There's a very complicated answer to this question, and I don't remember all the details. Terry or Jason- if you see this, please answer as you see fit.
NOT Another...Yes...another auotx build thread
- Thread starter csamsh
- Start date
There's a very complicated answer to this question, and I don't remember all the details. Terry or Jason- if you see this, please answer as you see fit.
dontlifttoshift
Member
Ha! Thanks for the quick reply.
To the guys at Vorshlag, I don't expect you spill any numbers, just if you think it is feasible to run a square 11" with a spacer up front.
Just planning for when SCCA decides what we can or can't do......
To the guys at Vorshlag, I don't expect you spill any numbers, just if you think it is feasible to run a square 11" with a spacer up front.
Just planning for when SCCA decides what we can or can't do......
Not reasonably possible to run a square 18x11 and keep them under the fenders.
Whiskey11
SCCA Autoscrosser #23 STU
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
- Posts
- 1,644
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So the rear offset would be 50 or more and you couldn't run a spacer and longer studs up front with the same offset to push it out to the fenders? That seems odd. You guys managed to fit an 18x11 up front and an 18x12 out back and keep them under the fenders...ish... No reason an 18x11 wouldn't work all around, just need the right offset and the right spacer up front.
Of course that info is "proprietary" though...
Whisky - .5” spacer is maximum by most people’s standards, even then (My opinion not safe). .25”-.375” max. I wouldn’t do that unless I machine the spacers myself for an exact fit. Stresses change dramatically when running real rubber – Slicks -
Standard universal (Under fender wheel fitment) front & rear for a S197 Mustang is a 10” 43mm offset rim limited by front inner clearance – Strut - A .5” spacer will give a max of 10.5”wide rim. Take a look & some measurements. (Tons of room in the rear )
You could probably get by with a thicker spacer for auto cross because of the lower speeds & usually – NO - non-moveable objects to modify.
My driver / wife is no-longer interested in competing so our vehicle will be track day only & DD from now on – modification rules - No - longer apply for us so I will either dump our V6 & purchase a new platform / Car for me or mod the Mustang accordingly for wife.
If we mod – 11” or 12” + square setup is doable (11” under fenders 12” + with flares front & rear)
(Cut the axle tube & axle - Anneal, cut, re-spline the axle & re nitrite – total expense $700 to $750 Max. This small expense & will pay for itself just by being able to rotate the tires on our overly heavy BOAT (Currently 3382LBs with driver & 8 gallons of gas). I don’t remember how much material is on the axle for a re-spline. I have to pull the rear end apart again & check if I get motivated. If axles need to be purchased, more money.
I’ve just about lost interest in modding our Mustang – not gona race so why bother but for track days 10 to 20% more rubber on the ground & a V8 will make for fewer point bys & keep the wife happy.
It is always fun though when people come over & see that we only have a 4.0 V6 mostly stock (Driven by a 4’ 11” woman) & their cars that cost 2 + times as much as we have spent, weigh much less & have gobs more HP can’t do similar lap times – The driver / Wife is stile only getting about 85% out of the car. If her interest sparks again & she can get 90+% out of the car, I’ll make it much faster.
dontlifttoshift
Member
What's the difference if the spacer is 3/4 or the pad on the wheel is 3/4" thicker.
I would love to just narrow the rear axle, I would just go full floating and run a fixed caliper and solve some other problems as well, but not legal for SCCA solo.
As far as resplining the axles, don't forget machining for the c clip as well. Could probably buy new axles for the same money.
I would love to just narrow the rear axle, I would just go full floating and run a fixed caliper and solve some other problems as well, but not legal for SCCA solo.
As far as resplining the axles, don't forget machining for the c clip as well. Could probably buy new axles for the same money.
New axles are going to be around $350.00 to $400 each (Guess-ta-mitt) I haven't purchased axles for quite some time. Total expense would be bumped up to $1000 +.
dontlifttoshift
Member
Strange is under $500 a pair.
Thoughts on wheel pad thickness vs spacer?
Thoughts on wheel pad thickness vs spacer?
One part versus two...I'll take one.
The lug nut itself is physically further from the hub with a spacer, so more of the stud is being stressed (torqued, x-axis), and there's a piece of the stud (in the spacer) which will have shear forces (z & y axes) applied which wouldn't be applied if you had no spacer. So, all three axes are (theoretically) experiencing more force with a spacer.
dontlifttoshift
Member
Yep, that makes sense except there shouldn't be any shear load on the wheel studs, right?
Yes - There is shear load -
I would recomend ARP - I've been lucky enough to have toured thier shop & thier quality control is better than most - Top Knotch -
dontlifttoshift
Member
+1 for ARP
We disagree on shear load of the studs. Not until the lugnuts are loose is there a shear load on the studs.
Sorry for the thread jack...
We disagree on shear load of the studs. Not until the lugnuts are loose is there a shear load on the studs.
Sorry for the thread jack...
You can get replacement front hubs with arp studs already pressed in, too.
Norm Peterson
corner barstool sitter
Can you re-measure the Hankooks after you've driven on them a bit? I tend to doubt that the tread width is equal to the section width as your picture suggests (can't see the other end of the tape either).
At least then you'll have an apples to apples comparison against your R1's.
Because tire shoulders are curved transitions from tread to sidewall, determining the edges of tread width is inherently a pretty vague thing to attempt, so this isn't intended as criticism of either you, Hankook, or any of the others.
Norm
Yeah, it's super vague...hence the "science." I bet the actual "tread" area will look different once they're driven on a little bit as well.
Update to come once some miles are on these bad boys. Initial impression- Pilot Super Sport who?
Norm Peterson
corner barstool sitter
It's been a couple weeks since I posted anything here...but stay tuned this week for an update on the grand(ish) STU experiment and a review of 285/35/18 RS3's.
Teasers (opinons)
-STU is not going to work without help
-The RS3 is really pretty good (duh?)
-More tweaks in mind, new tire and wheel info
Teasers (opinons)
-STU is not going to work without help
-The RS3 is really pretty good (duh?)
-More tweaks in mind, new tire and wheel info
Whiskey11
SCCA Autoscrosser #23 STU
- Joined
- Feb 24, 2012
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- 4
I look forward to your results although I feel a bit of "wrong car" coming on like I did when Terry ran in STX (and then added gobs of power to it). I really think that the 5.0's simply have too much power for the ST classes. STU is going to be better than STX for sure, but when it comes to 285's, unless the Rival is a treaded A6 and eventually comes out with a 285, I doubt you guys are going to be able to use any of your power. I wouldn't even put a tune on your car that messes with your HP and Torque. Hell, I'm wondering if my car could take advantage of the ST power allowances on 285's. Maybe. Your car is also pretty far from ST Prepped, mine isn't a whole lot further along either. I see one glaring thing missing: Watts link. Don't underestimate the power of a lowered rear roll center for power delivery and tuning. Terry left ST before doing it, but as he found out in ESP, it makes a world of difference.
The Watt's would definitely help. At this point though...it would appear that we (Mustangs) would need seconds out of parts to be competitive. About the only things that could be done to my car (that aren't power) to "max" it for ST-
-watt's link
-aero
-take out some weight
-11" wheels instead of 10"
I'm not a torque arm believer...let's leave it at that.
other than that, there's not a whole lot to do.
This times from Saturday should be telling- there were ASP, BSP, ESP, potentially STX, and maybe some other national champion cars there that I'm missing. Again...stay tuned for updates and "math."
-watt's link
-aero
-take out some weight
-11" wheels instead of 10"
I'm not a torque arm believer...let's leave it at that.
other than that, there's not a whole lot to do.
This times from Saturday should be telling- there were ASP, BSP, ESP, potentially STX, and maybe some other national champion cars there that I'm missing. Again...stay tuned for updates and "math."
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