The Great Oil Debate

[Grabber2012]

Me neither but Amsoil is on its way. Need to change the engine oil out soon so MTG will be going into the transmission at the same time. If it helps out the ones having issues it only has to make the ones not having issues better, right?

I agree with you it will help out any tranny I was just stating I haven't had any issues. I will be making my first oil change soon planning at 5,000 miles. Btw how many quarts does the tranny hold? And are you guys pumping it in the tranny from the passenger side?

 

[slvr08gt]

Nice write up Frank. On my way to the parts store to pick up some Amsoil MTG right now.

-NIck

 

[trakhoar]

Im sure its in this thread, but torque specs on the drain/fill and how many quarts?

 

[slvr08gt]

Im sure its in this thread, but torque specs on the drain/fill and how many quarts?

Pretty sure you could use the search button for that one. Seriously

 

[trakhoar]

Super seriously or semi-seriously?

 

[BAKnBLK2010]

2.75 quarts for the fill and I have no idea on the torque specs.

 

[techcargt]

Torque specs. , tighten till it strips the threads , then back off half a turn .
Ok here it is , Manual Transmission
Fill Plug 26 ft/lbs
Drain Plug 26 ft/lbs

 

[JAJ]

In other news...

I'm continuing my "try them till you like one" experiment. So far I've had gone through the following in my 2011 GT with a Nov 2010 build date and 7,000 miles including about 2,000 miles of race track duty and an MGW shifter:

Factory pre-TSB oil: Worked fine in warm weather. Good shifting, not noisy. Became hard to shift when cold, and then notchy with an occasional grind until fully warm.

Redline MTL: worked fine, shifted "ok" cold, but got notchy with occasional grind as it warmed up. Great shifting when hot. Noisy when hot.

BMW MTF-LT2 (Pentosin): shifted perfect when cold. Got progressively noisier and notchier as it warmed up. Despite the clunky feeling in the shifter, it never ground once.

BG Synchro Shift II: lets call it the "provisional winner"; stiff shifting into 2nd (and only 2nd) when cold. After about four blocks it's excellent - it shifts best of all of the above at all temperatures and it's the quietest too.

Motul Gear 300 (in there now): we might have a tie for first; I don't have enough miles on it to know yet. Drove the fresh fill this morning from cold for the first time and I wasn't impressed. But it smoothed out toward the end of the drive and when I went out this afternoon, it performed every bit as well as BG SSII.

Local temperatures this week are between 0 and 6 degrees Celsius (say, 32 and 42 degrees F).

I wonder what I'll try next...

 

[slvr08gt]

In other news...

I'm continuing my "try them till you like one" experiment. So far I've had gone through the following in my 2011 GT with a Nov 2010 build date and 7,000 miles including about 2,000 miles of race track duty and an MGW shifter:

Factory pre-TSB oil: Worked fine in warm weather. Good shifting, not noisy. Became hard to shift when cold, and then notchy with an occasional grind until fully warm.

Redline MTL: worked fine, shifted "ok" cold, but got notchy with occasional grind as it warmed up. Great shifting when hot. Noisy when hot.

BMW MTF-LT2 (Pentosin): shifted perfect when cold. Got progressively noisier and notchier as it warmed up. Despite the clunky feeling in the shifter, it never ground once.

BG Synchro Shift II: lets call it the "provisional winner"; stiff shifting into 2nd (and only 2nd) when cold. After about four blocks it's excellent - it shifts best of all of the above at all temperatures and it's the quietest too.

Motul Gear 300 (in there now): we might have a tie for first; I don't have enough miles on it to know yet. Drove the fresh fill this morning from cold for the first time and I wasn't impressed. But it smoothed out toward the end of the drive and when I went out this afternoon, it performed every bit as well as BG SSII.

Local temperatures this week are between 0 and 6 degrees Celsius (say, 32 and 42 degrees F).

I wonder what I'll try next...

Amsoil MTG maybe?

 

[JAJ]

Amsoil MTG maybe?

Actually, the initial post in this thread is a report on Amsoil MTG, so I don't need to test it. If that report had been more encouraging, I might be giving it a try.

 

[UnleashedBeast]

Actually, the initial post in this thread is a report on Amsoil MTG, so I don't need to test it. If that report had been more encouraging, I might be giving it a try.

Honestly, his report shouldn't matter. Since you have tried everything else, you are the one that should try it. You would be the only person who has tried most every possibility.

 

[atistang]

yeah i'm curious to see how you compare it to the bg and the stuff your running now

 

[GrabberBooGT]

For those saying it is "normal" for all manual transmissions to be notchy when cold . . . Are you saying normal for all manuals, or normal for manuals that can take high HP?

Reason I ask: I have a Passat 5-speed with 215k miles. The factory tranny fluid got changed out at 204k (to Redline MTL) as a precaution. Both before and after the change, the tranny is smooth as butter (original clutch too). Even on extremely cold mornings (approaching single digits), the tranny is 98% as smooth as when warm. Really makes my Mustang feel archaic.

My point here, not all manuals have the notchiness cause they're cold. But, I realize this is an apples-to-oranges comparison, and I can concede it may be a function of HP.

 

[VTXFrank]

I agree with you it will help out any tranny I was just stating I haven't had any issues. I will be making my first oil change soon planning at 5,000 miles. Btw how many quarts does the tranny hold? And are you guys pumping it in the tranny from the passenger side?

I put in 2.7qts. Make sure the car is level though. At first, I just had the front end off the ground because I was also changing the engine oil over to Amsoil Signature Series 5W20. You can't get all 2.7 qt's in unless you also jack up the rear of the car to match the front.

Im sure its in this thread, but torque specs on the drain/fill and how many quarts?

As mentioned, 26ft/lbs or, German torque. Gootentight with a 3/8" drive ratchet.

For those saying it is "normal" for all manual transmissions to be notchy when cold . . . Are you saying normal for all manuals, or normal for manuals that can take high HP?

Reason I ask: I have a Passat 5-speed with 215k miles. The factory tranny fluid got changed out at 204k (to Redline MTL) as a precaution. Both before and after the change, the tranny is smooth as butter (original clutch too). Even on extremely cold mornings (approaching single digits), the tranny is 98% as smooth as when warm. Really makes my Mustang feel archaic.

My point here, not all manuals have the notchiness cause they're cold. But, I realize this is an apples-to-oranges comparison, and I can concede it may be a function of HP.

It has been my experience that rear wheel drive cars, with a long drive shaft, typically have more gear whine/noise transmitted to the cabin than other vehicles. Rode in a BMW M3 once that has a significantly shorter D/S setup and it also had some gear noise, but not as much as the Stang. It also doesn't have a solid rear axle like ours.

You put together a long D/S, solid rear axle and then, lower the car and have after market suspension and rear 3-link setups in there, you're going to have more gear noise. Just the nature of the beast. If you have a manly exhaust, you won't hear it much anyway.

 

[Grimace427]

For those saying it is "normal" for all manual transmissions to be notchy when cold . . . Are you saying normal for all manuals, or normal for manuals that can take high HP?

Reason I ask: I have a Passat 5-speed with 215k miles. The factory tranny fluid got changed out at 204k (to Redline MTL) as a precaution. Both before and after the change, the tranny is smooth as butter (original clutch too). Even on extremely cold mornings (approaching single digits), the tranny is 98% as smooth as when warm. Really makes my Mustang feel archaic.

My point here, not all manuals have the notchiness cause they're cold. But, I realize this is an apples-to-oranges comparison, and I can concede it may be a function of HP.

I had an '08 Audi A4 2.0T Quattro 6-Speed(three times fast) before my mustang and loved that transmission. It could be notchy in the cold, however, shifting 1-2 and occasionally 2-3 and would intermittently grind just a tiny bit before it warmed up. I never changed anything in the car the whole time I owned it, but aside from the extra noise from my driveshaft and solid rear control arms the mustang is quite comparable to the Audi in terms of smoothness(with the BG Synchro Shift II fluid I have in it now).

 

[Grabber2012]

Who makes this BG Synchro Shift II?

 

[Grimace427]

Who makes this BG Synchro Shift II?

BG is the name of the company.

 

[trakhoar]

Thanks fellas. I have a jug of left over MTG so I might try it. has another tried a cocktail of MTG+syncromesh? I remember from my evo days we would do something similar..MTL with a dash of friction modifier

 

[Lewis26]

Thanks fellas. I have a jug of left over MTG so I might try it. has another tried a cocktail of MTG+syncromesh? I remember from my evo days we would do something similar..MTL with a dash of friction modifier

I remember reading that the friction modifier is bad for the brass synchros.

 

[JAJ]

Following on from last night's summary post, and the question about whether I'd try Amsoil, here are my thoughts.

I have now dropped the Motul that I liked so much at the end of they day yesterday. When it's cold (30 degrees F this morning) it just won't shift into second. Once warm, it's excellent. It's a good summer track day oil, but not a winter oil

So where does that leave me? Well, two 75w-90's haven't shifted well, if at all, when the weather's cold: Ford's OEM fluid and Motul Gear 300, an ester-based product with excellent viscosity numbers (pour point -60 celsius). That suggests that Amsoil's MTG, also a 75w-90, will probably not shift well when it's cold. It might in other people's transmissions, but I'm doing all this to find an oil I like in my transmission.

So, I went over the chemical signatures and viscosity ranges of all the oils I've tried (the internet knows everything - it has VOA's of all these products if you do enough digging) and concluded that I need a gearbox lube with the same friction structure as BG SS II and the viscosity of the BMW MTF-LT2.

Not that you can tell anything like that from VOA's, but at least you can separate the ATF's from the gear oils and come up with some candidates that have a good probability of performing.

I put the newest one in this afternoon. We'll see what a nice drive in the crisp morning air brings tomorrow.