the cause of #8

[AMChrisRose]

I think the problem is that tuners will always blame the mechanics and mechanics will always blame the tuner. It is what it is.

In this case, I'm not convinced that there isn't an underlying problem. However, I am convinced that with the right tuning, you can avoid the underlying problem. Confident enough that we offer a warranty covering it.

 

[BAKnBLK2010]

I think the problem is that tuners will always blame the mechanics and mechanics will always blame the tuner. It is what it is.

In this case, I'm not convinced that there isn't an underlying problem. However, I am convinced that with the right tuning, you can avoid the underlying problem. Confident enough that we offer a warranty covering it.

Of course there is an underlying problem. Ford was aware of the problem early on in their testing of the new motor. In the factory calibration they compensate for the problem within the factory tune. It has taken most of the big name tuners a while to figure this out and now everyone is making the same adjustments to the tune that Ford has done since the beginning. Many tuners rushed out and provided aftermarket tunes for the new 5.0 based on old methods that were proven on the 4.6 motors having no idea about the #8 problem. You can't really blame the tuners when they didn't know the problem exhisted. This has been a learning process for everyone and a few 5.0 owners have paid a hefty price.

 

[Bmr4life]

Of course there is an underlying problem. Ford was aware of the problem early on in their testing of the new motor. In the factory calibration they compensate for the problem within the factory tune. It has taken most of the big name tuners a while to figure this out and now everyone is making the same adjustments to the tune that Ford has done since the beginning. Many tuners rushed out and provided aftermarket tunes for the new 5.0 based on old methods that were proven on the 4.6 motors having no idea about the #8 problem. You can't really blame the tuners when they didn't know the problem exhisted. This has been a learning process for everyone and a few 5.0 owners have paid a hefty price.

How are you so sure of this?

 

[CPRsm]

How are you so sure of this?

Because the spark plug will tell all. The factory tune in this car favored 6 and 8. Problem is many tuners don't pull spark plugs anymore.


In order from left to right, these were taken. This is #5

You can't really blame the tuners when they didn't know the problem exhisted.

Sure you can. That is the tuners job. Anyone can plug in a tune, globally add timing and lean it out. Knowing when to stop, how much and what is safe is why you pay someone else to do it

 

[Bmr4life]

Because the spark plug will tell all. The factory tune in this car favored 6 and 8. Problem is many tuners don't pull spark plugs anymore.


In order from left to right, these were taken. This is #5

Sure you can. That is the tuners job. Anyone can plug in a tune, globally add timing and lean it out. Knowing when to stop, how much and what is safe is why you pay someone else to do it

What am I supposed to see? The slight discoloration on the bent part?

 

[CPRsm]

Yup, tells you how much heat is in the cylinder.

 

[Bmr4life]

Yup, tells you how much heat is in the cylinder.

Good find.

 

[KungFuHamster]

Good find.

i think those are his plugs.

 

[Bmr4life]

i think those are his plugs.

I thought they were also.

 

[lito]

Because the spark plug will tell all. The factory tune in this car favored 6 and 8. Problem is many tuners don't pull spark plugs anymore.

Why the tune?

 

[ZLLJ]

Sure you can. That is the tuners job. Anyone can plug in a tune, globally add timing and lean it out. Knowing when to stop, how much and what is safe is why you pay someone else to do it

Thank you for saying that. It is the tuners responsibility to know the engines weak point and limits.

 

[DIB5.0]

This is what Justin at VMP told me


Don’t run a stupid aggressive tune and you’ll be fine

Let the KS work as needed

Run the a/f 12:1, traditionally rich for an NA car, but I have not seen 5.0s make any power power at 13:1 a/f

Don’t run stupid timing, this is a 11:1 CR motor with a factory premium fuel cal, the factory did a pretty good job, there is only 10-15rwhp peak to be gained safely (lots of other little ways you can make the car feel good).

 

[tbi0904]

Even if someone produces one, the all enlightened forum know it alls on every forum will scream BS. Post pics. If they do than, BS the car wasnt stock or wasnt their car etc.

You can't blame some people for wanting proof as at least one douchebag got caught lying about his car being stock when it blew.

 

[Black 5.0]

Of course there is an underlying problem. Ford was aware of the problem early on in their testing of the new motor. In the factory calibration they compensate for the problem within the factory tune.

Would you care to provide us with some proof to this statement? Maybe an article explaining the 'underlying problem' in detail so that the rest of us can see how Ford took care of this? Thanks

 

[BAKnBLK2010]

Would you care to provide us with some proof to this statement? Maybe an article explaining the 'underlying problem' in detail so that the rest of us can see how Ford took care of this? Thanks

Sorry can't provide proof. I can only go on what I was told by a Ford engineer that was in on the development of the 5.0 platform. I am in no way making any of this stuff up and only sharing what I was told to be the truth. They took care of the problem by compensating for it in the factory calibrations. The Copperhead PCM allows for each cylinder to be calibrated individually with the right software.

 

[CPRsm]

Why the tune?

The tune is the only thing that can really be changed. Ford wouldn't go back and re-design an intake to fix the problem when they can easily and safely adjust the tune. Solid cams in push rod motors you can change the lash to hurt a cyl and that would accomplish the same thing, but hurt power as well. I see a lot of distribution problems with carbed intakes and it's not as easy to fix like it with sequential EFI. Blowing thru a carb making goo power will show some problems. But these intake only have to flow air, not air and fuel.

 

[19COBRA93]

All you could really do is add fuel in the hotter cylinders. There's nothing you could do as far as cam timing in individual cylinders. I guess ignition timing could be altered in individual cylinders...

 

[BAKnBLK2010]

All you could really do is add fuel in the hotter cylinders. There's nothing you could do as far as cam timing in individual cylinders. I guess ignition timing could be altered in individual cylinders...

You can adjust both fuel and timing with each cylinder

 

[SD07GT]

You can adjust both fuel and timing with each cylinder

When did the oak processor become a stand alone unit ?

 

[Black 5.0]

Sorry can't provide proof. I can only go on what I was told by a Ford engineer that was in on the development of the 5.0 platform. I am in no way making any of this stuff up and only sharing what I was told to be the truth. They took care of the problem by compensating for it in the factory calibrations. The Copperhead PCM allows for each cylinder to be calibrated individually with the right software.

Fine then. I would think at the point Ford 'fixed' the problem, max and min standards were developed for tuning purposes and that aftermarket tunes would have been part of the equation. After all, they developed and built this engine to be upgraded with a supercharger and even designed the heads for later use of direct injection.

As a matter of fact (according to Ford engineers) the weak link to this engine is the connecting rods as they recommend changing them to a set of Manely's when a supercharger is added.

You know, it's hard for me to fathom that the engineers on this project would have no conpunction to hide a problem. After all, these guys, for the most part are hot rod nuts themselves. If there is some sort of problem with this engine, they would be the first people that would want to know about it and fix it, not try to hide it.

As I've said in other posts in other forums on subjects like these, no engine is bullet proof and people will find ways to blow them up without intention to do so.