recalled a couple of years ago specifically because of its color. And I think Florida had been aware of the matter further back than that.


Norm

 

[2Fass240us]

I'm surprised you could still source the blue brake fluid, as it was recalled a couple of years ago specifically because of its color. And I think Florida had been aware of the matter further back than that.

Norm

I can see how it was decommissioned, given it's primary constituents were puppy tears, unicorn blood, and viable presidential candidates.

I loved that stuff for bleeding. Now I need a spectral analysis device to determine if the new fluid is coming through.

 

[Speedboosted]

Nitto NT01 is a full race compound. It cannot be driven on the street, even just to an autocross and back.

No it's not...A 100 TW tire is not a full race compound. You could street drive all day on that tire if you wanted.

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/d...byName.do?tmn=NT-01&typ=Passenger/Performance

 

[Mach2burnout]

No it's not...A 100 TW tire is not a full race compound. You could street drive all day on that tire if you wanted.



http://www.discounttiredirect.com/d...byName.do?tmn=NT-01&typ=Passenger/Performance

True, just don't get caught in the rain.


Sent from iPhone

 

[Sky Render]

No it's not...A 100 TW tire is not a full race compound. You could street drive all day on that tire if you wanted.

http://www.discounttiredirect.com/d...byName.do?tmn=NT-01&typ=Passenger/Performance

Yeah, go do that for a couple hundred miles and then report back.

For all intents and purposes, that is a race tire.

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[Speedboosted]

Yeah, go do that for a couple hundred miles and then report back.

For all intents and purposes, that is a race tire.

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In what way? Not trying to argue. Are you saying they would wear out too fast, be too noisy, wander on the road, what is it? I know plenty of people that drive around on the NT01 for a lot more than just to and from the track and they love it.

 

[Norm Peterson]

I wonder how much of a heat cycle it costs every time NT01's are driven on in what's likely to be at least moderately enthusiastic street driving. I can't see people just putzing around town on tires like these the same way people who buy cheap touring tires do.

I know for a fact that the RT615 tires (think "Street Touring" autocross about ten years ago) gave up the best of their grip long before they were worn out, and if I go look I'm pretty sure that I'll see 200 for the TW number. They still grip better than new mid-level all-seasons with a few "break in" miles on them and run at much smaller slip angles, but that's hardly a performance claim to get excited about. 100 TW tires are going to behave much the same, just more so.

Streetable? Sure, but at what cost?


Norm

 

[Sky Render]

In what way? Not trying to argue. Are you saying they would wear out too fast, be too noisy, wander on the road, what is it? I know plenty of people that drive around on the NT01 for a lot more than just to and from the track and they love it.

The 01 or the 05? Because I've seen what happens when you put about 100 highway miles on an 01, and the tire looks like it went through a shredder. I've never heard of anyone using an 01 as a street tire.

Anything 100 treadwear and below is usually referred to as an "R-comp."

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[Mach2burnout]

I've driven mine some on the street. It didn't shred them nor are they hard to drive on. They do tramline terribly but other than that they drive fine. Not any long drives, about 25 miles one way and some town driving. This was only because I really wanted to drive the car and didn't want to swap tires. I have ran them for 2 full seasons and part of a 3rd and they still grip great. Oh and 1 track day on them. But I think the debate is can they be run on the street, yes for a summer only tire and they are DOT legal. If a person has the $$$ to run that tire on the street more power to them. In the rain though...
Yes they are R-compound tires.


Sent from iPhone

 

[DevGittinJr]

IIRC, the Pirelli PZero Corsa (60 utqg) was the OE tire on the Boss LS. Although not necessarily economical, sub 100 utqg tires (OE and aftermarket) are found on high-end sports cars quite frequently. I'm not arguing for it, I'm just pointing that out.

 

[Mark Aubele]

Back in the day I put like 3000 street miles and countless track days and autocrosses on RA1s and they sucked the same as they did when new.

 

[SoundGuyDave]

You know the Camaro SS is what started that whole "factory R-compound" thing, right? Magazine wars. The motoring press would test-drive a car and rave about the handling, the grip, etc. Previous versions of the Camaro were getting killed by the Mustang in everything BUT straight-line speed. So, when the SS (and specifically the ZL-1) were released, they shipped with Trofeo R's, and suddenly "two ton Tessie" could take a corner, and was killing the Mustang, shod with whatever crap Ford was putting on them. The GT500 Track Pack cars were pretty well engineered to do a FANTASTIC 3-lap blast, then just heat-soaked themselves to death. It's all a game to get "the nod" from the press. It's 1969 all over again, but this time without Parnelli Jones (whoops! Didn't Saleen do a PJ car?), and without a 429 shoehorned into an engine bay 3/4" too narrow to actually fit the engine...

I think by any common definition, REGARDLESS of tread-block design, 100TW is the break point between "hot street" and "race compound" tires. Hoosier and BFG both stamp them "DOT" but add "For racing purposes only, not for highway use" molded right into the sidewall. The NT-01 is a 100TW tire, as was it's sister, the Toyo RA-1. That used to be the spec tire for CMC and American Iron, and neither are remotely close to a "street tire class."

CAN you drive them on the street? Sure. You can drive around with M/T slicks and the whole big-n-little thing too. Doesn't make it the smart thing to do, though.

Norm had a great point about heat-cycling, as well. We all know that the first handful of cycles are when the tire is prime. After that, the grip falls off, sometimes like a rock. Do you really want to burn 25-50% of the tire's prime life just getting to and from the track? All the track-rats that I know jealously guard their "good" set from excess heat cycles to keep them prime for quals or the race (or the "money" TT session). It's not uncommon to see a different set of tires on the car for each session on a race weekend. Junk for practice, prime/sticker for quals, and then the 3-4 cycle tires for the race...

Or, are some of the guys running this stuff on the street also doing the whole cars-n-coffee thing? No judgement; they have their thing, we have ours. They would crap themselves if they looked closely at a "real" race car. Hell, the last time mine saw a clay bar was probably six years ago! But that said, if the most use the tires get are the 10-minute drive to the local hangout and back, then really, who cares? The TW number becomes a bragging rights thing, just like a dyno sheet.

 

[SoundGuyDave]

Back in the day I put like 3000 street miles and countless track days and autocrosses on RA1s and they sucked the same as they did when new.

Yeah, but that was before the whole "new coke" thing. Disco the RA-1, and introduce the R-888, which absolutely sucked if the car weighed more than 2500lbs. Then, bring back the "new improved" RA-1, which lost all the consistency, and that charming "fastest just before they cord" tendency. Then, blow that off and introduce the RR. 40TW, competing directly with the R6, but just not doing nearly as well. The old RA-1 sucked, but it sucked forever. The RR feels like a cycled-out R6 when fresh, greases up pretty easily, but I have to admit that you just can't kill the damn things, no matter how hard you try. Ah, memories!!

 

[DevGittinJr]

You know the Camaro SS is what started that whole "factory R-compound" thing, right?

I didn't specifically know that, nor was I implying that it's a good idea. Also, I do understand that one could copy the rest of the Boss LS suspension and more than likely not attain the same grip levels without the sticky tires. And, if driven on the street, those tires won't be sticky for long. I was just pointing out that people daily drive those tires all the time. Street drag tires on the rear as well. I've specifically pondered the heat-cycle issue, so thanks for clearing that up. I think we're both thinking in terms of trade-offs; however, you obviously did a much better job of conveying that.

 

[Mach2burnout]

Obviously there is some idea here that street driven tires under normal driving actually heat up enough to heat cycle. Yeah, I'd need to see some real world data to believe that. As it is I'll may have to do some testing of that myself.


Sent from iPhone

 

[Sky Render]

Obviously there is some idea here that street driven tires under normal driving actually heat up enough to heat cycle. Yeah, I'd need to see some real world data to believe that. As it is I'll may have to do some testing of that myself.


Sent from iPhone

Street driving WILL heat up R-comps enough to heat cycle them. They are softer and stickier, after all.

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[Mach2burnout]

Someone explain what is considered as an actual "heat cycle" 30, 40, 60, 100 degrees above ambient?
Personally I don't think 30-40 degrees above ambient can be considered a heat cycle, if so then most people's race tires are heat cycling while sitting in a rack inside their enclosed trailer or inside their race shop.


Sent from iPhone

 

[Norm Peterson]

Probably not a full-range heat cycle, but there will be some accumulated (adverse) effect nonetheless.


Norm

 

[Sky Render]

Someone explain what is considered as an actual "heat cycle" 30, 40, 60, 100 degrees above ambient?
Personally I don't think 30-40 degrees above ambient can be considered a heat cycle, if so then most people's race tires are heat cycling while sitting in a rack inside their enclosed trailer or inside their race shop.


Sent from iPhone

180*F, according to Tire Rack.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=66

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