Killer Chiller -- Beware

[BruceH]

Killer Chiller. I've never understood the need for it but then again I've never had a KB setup and when I pushed the boost up (only 16psi on a twin screw) I realized that E85 was a pretty good insurance policy.

Made plenty of 1/4 mile passes but never had the need for something like this. Then again 80 degrees ambient is hot around here.

I have seen Terminator guys with KB units having serious iat issues so maybe it's a solution for a KB/Terminator problem that just doesn't translate to a 3v/any other pd blower setup.

 

[weather man]

Killer Chiller. I've never understood the need for it but then again I've never had a KB setup and when I pushed the boost up (only 16psi on a twin screw) I realized that E85 was a pretty good insurance policy.

Made plenty of 1/4 mile passes but never had the need for something like this. Then again 80 degrees ambient is hot around here.

I have seen Terminator guys with KB units having serious iat issues so maybe it's a solution for a KB/Terminator problem that just doesn't translate to a 3v/any other pd blower setup.

Shop owner at DB Performance does a lot of terminators and he says they can literally boil the coolant in the intercooler at high boost.

I have noticed more than a few terminator owners install a 3.4 whipple, then shortly thereafter get rid of it.

It is a shame Jason dropped his Terminator intercooler project, but just wouldn't be enough demand for time and treasure invested.

 

[Wes06]

Yeah dob has mentioned a lot boiling the coolant in the intercooler, especially when it's not traveling fast enough

 

[Speedboosted]

Yep, sounds like the install shop screwed him also. With 80 hours they should of been able to do a full kit install 16 times.

You missed a lot of this...they didn't have the parts to install the full kit. Hence the massive time spent.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I mean, in theory it makes sense. I can't imagine anything being better than flowing 50 degree water through your intercooler. No amount of 80 degree air flowing through a heat exchanger should work better than lower than ambient water. Whether its being executed correctly, that id assume is the issue. Or flow rate, or some combination of that.

edit: holy SHIT what on earth? who spends " 80 hours of labor " @ 5,000 dollars on having one of these installed? holy shit

All the cold water in the world won't do you any good if it doesn't move through the IC fast enough. I've seen cars at 18+psi VAPORIZE ice water in the IC because it wasn't moving fast enough. "Why not just put a good pump on too" you say? Well if you're going to run a good pump and a good HE there is an argument for not needing a KC at all.

Too many people add systems to their car before actually getting the ones they have working right.

Yep, sounds like the install shop screwed him also. With 80 hours they should of been able to do a full kit install 16 times.

R&D/problem solving takes about 50x longer than installing parts.

It is a shame Jason dropped his Terminator intercooler project, but just wouldn't be enough demand for time and treasure invested.

Yeah, it's too bad that there just aren't enough people to plop down the bucks that would be needed to solve that problem. I could do it no problem at all. Being able to afford to do it is a completely different thing.

 

[palanza7]

All the cold water in the world won't do you any good if it doesn't move through the IC fast enough. I've seen cars at 18+psi VAPORIZE ice water in the IC because it wasn't moving fast enough. "Why not just put a good pump on too" you say? Well if you're going to run a good pump and a good HE there is an argument for not needing a KC at all.

Too many people add systems to their car before actually getting the ones they have working right.

yeah thats what i mean't by saying it was probably some other issue keeping it from working correctly. you have a good point, if u can manage the temps without it then why bother in the first place, but i feel like common sense says that the option to have lower than ambient temperate water flowing through your IC is theoretically always going to outperform water cooled by ambient air. *under the same conditions* (flow and all that) whether this is necessary is debatable.. but run something long enough on a 95 degree day and heat soak is going to catch up with you eventually right? thats why so many people use ice chests i would guess?
i feel like a/c cooled water is a more elegant solution than dumping bags of ice into a big tank of water in the trunk... if its working well

 

[Department Of Boost]

but run something long enough on a 95 degree day and heat soak is going to catch up with you eventually right?

Nope. Our S550 never heat soaks...................ever.

thats why so many people use ice chests i would guess?
i feel like a/c cooled water is a more elegant solution than dumping bags of ice into a big tank of water in the trunk... if its working well

A lot of people run ice because it's easy and if set up even remotely well works pretty good. You have to go out of your way to screw up a IC system that has 30deg water in it. And most of them are drag cars that are sitting around forever between runs.

Fun Fact:

Donnie Walsh did some testing in the past where he found that if the IAT's got under 90deg he was actually losing HP. Now this was only on one car, and a very extreme track build at that. But it does raise the question, can IAT's get too low?

 

[BruceH]

Nope. Our S550 never heat soaks...................ever.



A lot of people run ice because it's easy and if set up even remotely well works pretty good. You have to go out of your way to screw up a IC system that has 30deg water in it. And most of them are drag cars that are sitting around forever between runs.

Fun Fact:

Donnie Walsh did some testing in the past where he found that if the IAT's got under 90deg he was actually losing HP. Now this was only on one car, and a very extreme track build at that. But it does raise the question, can IAT's get too low?

Cooler air is denser and almost always results in more hp. Sometimes it even pops motors with a fuel system that's on the edge.

Less hp with a cooler iat? I would think it's possible with a car that's already pushing max boost and running a very high octane fuel that ignites a little better with heat.

Someone once did a test (Smokey Yunic?) or built a motor that heated the intake air and it made good power. It was a special one off setup though.

In theory the lower the octane the easier it is to ignite the fuel and therefore more btus which could result in more power. However, we have the issue of knock in a motor with any decent compression.

We also have the nonsensical theory that all engine power is based on btus of the fuel. I know the gas companies like to spout off about btus in gasoline vs other fuels but we have seen plenty of examples where motors make more power with a lower btu fuel like ethanol.

What I'm getting at is that I believe that it's possible to make more power with a higher iat but it's probably not going to happen with most setups.

 

[Department Of Boost]

What I'm getting at is that I believe that it's possible to make more power with a higher iat but it's probably not going to happen with most setups.

I agree. Fun fact though. Gives some perspective about looking at things as black and white.

 

[travelers]

I agree. Fun fact though. Gives some perspective about looking at things as black and white.

I also agree but I think it also depends on the fuel.

 

[BruceH]

I agree. Fun fact though. Gives some perspective about looking at things as black and white.

An open mind is essential to just about anything. Black and white thinking works for things that are well proven and documented but there is always the possibility that whoever wrote the rules screwed up somewhere.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I also agree but I think it also depends on the fuel.

I know it wasn't e85. Was probably some $20/gal race fuel.