BMW M3 gets compared to new GT Mustang...

[SilentScope]

I'm with this guy. Although the Mustang isn't quite at the level of the BMW with regards to the quality of materials, it has made quantum leaps in this area and IMO performance is a toss-up.

Close, but is they were "equal", they would be similar price.

The BMW has fit, finish, and quality, as well as technology and design that a mustang cannot match at the moment.

The mustang has made vast improvements, but the M3 has been a pinnacle performance car since the 80's, if not earlier.

 

[pacettr]

Close, but is they were "equal", they would be similar price.

The BMW has fit, finish, and quality, as well as technology and design that a mustang cannot match at the moment.

The mustang has made vast improvements, but the M3 has been a pinnacle performance car since the 80's, if not earlier.

I will agree with the overall fit/finish/quality, but tell me this: what technology advantage does the BMW hold?

 

[pieperz06]

They both hold a .97g on the skid pad

there is a lot more to handling than skid pad g's

 

[Drex]

I will agree with the overall fit/finish/quality, but tell me this: what technology advantage does the BMW hold?

The suspension alone has several modes ranging from race ready to comfort, activated by a button. The dst tranny is pretty amazing too.

 

[Twinscrewgt]

I think the BMW is too complicated. I watched the top gear episode and idrive seems way to complex. It to him a good 2-3 min to set the engine to the 400hp mode. Simple is good. And every BMW I have sat in I wasn't impressed with. And as far a maintenance that's a joke on the BMW.

 

[Twinscrewgt]

there is a lot more to handling than skid pad g's

I guess we will find out soon enough. GTs will be hitting the courses soon enough. I will be taking mine to mmp ( miller motorsports park) and seeing how it does on a real road course.

 

[SilentScope]

I will agree with the overall fit/finish/quality, but tell me this: what technology advantage does the BMW hold?

Engine management, electronic suspension control, electronic diff control..
the EFI tech is way advanced too

 

[pieperz06]

I think the BMW is too complicated. I watched the top gear episode and idrive seems way to complex. It to him a good 2-3 min to set the engine to the 400hp mode. Simple is good. And every BMW I have sat in I wasn't impressed with. And as far a maintenance that's a joke on the BMW.

there is no doubt about that im not saying im a fan of the m3 but they are a good car for what they are made for.

cant wait to see how it is at miller that is a crazy long track if you do the full thing

 

[Chrome61]

What bugs me is everytime I see a guy in his 'Beamer' with his hair slicked back with Dapper Dan shoe polish and a smug look on his face I think....what a queer motherfucker.....and do the windows on these cars roll down? I've never seen one rolled down, I quess there sound proof so they don't hear the heckling.....But hey, It's just me that thinks that way. I quess

 

[Twinscrewgt]

there is no doubt about that im not saying im a fan of the m3 but they are a good car for what they are made for.

cant wait to see how it is at miller that is a crazy long track if you do the full thing

Open track days they only use half the track. Still pretty long tho. Should be fun

 

[Herknav]

I think the BMW is too complicated. I watched the top gear episode and idrive seems way to complex. It to him a good 2-3 min to set the engine to the 400hp mode. Simple is good. And every BMW I have sat in I wasn't impressed with. And as far a maintenance that's a joke on the BMW.

err, that was an M5, not an m3...

the M3 always puts out the same amount of HP/Tq.

iDrive is alot better than it used to be. My 08 was kinda counter-intuitive.

With the Technology Package, the M3 comes with 3 levels of EDC (Electronic Dampening Control) Normal, Kinda Stiff, and Hold on to your kidneys. It also comes with 3 elevels of traction control; nanny, dad stepping back and letting you wobble, and YOU BETTER KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING. It also has 3 levels of throttle response, normal, sport, and sport+. You can map desired levels to the M button and when you hit it, they will all engage. The car starts in all normal however, (well, mine does, especially while I am still in break-in).

Oh, and careful citing Top Gear as a source; when they "reviewed" the S197, they quoted GT numbers, but drove the V6... and didn't realize it...

 

[pacettr]

Engine management, electronic suspension control, electronic diff control..
the EFI tech is way advanced too

Could you elaborate on the advantages of the engine management and the electronic suspension control?

 

[Riptide]

lol cars nowadays. It's like a 747. You almost need a "flight" engineer to help out with all the settings.

 

[SilentScope]

Could you elaborate on the advantages of the engine management and the electronic suspension control?

oh no, i'm not saying that it is necessarily better, I actually am a purist when it comes to cars.

But, the fact that the technology is there, and does actually work, relates into a "better" car per se.

The advantage is it offers a simpler method for the average driver to select his/her driving more. now the technology works pretty good, not perfect, but its getting better. The average driver, who leases his car, with a bluetooth headset, shiny glasses, a watch, and slick hair, now thinks he drives a race car.

 

[Herknav]

The advantage is it offers a simpler method for the average driver to select his/her driving more. now the technology works pretty good, not perfect, but its getting better. The average driver, who leases his car, with a bluetooth headset, shiny glasses, a watch, and slick hair, now thinks he drives a race car.

Or the guy who bought his car, with a cell phone rattling around the center console, impact glasses from his last deployment, no watch and no hair thinks he drives an aweful fun piece of machinery around western Germany...

 

[SilentScope]

Or the guy who bought his car, with a cell phone rattling around the center console, impact glasses from his last deployment, no watch and no hair thinks he drives an aweful fun piece of machinery around western Germany...

haha there are a few, very few, exceptions...

 

[1andonlywhitie]

nah, not you. the M3 and Mustang Spawned the discussion.

Good point.


Technology can suck big time though.. All that fly-by-wire this, automatic that, it can kinda disconnect you from the car I think. Thats not to say the car won't be good to drive, its just not the same... My little Escort here in Australia has no power steering, no traction control and a four speed... (It's actually a bit like a miniature 60's Mustang in technology/setup terms...)

It is remarkable to drive, you feel every little bump, you feel every gear change, you actually feel fully connected/responsible for what the car is doing... I don't think you can get that feeling in a new car. Thats not to say new cars are bad...just...different.

And more back on topic, the 2010/11 GT's may be catching that M3 in finish and quality terms but the differnce with the M3 is you are paying for this little shiny circle:

 

[Drex]

Or the guy who bought his car, with a cell phone rattling around the center console, impact glasses from his last deployment, no watch and no hair thinks he drives an aweful fun piece of machinery around western Germany...

Damn, that's a description of me, or close anyway. I don't act
Like a squid on the autobahn though. I see too many Americans acting like fools driving around here.

 

[Chris B.]

Keep in mind those BMW M3 Stats are based off the Sedan, not the Coupe!!! Heres the article: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests...rcedes_c63_amg_comparison/specifications.html

The Coupe I would bet performs better then that.. Also, I would imagine without the extra 2 doors in the back it manages to shave off another 100lbs or so. I am still anxious to see a comparison but I think those results are going to vary a bit more.

I'm sure the $28,000 saved in buying the 2011 Mustang GT over the M3 or the $24,000 saved in buying the 2011 GT with the track pack over the M3 buys a whole lot of instruction at Bondurant and Skip Barber along with track days that will allow you to run much faster lap time than 98% of the M3 drivers out there.

 

[WJK]

I'm sure the $28,000 saved in buying the 2011 Mustang GT over the M3 or the $24,000 saved in buying the 2011 GT with the track pack over the M3 buys a whole lot of instruction at Bondurant and Skip Barber along with track days that will allow you to run much faster lap time than 98% of the M3 drivers out there.

O I wouldn't doubt that! Plus the aftermarket for these stangs is going to be insane (well, I guess any stang really). Most M3s will probably remain stock where as a good percentag of new 5.0s will be gaining suspension and engine mods. All I can say is that in the next 5- 10 years there is going to be a rediculous amount of really fast cars flooding the streets. It might as well be the early 70s all over again, with better safety equipment but way more drivers on the road!