Building my new powertrain. Looking for help

[jcw427]

Alright I'm building a new motor trans combo for my car over the winter. Tear down is going to start here next week when days off start. My car is a 2006 Roush Stage 3 car but after running a new 5.0 that's the direction I've decided to go that direction. I've decided that for this set up I'm going to go to a 6R80 6 speed automatic transmission instead of keeping it a stick car. Going through wiring diagrams and doing my research I'm thinking with a stock 5.0 auto PCM and building a custom harness I can retain all the accessories and keep the functionality of all them. I'm looking for opinions on my set up I'm thinking I'm going to run.

- A honed, decked and lined bore block with oil squirters blocked off
- Boss 302 bearings
- Boss 302 crankshaft, balanced for rods and pistons
- thinking Carillo Pro H rods
- no idea for pistons. Probably either JE or Mahle
- Boss 302R heads
- Comp Cams XFI 1700-7100 cams
- Livernois drop in valve springs
- Comp Cams phaser limiters
- Boss timing chains

Now I am still debating which blower setup to go with. I'm back and forth between either a 2.9L whipple or a KB mammoth blower setup. I'm looking for big HP but I want it to be streetable.

Now for the transmission I'm really thinking stock torque converter, upgraded shafts and clutch packs and a shift kit plus tuning

Does anyone have suggestions or recommendations? I'm hoping to be around 680-700 RWHP on 94 octane pump gas and be near stock reliability.

 

[FIVE-OH]

If you are going to do all that, I would definitely change the converter...

 

[konablue11gt]

Try searching a little ,,,Lito has a decent thread on doing this ...a lot of pitfalls on the conversion getting the little things to work

 

[skwerl]

Even the smallest amount of research will tell you that the Whipple is by far a much better choice over the KB. The KB blowers are known for horrible heat issues and will not be reliable enough for a decent DD street car.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Even the smallest amount of research will tell you that the Whipple is by far a much better choice over the KB. The KB blowers are known for horrible heat issues and will not be reliable enough for a decent DD street car.

So without getting into the debate between Whipple and KB, how do the KB blowers with the cooling lines in them compare to the air cooled Whipples?

Also, how awesome would it be to get a Whipple with liquid cooling?

 

[konablue11gt]

So without getting into the debate between Whipple and KB, how do the KB blowers with the cooling lines in them compare to the air cooled Whipples?

Also, how awesome would it be to get a Whipple with liquid cooling?

Umm the intercooler on the whipple kits is air to water ... Intercooler is under the intake and runs water through and air cooled heat exchanger

 

[skwerl]

So without getting into the debate between Whipple and KB, how do the KB blowers with the cooling lines in them compare to the air cooled Whipples?

Also, how awesome would it be to get a Whipple with liquid cooling?

Wat?

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Umm the intercooler on the whipple kits is air to water ... Intercooler is under the intake and runs water through and air cooled heat exchanger

I'm not talking about intercoolers. The 4.2 Mammoth is liquid cooled if I'm not mistaken. The actual supercharger has coolant running through it.

I'm not talking about intercoolers. The 4.2 Mammoth is liquid cooled if I'm not mistaken. The actual supercharger has coolant running through it.

Just checked the KB website. They advertise liquid cooling on their 3.6 and 4.2, and it's optional on the 2.8. And apparently it's patent pending.

 

[stkjock]

I'm not talking about intercoolers. The 4.2 Mammoth is liquid cooled if I'm not mistaken. The actual supercharger has coolant running through it.

No it does not. Just the front housing is cooled.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

No it does not. Just the front housing is cooled.

Correct. The part that deals with the "hot" end of the air.

But still, how does that cooling system on a KB compare to a Whipple that doesn't have it? Or do they make Whipples that have it or something like it?

 

[stkjock]

Correct. The part that deals with the "hot" end of the air.

But still, how does that cooling system on a KB compare to a Whipple that doesn't have it? Or do they make Whipples that have it or something like it?

U seriously need to know more before you post.

The only part that is cooled is the rear part of the snout and gears, not the blower blades, nor the rotar pack case, nor the area where the air enters the intercooler.

Whipple doesn't make a similar set up.

 

[Dubstep Shep]

U seriously need to know more before you post.

The only part that is cooled is the rear part of the snout and gears, not the blower blades, nor the rotar pack case, nor the area where the air enters the intercooler.

Whipple doesn't make a similar set up.

Sorry. I'm trying not to thread jack here by delving into specifics, and I'm also trying to not come across as a know-it-all since that's been a complaint in the past.

In any case, the question still stands, and it seems like it might be relevant to the OPs question.

 

[jcw427]

I've ran through Litos thread a couple times. The wiring side I believe we've got handled. I'm more so looking for opinions on my rod/piston combo, any idea on valvesprings, locks and retainers. There's even a part of my leaning towards twin turbos. Part of my thinking on running the stock converters was less shock on the powertrain and with a lower stall I believe it gives a better chance for traction out of the hole. Also driving my neighbours 860 rwhp ZL1 with the stock converter I found it was incredibly tame around town and that kind of pushed that direction and line of thought.
So my questions are
Thoughts on valvetrain
Thoughts on rod/piston combo. I'm thinking around 10.0 compression
Does anyone have airflow numbers on various coyote heads?

 

[Mystickeith50]

I'm not expert to say the least, but guys have been making 800 with almost ease without head porting. You can upgrade the valve springs to a little stronger more rev friendly like boss to eliminate float. 10:1 I is ur best bet on compression and I would get a coated diamond piston and maybe some billet I beams while ur at it. The biggest problem is the block. I had a lengthy conversation with mike at l&m(which was hilarious) regarding the block. He was quite adamant about the block issue not being necessarily an engineering issue but more a tune issue. Guys u see trashing the block at 700-800 is a tune issue.....guys trashing them at 1000is just pushing the limits . It all depends on what fuel ur gonna run as well.

 

[Steve@Tasca]

There's a reason Ford Racing chose to carry Whipple blowers over KB, we all know both make power but the Whipple has proven more reliable.

The power levels you want to be at should be quite easy to reach, have you looked at the Ford Racing Aluminator long blocks or are you really itching to do your own build?

-Steve

 

[JPO8GT]

I Agree 100% Whipple Over KB Hands Down KB Has No Where Near The Quality Control Standards As Whipple Thats Why Ford Prefers Them And Eaton Tvs Consistent Quality Products Due To Better Production Process And Quality Control.

 

[jcw427]

I haven't put together a motor in a while. Last one I went into the guts of was an LS2 and I've been wanting to build a mod motor for a while. I was going to do the 4.6, but after running a new Boss 302 Laguana around for a couple days I feel in love with the new motor. Doesn't hurt that dad has a new cobra jet sitting in the garage and being able to see what it can do helped open my eyes.
Part of the reason I want to put one together was I got a deal on a core with a spun rod bearing and I want to get a little more serious than an aluminator with the heads and cams.

 

[Steve@Tasca]

I haven't put together a motor in a while. Last one I went into the guts of was an LS2 and I've been wanting to build a mod motor for a while. I was going to do the 4.6, but after running a new Boss 302 Laguana around for a couple days I feel in love with the new motor. Doesn't hurt that dad has a new cobra jet sitting in the garage and being able to see what it can do helped open my eyes.
Part of the reason I want to put one together was I got a deal on a core with a spun rod bearing and I want to get a little more serious than an aluminator with the heads and cams.

I totally understand that, nothing quite as satisfying as building an engine up from a bare block and having it perform flawlessly.

-Steve