Desperate Need Help Please...Whipple Belt Issues

[Sasquatch]

Well I have been dealing with a belt noise and shredding issue ever since I installed the Whipple a few months ago. I even put the car in a trailer and took it to Whipple. They can see no reason for the car to shred belts or make noise. But yet it still does. Whipple has been great to work with and they are just as frustrated as me. As a final attmept, I installed an 8 rib GI Joe kit. The belt was on less than 25 miles and I noticed that it was starting to shred. This is the first time I have been able to catch the belt before it shredded completly. It appears that it is starting on the smooth side of the belt and down into the ribs. Everything is aligned. I have replaced the tensioner and it is not bent. I loosend the intake to see if there was any fore or aft movement and there is not.

Now for the noise. Everytime I install a new belt it is perfectly quiet. No noise at all. Once I drive the car and it cools the next time I start the car it is squealing. The more drive cycles the car has the squeal is louder on cold starts and takes longer to go away. Once the car is full operating temp and has been driven for several miles the noise is gone until the car cools.

When the belt is making noise I can put a small amount of water on a paper towel and hold it to the rib side of the belt and the noise is gone until the water dries. The water has to be on the rib side holding the towel on the flat side or the sides of the belt does not make the noise go away only the rib side. I'm not talking about a lot of water either just a damp paper towel. I can also change the pitch of the noise by taking tension off the belt. When I do this I notice that the belt slides back on the tensioner idler towards the radiator and the noise stops and as I let the tesioner back down the belt rides towards the block on the tensioner idler and the noise is back. If I install the stock belt the noise is gone as well.

I also installed a 6 rib belt on the 8 rib pulleys to see if it would want to walk one way or the other and it does not but is just as noisy.


Sorry for the long post but I can't live with this any longer and don't want to remove the blower.

Any thoughts??

Thanks,

Sam

 

[cekim]

Was it you who whipple had add shims to the pulley? I don't have a whipple, but I have been following the various threads and it seems that there is a problem with pulley alignment which is the most obvious cause of your issues...

I am a little surprised that whipple had the car and could not address this issue. Bottom line for shredding belts pretty much has to be one of:
1. belt too tight (too much tension)
2. belt too loose (jumping ribs during change in speed)
3. pulleys out of alignment.
4. really nasty sharp spot/damage on one or more of your pulleys

You can check your pulley alignment with a long, sturdy straightedge or a laser pointer. That would be my first guess - the blower snout is too far forward or back - at least with the Saleen there is a couple 1/16's of play +/- such that the entire unit can be pushed back-and-forth before it is torqued down. I would assume the whipple can move as well....

 

[GI Joe]

well lets go with what we know...we know that all the pulleys were replaced...so its not a pulley problem...it's an alignment problem...also its not a belt problem because you have shredded many before and after the 8 rib kit...and different sizes...and its a gate so its a good belt...so if you were not having a belt problem before the whipple install it must be the alignment of an accessory that can be adjusted. That I'm sure of at this point...Also since you say that the tensioner being increased and decreased changes the sound makes me nearly positive the problem is the AC. Ford had a problem with the ac squealing (I just found out) and made some changes on the 07 cars. Loosen the 3 bolts holding the ac and dont let it move. Make sure all 3 holes are up over the shoulder pieces and not locked onto one side ways and yet not counter sunk. Then take note of its position and rotate it (while in place)as far as you can in one direction and tighten it and check it. If it dont work rotate it the other way and check it. I had the same problem and I worked on it a long time and so did Cali HP. He found this to work on his car.
Dave

 

[Sasquatch]

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I will go look at the AC closer I did remove the bolts before to see if there was any adjustment. I have always thought this was the area the noise had the highest concentration.

As a last resort I tried a Goodyear Gatorback belt the grooves are cut differently. I also remove the shims that are included with the 8 rib kit that space the tensioner out. This allowed the belt to ride more in the center of the tensioner where before it was rim riding the edge towards the block. I went on a long cruise and pulled over to look at everything and while everything looked OK there was a lot of dust. I have not had dust concerns before. I drove another 40 miles and looked again and there was not more dust than before. I decided to hammer the car and when I shifted to third belt was gone. Pulled over and the tensioner was bent to hell. There is a lot of belt dust all over. The sliding idler from Whipple had a lot of dust on it and a lot down by the AC. Why now would I bend a tensioner? It looked like the picture Kimmer posted awile back. This has not been an issue. Could the 8 rib be holding that much tighter? Keep the ideas coming maybe this can be resolved.

Thanks again,

Sam

 

[ulev1st]

Damn Sam...I thought you had this figured out..So far...since Art sent me the spacer and belt I haven't had an issue...but then again my car has been down for a while trying to figure out this stupid Ram dual disc clutch(see other post!). I ended up putting my stock clutch back in and I plann on driving the car all week to see if the belt issue is still a problem. I'll keep you in the loop . Let us know if the AC thing works.. (That Dave always seems to find answers huh?)

 

[Willie]

I don't know if this helps but it may be something to think about. Years ago when I installed a D1SC ProCharger on my IROC-Z, it was one of the first three kits that ATI sold. These early kits came with a 12-rib setup. Just cranking the motor over, not starting it, was enough for the belt to walk right off the pulleys. I checked alignment and everything seemed in order. I noticed how the belt would walk towards the engine every time so I experimented with shimming the blower bracket. I installed shims, one at a time, at different bracket mounting points. I discovered the solution was one shim at one bracket mounting point stopped the belt walk. What's really weird is that when I checked the alignment of the pulleys, it was NOT aligned. Yet this was the only way to keep the belt on the pulleys.... I never did figure out why. I then contacted the guy who bought the second kit, just before me and discovered he had the same problem. I had him install a shim where I put mine and his problem went away..... Strange but true.

Willie

 

[94tbird]

im still having problems with belts and my KB and i have Adam's Franken Tensioner. I believe ive bent that tensioner as well as i can see where the paint on the pulley wore away during initial use and where the belt is riding now

now i have a horrible noise coming from either the tensioner pulley, the idler next to it, or the A/C. so im in the same boat as i was in before. pulleys are aligned and i cant keep a belt on the car during power shifts.

im fed up with this myself. i need help here

 

[don_w]

Ron, did you install that extra pulley, too?

 

[94tbird]

i have taken the extra pulley in location 7 out.

 

[don_w]

i have taken the extra pulley in location 7 out.

Have you tried running with one in there? That's how mine has been for over a year.

 

[silverpoison]

what size pulley for location 7, the space looks very tight...

 

[94tbird]

i jsut took it out don. i figured i had too much tension. i did have it in there for a while and i was still shredding belts. the new belt KB sent me lasted only 1 day