Hot new blower manifolds

[eighty6gt]

 

[lemkau77]

maybe they will make some spacers for the 4.6's lol

 

[jhunt47]

maybe they will make some spacers for the 4.6's lol

Wouldn’t think so since dob ran into problems with steeda when he tried to make the same thing. Hope these guys don’t run into the same problem as he did. Since it’s the 5.0 steeda may have no legal ground. None the less may try and send them a email see what they say.

 

[sdleo29]

Wasn’t DOB just doing a group but on 4.6 blower spacers

 

[groundpounder]

Yes, he was. If Steeda could sue Jason for a spacer that could only work on a F/I motor they can sue these guys too. And probably will.

 

[eighty6gt]

I'd like to see an aussie respond to that sort of lawsuit. "Get fucked!" One can dream.

 

[Pentalab]

I'd like to see an aussie respond to that sort of lawsuit. "Get fucked!" One can dream.

That or just order what ever you want from Australia. Heck, you could be their new Canadian dealer.... then tell steeda.ca to..."get fucked". Then folks in the usa can just order from cdn suppliers. The chinese would tell em to get fucked too..then build em for 1/10 the price.

 

[Sky Render]

Fuck Steeda.

 

[travelers]

The problem is Ford contracted Steeda to make the control plates, which they patented. So the delete control plate adapter is just a modified version of the original ones. I guess that gives them the patented rights for the ones for a 4.6. It doesn't make any difference what the adapter is made of.
I think that's why Jason has the problem.

Now there isn't any adapters on the Coyote, so as I see it they have no claim to a spacer for a Coyote. If the spacer the Aussie will fit a 11-14 Coyote I would look into getting a pair.

That's just my take on what's happening

 

[Sky Render]

Yes, because one person making spacers out of a different material for a different purpose is clearly a patent violation. That's shady behavior on the part of Steeda, and that makes them assholes.

Plus, their parts have become extremely low quality.

 

[eighty6gt]

Steve Saleen is still in business.

 

[jdlatil]

What material do you think these spacers are made of, I would like to make my own spacer for 4.6?
May take a while but I think it would be worst it for KB PD supercharger.

 

[Sky Render]

What material do you think these spacers are made of, I would like to make my own spacer for 4.6?
May take a while but I think it would be worst it for KB PD supercharger.

Careful, Steeda might sue you.

 

[Pentalab]

What material do you think these spacers are made of, I would like to make my own spacer for 4.6?
May take a while but I think it would be worst it for KB PD supercharger.

DOB's was touted as being made of phenolic. Phenolic was widely used in the 60's and 70s' to make electronic circuit boards. Since long ago replaced with fiberglass. Phenolic is hygroscopic, IE: absorbs moisture. I believe a simple gasket made from something like Teflon sheeting might do the trick. Expensive, but good for 250 deg C. In an ideal world, it may just be simpler to ceramic coat the top of each head. Then ceramic coat the mating flanges on the bottom of the aluminum manifold. Ceramic coating the bottom of the entire al manifold would reject heat absorbtion from the valley below. Then ceramic coat the top of the al manifold where it mates to the underside of the al blower assy. Then ceramic coat the underside of the blower assy flanges. That would solve a lot of the iat issues. Heat soak would be greatly reduced.

Roush in it's infinite wisdom has made the engine coolant crossover an integral part of their al manifolds, putting the crossover into the leading edge of their al manifolds. No wonder their al manifolds run hot, they have a constant flow of boiling water flowing through em. One way to deal with heat issues is to generate less heat to begin with. As is, we are stuck with schemes using higher flowing IC pumps, bigger IC's, bigger HE's...+ bigger diam piping to connect it all together.

 

[jdlatil]

How thick a piece of teflon sheet would you suggest. Im thinking 1/4” should be adequate, with o-ring cut in lower side next to head.

 

[Pentalab]

How thick a piece of teflon sheet would you suggest. Im thinking 1/4” should be adequate, with o-ring cut in lower side next to head.

I checked my old notes. How deep is the O ring ? After factoring in the O ring, 1/4" should do it. I believe you can get teflon in 1/8", 1/4" and also several other thickness. I use teflon for other (non automotive) applications in 1/16, 1/8, 1/4. It's soft material, so it has to be thick enough to handle the bolt tq, but I don't think their is a lot of tq on the bolts. On paper, it should work. 1/4" is pretty solid stuff. It would handle a lot of bolt tq. Heat just doesn't transfer through teflon, even paper thin stuff.

I have had teflon cast and machined into seamless cylinders, like 6.2" ID and 6.7" OD (using 1/4" thick material) then the entire mess being subjected to a constant 225 deg C for hrs and days on end.

 

[Racer47]

Phenolic has been used for decades for carb spacers. I've run them. They don't absorb water. There may be slightly better materials but phenolic certainly works at a reasonable cost.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Moro...MI18SSt5DK2QIVR57ACh3zvgr-EAQYAiABEgJbUfD_BwE

Plus according to this CTS-V guy who actually tested phenolic spacers, they don't help. He saw a 20 F decrease in temps at the manifold base by the heads but this did not lower the iat's.

http://www.ctsvowners.com/forum/71-cooling/29823-phenolic-spacers-before-after-test-results.html

Lastly, even knowing this, I did put down a deposit and planned on buying them. I just didn't expect a huge improvement.

 

[Sky Render]

Phenolic has been used for decades for carb spacers. I've run them. They don't absorb water. There may be slightly better materials but phenolic certainly works at a reasonable cost.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Moro...MI18SSt5DK2QIVR57ACh3zvgr-EAQYAiABEgJbUfD_BwE

Plus according to this CTS-V guy who actually tested phenolic spacers, they don't help. He saw a 20 F decrease in temps at the manifold base by the heads but this did not lower the iat's.

http://www.ctsvowners.com/forum/71-cooling/29823-phenolic-spacers-before-after-test-results.html

Lastly, even knowing this, I did put down a deposit and planned on buying them. I just didn't expect a huge improvement.

You need to get out of here with your facts and logic!

 

[Racer47]

I just noticed my avatar pic. That motor was from my super late model asphalt race car. Whats that brown thing between the carb and intake ????

 

[Pentalab]

Phenolic has been used for decades for carb spacers. I've run them. They don't absorb water. There may be slightly better materials but phenolic certainly works at a reasonable cost.

https://www.speedwaymotors.com/Moro...MI18SSt5DK2QIVR57ACh3zvgr-EAQYAiABEgJbUfD_BwE

Plus according to this CTS-V guy who actually tested phenolic spacers, they don't help. He saw a 20 F decrease in temps at the manifold base by the heads but this did not lower the iat's.

http://www.ctsvowners.com/forum/71-cooling/29823-phenolic-spacers-before-after-test-results.html

Lastly, even knowing this, I did put down a deposit and planned on buying them. I just didn't expect a huge improvement.

Did you slog through ALL of the 162 postings, strewn over the 6 pages on that CTS-V forum ?
Go to page 5, posting #129... the maker of the spacers spells out the real facts. He also provides for several other heat shields, and V block shields, plus some other items. He's claiming another 30 rwhp on dyno testing.

In the DOB / Aussie mustang phenolic spacer scenario, the spacer goes between the top of the AL manifold and the bottom of the PD blower casing. To really do this right, you require a pair of additional spacers, one between the top of each head and bottom of manifold interface.. + some type of heat shield so the bottom of the al manifold doesn't pick up heat from the Block V. In the case of the Roush al manifolds, you still have this problem with the built in, integral eng coolant crossover, across the front of the al manifold. That constant flow of hot coolant just cooks the al manifold. Then the manifold is also getting heated by each head. The manifold is getting cooked a 4th time by the hot blower casing (with blower on).

My little M90 with it's 5.8 psi boost runs just fine, IAT's are not an issue..(like 120 F cruising..and 105 F at higher rpms). IAT's drop 10-15 F with blower on. Just cruising around town or on the hwy in OD, say 1.5 krpm @ 50 mph, the air is flowing relatively slowly..and picks up a lot of heat from the hot al manifold. Drop down a gear or two, and /or slowly put your foot into it, rpm increases a bunch, and now the airflow is a lot faster, and less time spent in the hot manifold. The air has less time to pick up heat..and IAT's drop a bunch. 0-100 mph or say 50-100 mph goes by pretty damned quick, so the blower is never on for more than 5-10 secs at a time. I typ see 120 F for IAT's, regardless of outside temps, it's 118 F when outside temps are 40F....and 120F when outside temps are 80 F. Coolant in IC-pump-HE loop is flowing all the time. Coolant runs cool when cruising, and recovers very quickly after using the blower..like luke warm..then back to cool.

The real problems start when I drive across town on a hot day, then park it for 30-45 mins in the hot sun, or even in the shade. Lift the hood and feel the top of the blower casing, and it's stupid hot...(eng still OFF) Start eng up, and IAT's can hit 145 F...(the highest I have recorded). But that quickly drops to 139 F, within 20 secs. Then down to aprx 130-132 F, after driving 2-3 blocks. Then it takes a helluva long time to get from 130-132 F..down to it's normal 120 F... like 20-40 mins. The heat soak effect on a parked car, with the typ oem PD blower setup is well pronounced. The proposed spacer between blower + manifold, I believe would alleviate a lot of the blower casing heat soak issues.

For strip use, if waiting the typ 20-45 mins b4 doing another run, the heat soak would kill the timing. Spacers would help...and so would ice. Ice is cheap and simple solution. Water / meth sprayed into the elbow of the blower also works..and cools elbow, intake air, blower casing, rotor pack, and blower discharge outlet air temps.