Tune not working/cant drive car

[Bryan]

Any updates on the car?

Talk about great customer service, you guys go above and beyond

 

[fdjizm]

Chris is on top of things!

 

[jas11151990]

I guess i should chime in and say ive had huge issues with high a/f ratios and a complete flat line in trq. Ive had 4 tunes sent to solve the issue with no resolution. My a/f is in the 13s and ive even data logged for you guys with no resolution.......

 

[AMChrisRose]

I guess i should chime in and say ive had huge issues with high a/f ratios and a complete flat line in trq. Ive had 4 tunes sent to solve the issue with no resolution. My a/f is in the 13s and ive even data logged for you guys with no resolution.......

Hey Jason,

I took a look at the email interaction between you and Bama, and even the dyno graphs that you submitted:

So, we target 12.5-12.6 AFR, or as high as 12.8 AFR, depending on whether you use our Race tune, Street tune or Performance tune. Being that you're using the dyno's wideband, at the rear bung (even though you're catless), I'm a little concerned about their accuracy. The graph you sent over shows 12.8-13.3 average air fuel being on the upper end of that at 13.1-13.2. I think that if you datalogged the factory wideband sensors, you'd probably show a lambda that represents 12.80's. I really trust the stock wideband sensors, and they're extremely accurate. While what you're showing us is a good back-up, I don't think you're running 13.1-13.2, I'm willing to bet it's a tad below 13. From what I can see, the tune looks great. You might want to have them set that red, dotted reference line at 13 instead of 12. Setting it at 12, makes it look like we're targeting a much lower AFR than we really are, subconsciously...

I did check, and the Bama team didn't make any fueling adjustments, just adjustments to attack the "flat spot" on your graph.

As for the flat torque that you're talking about... I'm assuming you mean in the graph from 2000-3000? That's an anomaly that is not at all tune related. I usually start my dyno pulls at 2500 or so, because driveline, variable cam, wheel/tire slip, etc. make graphs look very ugly down low. I don't know why the original Bama member that you spoke to went to town chasing this problem, it's something that isn't in the tune. It looks like they were trying to keep the customer happy, which I'm sure you understand. In this case, that is something you'll see regularly in dyno charts. You'd find it stock (worse), I'm willing to bet.

The numbers you put down (422 horsepower and 401 torque) are really good for a normal Dynojet pull. I have NA 3V Mustangs, V6's, and tons of other examples of that flat "tip-in" line that you're looking for. The car hasn't fully transitioned into WOT, the rollers are heavy and at that low RPM, the car is "lugging". It's not "normal", but it's definitely not a problem. It's a byproduct of dyno-ing the car that low.

I think we're probably chasing a problem that doesn't exist here. (Side note: the knock sensors were pulling about 4500 in the run, that's why the line drops. Are you using good 93 octane? What station do you fill up at?)

What I did was have Zach from Bama send you a new tune with about 2% fuel added. This will bring the AFR on your graph down to 12.6-13.0, with an average of 12.8-12.9, but the stock wideband will probably show 12.4-12.6. It's definitely going to be a conservative AFR, and maybe lose 1-5 HP and 1-5 TQ, but it's what you're after.

I hope this helps explain it, better. Let me know if you have absolutely any questions or concerns at all!

Chris

 

[jas11151990]

Justin* lol But thank you so much for explaining and getting this straight. I use shell, sheetz, and 7-11 to answer the station question. The reason we chased the flatline was that is did not do it the first time wen I had only a tune, then did it three more times after with the new parts but i trust your word. Everyone says i have pretty good numbers and really appreciate all the help!!!

 

[jas11151990]

I did data log and send it to you guys if you did not recieve it btw

 

[AMChrisRose]

Wow. I completely butchered your name, right after Zack told me 30 seconds before. My fault!!

Shell is good, give Sunoco a try. Sheetz is the same thing as Wawa is out here. Wawa gas is definitely a lower grade. Stay away from Sheetz/711. Go with Sunoco, Shell, BP, or large brand-name stations and you should be set.

The flat spot is normal, I promise. If you go to http://www.youtube.com/americanmusclevideos and click on Bama Performance at the top, you'll see alot of videos with dyno graphs, and even in stock form they will do that, depending on variables.

I'm glad the numbers look good and am sorry for the confusion on our end!

 

[AMChrisRose]

I did data log and send it to you guys if you did not recieve it btw

I will have Zach forward me over the datalog and check the factory widebands.

 

[jas11151990]

So my a/f have been safe though? Or too high for your liking?

 

[AMChrisRose]

Safe... definitely. A little lean, if it was really 13.2-13.3, yes. Some run it that high, but I'm an advocate for more fuel to cool the combustion chambers. It definitely wasn't an unsafe air/fuel ratio, though. I would want it at 12.9 maximum, and 12.6 at its lowest point. It's very possible that the factory widebands are showing 12.6-12.9, which I'll confirm when I check your datalog tomorrow. If not, let's say they show 12.9-13.1, then you have the tunes in your email inbox from Zach @ Bama that will bring it down 3% to the 12.6-12.9 area.

 

[jas11151990]

.....

 

[Bryan]

.....

He must be busy, I sent him a pm this morning and no reply, so I guess it's Friday

 

[AMChrisRose]

.....

Looks like the correct values were missing from your datalog. The factory widebands weren't selected to datalog, I guess. I have fuel trims, which look fine, but no wideband air/fuel ratio data. I would need you to do a WOT pull with the factory widebands datalogged. I really don't even need to see it, I just want to see it as a backup to make sure that we're correct.

 

[AMChrisRose]

He must be busy, I sent him a pm this morning and no reply, so I guess it's Friday

Mines super rich at idle, smells and stinks like fuel burns my eyes

I got it. We get a few hundred PMs a day between all of the forums, so sometimes it takes a few business days to get them answered. That will speed up next week when my new guy starts. In the mean time, I'll go look and check out your PM. It sounds like something the Bama guys can fix pretty easily.

It's possible the tune was written incorrectly or there was some info missing from the tune submission form. If you're running an intake that has an insert, it's possible we tuned it for insert out, etc. Either way, Bama will be able to take care of it within 10 minutes if you give them a call.

Their number/hours are listed in my signature below! Report back and let us know how it goes!

 

[Bryan]

Sucks they work the same hours I do, so it's going to be tough for me to get in touch durning the day

Any help is appreciated

 

[AMChrisRose]

One of the Bama team members will be in touch with you Monday! I let them know that you're only going to be able to answer off-business hours. If there's a best time to call/email, let me know and I'll pass that along!

Chris