Anyone run Eibach R1 or R2 coilovers?

[CobraRed]

Simone else makes the others for them. I think it's KW.

Somehow I doubt that. Even on the coilovers they do make for Eibach, it's only the European version of the Eibach Pro-Street S for example - with the domestic version not being made by them.
Only if the packaging says Made in Germany would I even start to wonder.

 

[Department Of Boost]

Somehow I doubt that. Even on the coilovers they do make for Eibach, it's only the European version of the Eibach Pro-Street S for example - with the domestic version not being made by them.
Only if the packaging says Made in Germany would I even start to wonder.

If it isn't KW it's someone else. The only coilovers Eibach makes are the R2's.

 

[Sky Render]

KW normally makes good stuff...

 

[Department Of Boost]

KW normally makes good stuff...

Absolutely.

 

[foolio2k4]

I have mine but they leaking in the fronts. Did get them used though.

I used to have the Tein Flex and the R2s are miles better. Softer ride yet the damping is much better.

I will agree with the wheel clearance though. Even fitting a 255 wide tire up front on a stock GT500 wheel starts to rub on the inside. I dont know why they made the strut limit how much inboard wheel clearance you can have.

 

[Department Of Boost]

I have mine but they leaking in the fronts. Did get them used though.

Every damper will leak eventually. In my experience, which is a lot, the higher end stuff leaks more often. Especially when used as intended. I've put seals in about elevindy billion Ohlins and Penske dampers.

 

[Mark Aubele]

Every damper will leak eventually. In my experience, which is a lot, the higher end stuff leaks more often. Especially when used as intended. I've put seals in about elevindy billion Ohlins and Penske dampers.

I used to get about 1000 miles out of my Ground Control ADs (E36 M3) before I had to rebuild them.

 

[Sky Render]

I'm pretty sure cardboard tubes stuffed with llama poop would be better than Teins.

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[Department Of Boost]

I'm pretty sure cardboard tubes stuffed with llama poop would be better than Teins.

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Llama poop is high grade stuff.

 

[kcbrown]

Every damper will leak eventually. In my experience, which is a lot, the higher end stuff leaks more often. Especially when used as intended. I've put seals in about elevindy billion Ohlins and Penske dampers.

That raises that rather pointed and relevant question:

Which high end dampers don't start to leak after 10K miles or so?

JRI? AST? MCS?

Bilstein? (had to throw that in because csamsh and Terry like them, while everyone knows that Konis self-destruct just by putting them on the car. )

Someone who drives their car daily (like me) isn't going to want to have to rebuild the dampers every few thousand miles.

 

[Sky Render]

I've put over 30K miles and countless autocrosses on my Koni yellows.

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[Department Of Boost]

I've put over 30K miles and countless autocrosses on my Koni yellows.

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I didn't know Koni Yellows were coilovers.

 

[Department Of Boost]

That raises that rather pointed and relevant question:

Which high end dampers don't start to leak after 10K miles or so?

JRI? AST? MCS?

Bilstein? (had to throw that in because csamsh and Terry like them, while everyone knows that Konis self-destruct just by putting them on the car. )

Someone who drives their car daily (like me) isn't going to want to have to rebuild the dampers every few thousand miles.

Race dampers are not for daily driving.

 

[Mark Aubele]

I know this forum hates on Konis constantly, but my OTS Koni yellows with a GC coilover conversion are holding up admirably with 550/300 rates with a ton of abuse. Hillclimb/track/Autocross and street miles. I will have them rebuilt yearly but you should be doing that with any damper. I may upgrade but only because I want to run a 800lb spring up front and if these cant be valved to handle it I will run soemthing else.

I think the key to making them live is the car is only lowered 1", and I have increased bump travel significantly with the Ground Control camber plates. Pain in the ass to adjust but they raise the upper mount around 1". I also run the factory bumpstops front and rear.

 

[kcbrown]

Race dampers are not for daily driving.

What is it about race dampers that make them unsuitable for that kind of duty? Why are they more fragile than mass produced dampers?

I get that, when paired with relatively stiff springs, the internal pressures will end up being that much higher in rebound (because the damper has to control the same amount of exerted force over a shorter distance), and that would cause them to wear faster and be more sensitive to any damage. But that's a function of the springs they're paired with. I don't see why they would fail to last as long as mass produced dampers when paired with springs of roughly the same rates as those the mass produced dampers are being used with. Indeed, because they're supposed to be constructed with higher quality, I would expect them to last longer than mass produced dampers.

The litmus test for this on the S197 is the dampers in the rear, because the stock spring rates are relatively close to most coilover rates back there.

 

[Whiskey11]

What is it about race dampers that make them unsuitable for that kind of duty? Why are they more fragile than mass produced dampers?

I get that, when paired with relatively stiff springs, the internal pressures will end up being that much higher in rebound (because the damper has to control the same amount of exerted force over a shorter distance), and that would cause them to wear faster and be more sensitive to any damage. But that's a function of the springs they're paired with. I don't see why they would fail to last as long as mass produced dampers when paired with springs of roughly the same rates as those the mass produced dampers are being used with. Indeed, because they're supposed to be constructed with higher quality, I would expect them to last longer than mass produced dampers.

The litmus test for this on the S197 is the dampers in the rear, because the stock spring rates are relatively close to most coilover rates back there.

The seals on higher end dampers have less stiction than your off the shelf damper to produce more consistent force curves. These seals do not last as long as the ones in an off the shelf damper or OEM damper which are far more durable but have more stiction.

It's all about that force curve's consistency.

 

[kcbrown]

The seals on higher end dampers have less stiction than your off the shelf damper to produce more consistent force curves. These seals do not last as long as the ones in an off the shelf damper or OEM damper which are far more durable but have more stiction.

It's all about that force curve's consistency.

That is very interesting indeed. Learn something new every day.

For a monotube damper like the Bilsteins, how much of a difference does the seal type actually make to the predictability of the car? You'd think the forces involved would easily overcome the stiction in the seals, such that the stiction (even of a more durable seal) represents a very small percentage of the forces involved.

I would guess the stiction might show up as hysteresis?

 

[Department Of Boost]

That is very interesting indeed. Learn something new every day.

For a monotube damper like the Bilsteins, how much of a difference does the seal type actually make to the predictability of the car? You'd think the forces involved would easily overcome the stiction in the seals, such that the stiction (even of a more durable seal) represents a very small percentage of the forces involved.

I would guess the stiction might show up as hysteresis?

There are a lot more factors than just the seals.

 

[Vorshlag-Fair]

Eibach makes the R2's. Simone else makes the others for them. I think it's KW.

You are just grasping at straws here... "I think its made by the tooth fairy". If you're just guessing, as you clearly are here, don't bother to post. It only muddies the waters.

I'm not accusing Terry of anything but being a Eibach hater and not backing that up with anything but heresy. For a guy who has pictures of everything I find it odd that he doesn't have pictures of failed R2's.

Additionally Terry is constantly comparing R2's to much more expensive dampers and then says the R2's are low in quality. Well, the same sort of comparison could be made with any product.

He clearly hates them. I would like to know the specifics on why. He has never provided these specifics.

Don't put words in my mouth, bub. I don't mention these warnings because "I'm a hater" - that not how we do business.

We don't take photos of everything, particularly when it's not something we sell or develop. How do you show worn out chrome and substandard hardening in a photo? But we do have some Eibach bent shaft pics as well as other brands that have bent housings or shafts, and on and on. Posting those gets complicated when you run a real business, and not just some internet keyboard cowboy slinging mud. It isn't worth the battles with the fanbois or the manufacturers - so I just give my honest onions and warnings and leave it at that.

We've been an Eibach dealer for many years, and have sold their swaybars and lowering springs to hundreds of people. But after seeing their coilover products at trade shows, talking to their engineers, then seeing issues directly on customer's cars and hearing from dozens more that had failures in short order when racing on these "who knows where they are made" dampers, we chose NOT to sell or support this brand. Its as simple as that.

We don't sell a LOT of brands of dampers that we can get through our wholesale supplies or direct from the manufacturer - Koni, KW, Tein, and any dampers made in China. There are various reasons why we don't sell those brands and even better reasons why we do sell the brands we support. But one thing is for certain - I don't have to justify my reasons or offer up further proof to "departments of boost", whatever the hell that means.

/unsub

 

[kcbrown]

There are a lot more factors than just the seals.

That impact longevity and/or time between rebuilds? What other things impact that?




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