Driveshaft balancing the Ford way?

[GriffX]

I have a NVH issue from 67-70 MPH in the car since day 1. I can feel a tiny vibration in the seat combined with a drone. Until now I avoided this speed range as often as possible.

But now, because I noise insulated my car, the NVH is more audible and from 62-75 MPH and much more annoying. My car is quieter at 85 than at 65 now, not good.

A one piece driveshaft is not an option, the Ford manual says one can add a hose clamp in different positions at the end of the shaft towards the differential.

Has anyone tried this?

Thanks!

 

[DieHarder]

I have a NVH issue from 67-70 MPH in the car since day 1.

Maybe time to take it to someone who specializes in drive shafts and let them check/rebalance if needed?

 

[Miker]

Now that's thinking outside the box! Seems a bit like a needle in a haystack type solution. Why is a 1 piece shaft not an option?

 

[GriffX]

I'm living in a rural area of Germany, it is even hard to find a shop who wants to take my car for a standard repair. These specialized shops disappeared here long ago. The nearest US car shop (old Mustangs and Corvettes) once complained that the repair manual I printed out for them is in English - I turned around and left (true story)

The one piece shaft is very expensive. You can add 30-40% to the US price for shipping and import tax to it ((price+shipping) +3.5% import tax)+19% sales tax.

I've seen some videos, this can be a very painful process without a two-post lift. Jacking rails first would be useful......

 

[JEWC_Motorsports]

Have you got under the car to check the carrier? It might be failing.

 

[Miker]

I'm living in a rural area of Germany, it is even hard to find a shop who wants to take my car for a standard repair. These specialized shops disappeared here long ago. The nearest US car shop (old Mustangs and Corvettes) once complained that the repair manual I printed out for them is in English - I turned around and left (true story)

The one piece shaft is very expensive. You can add 30-40% to the US price for shipping and import tax to it ((price+shipping) +3.5% import tax)+19% sales tax.

I've seen some videos, this can be a very painful process without a two-post lift. Jacking rails first would be useful......

I agree with the lift. I did mine on my driveway. I had the rear supported on the axel and it was as high as I could get it without the Roush bumper hitting the ground in the front. I do not have a lip on the front bumper. Even at that I had to slide under on my back as a creeper was too high. It was the front bolts that were a bitch. On a lift it is a sub 1hr job I would imagine. On stands in the driveway it kicked my butt. My center carrier was able to move back and forth probably an inch on the stock shaft that had been in there for 155,000 miles.

 

[Whpony96]

Go to a local Ford dealership and have them order a complete driveshaft for you. Just keep in mind a one piece aluminum driveshaft will weigh much less and it will save you on shipping costs.

 

[GriffX]

Have you got under the car to check the carrier? It might be failing.

I did a visual inspection last winter. I have not seen any cracks in the rubber, but I could push the shaft 1 inch up, so I don't know. Car has 50k miles. The U-joint at the transmission had no play or bind. The balancing weights were ok. I think a failing carrier bearing is a possibility.

 

[GriffX]

Go to a local Ford dealership and have them order a complete driveshaft for you. Just keep in mind a one piece aluminum driveshaft will weigh much less and it will save you on shipping costs.

There are only a few Ford dealer able (or willing) to order parts for the S197 in Germany. Nearest for bigger repairs beside oil change is 70 mi away. If they have to order parts from US, they do it via Ford Germany -> Ford USA, wich doubles the costs. I once ordered a 18$ gasket this way, 4 weeks later I paid 70$ for it.
If I order a driveshaft let's say from summit, a shaft from the Driveshaft Shop, 1000$, plus shipping plus tax it is 1350$ at my front door.
So I want to be sure I have to before. It is a shame that the carrier bearing is not changeable, by the way. A Mercedes carrier bearing is 15$.

 

[OX1]

Have you got under the car to check the carrier? It might be failing.

THIS!!!. Mine was bad @ 10K miles, like the rubber was completely shot. I messed with tires and rims for years before it got bad enough I figured it had to be something else. Unfortunately, the carrier bearing rubber is not replaceable. I tried a carbon fiber QA1 driveshaft, but it vibrated like crazy under heavy acceleration (and only then).

If it turns out to be the rubber surrounding carrier bearing, I can show you how to fix it
on stock driveshaft. But it takes a tiny bit of fab work and a touch of welding.

 

[OX1]

I did a visual inspection last winter. I have not seen any cracks in the rubber, but I could push the shaft 1 inch up, so I don't know. Car has 50k miles. The U-joint at the transmission had no play or bind. The balancing weights were ok. I think a failing carrier bearing is a possibility.

How loose mine was

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/MUSTANG GT/DRIVESHAFT/CARRIER BEARING BUSHING/20220630_150645.mp4

Everything I find claims this driveshaft it "not serviceable". So far, this is what I'm trying. I marked all three connections with orange paint to re-install exactly like it came out. No nut to remove on CB flange, so it must be a really tight press fit.

Also check if yellow dot on driveshaft matches yellow dot on pinion flange (my yellow dot shown here on pinion flange is painted over black)

Hard to see, but there is nothing but hollow tube looking down hole inside flange that would need to be pressed off to change CB and rubber bushing. So the idea of using some form of puller is out.

So there is a tac weld on both brackets.

Ground those off and got brackets off bushing.

Rubber does not look ripped or cracked in any way. I think Ford just made it too soft to begin with. Hard to believe I could not find more info on these failing, if mine was this bad at this low mileage.

Ended up getting some 1/4" X 3/4" rubber strip from McMaster Carr. Luckily, they have a jersey warehouse about 12 miles down the highway from me.

http://[URL]https://www.mcmaster.com/1462N26/

[/URL]


High temp, up to 500F and durometer 50 (so medium hardness)

I was able to "shim" the stock rubber bushing all the way around with this rubber strip.

All together with bolts holding it for now. Running rubber shim all the way around, also ensures shaft is centered in bushing.

Break out the welder and re-tac'd those brackets together





Testing the "play", with virtually all my weight on it (whole 156 lbs )

http://luxjo.supermotors.net/MUSTANG GT/DRIVESHAFT/CARRIER BEARING BUSHING/TWO/20220705_170930.mp4


Seems at least as stiff as the new DS in the only video I could find on S197 shaft replacement. Has held for a couple years so far this way. Vibes reduced 95%

 

[Miker]

Go to a local Ford dealership and have them order a complete driveshaft for you. Just keep in mind a one piece aluminum driveshaft will weigh much less and it will save you on shipping costs.

I don't think the oem driveshaft is available anymore. I looked into it some (not much) before I ordered my FRPP shaft.

 

[GriffX]

THIS!!!. Mine was bad @ 10K miles, like the rubber was completely shot. I messed with tires and rims for years before it got bad enough I figured it had to be something else. Unfortunately, the carrier bearing rubber is not replaceable. I tried a carbon fiber QA1 driveshaft, but it vibrated like crazy under heavy acceleration (and only then).

If it turns out to be the rubber surrounding carrier bearing, I can show you how to fix it
on stock driveshaft. But it takes a tiny bit of fab work and a touch of welding.

That play is exactly like mine. I can do this work, probably not before this fall, but it's possible for me.
Thanks a lot. What is the maximum speed you tested it? What is the build date of your car?

 

[OX1]

I don't think the oem driveshaft is available anymore. I looked into it some (not much) before I ordered my FRPP shaft.

I believe this is correct. When I first realized carrier and carrier rubber were not servicable, I looked up stock shaft. Discontinued.

That play is exactly like mine. I can do this work, probably not before this fall, but it's possible for me.
Thanks a lot. What is the maximum speed you tested it? What is the build date of your car?

Good to hear. If you have issues getting a suitable rubber piece and need to get the McMaster Carr stuff, I could maybe help you get it shipped from NJ USA (never shipped overseas, but if you figure it out, I'll help) I have an account there, it is about 20 minutes from my house,
https://www.mcmaster.com/contact/new-jersey
and I can pickup pretty much anything they have in about a day.

I've been well over 100 since then. When it was really bad, my hood would practically shake off the car above 70. Now it is about back to "normal". I don't have anything close to original stock tires on, so hard to tell if it is EXACTLY like it was bone stock, but 1000% times better then when shaft was apparently banging around in that rubber, wildly.

I still can't believe that you are maybe the 4th person I've heard of this. I'm on many Ford and Mustang boards too.

 

[GriffX]

I'm glad that I opened that thread to get the information from you.
(BTW you can improve the hood shake by correcting the hood rubber stops (?) in the front. Turn them a bit out, shifts the start of the shake well above 80.)

I found a vendor of EPDM 50Sh rubber, but not silicone like yours. I think the middle-soft 50Sh is important. Unfortunately I have to buy 10 meter of it. Maybe I will find an other.

Would be interesting to know the part revision history of the driveshaft if it is related to only some build date of the car? Or, people simply switched to the one-piece aftermarket shafts when they got problems.

 

[GriffX]

I just had the opportunity to inspect a Mercedes driveshaft. The middle support rubber bushing is rocksolid. I was able to move it only a few millimeters. I hope I can get my MB off the lift soon to do the modification.

 

[OX1]

I'm glad that I opened that thread to get the information from you.
(BTW you can improve the hood shake by correcting the hood rubber stops (?) in the front. Turn them a bit out, shifts the start of the shake well above 80.)

I found a vendor of EPDM 50Sh rubber, but not silicone like yours. I think the middle-soft 50Sh is important. Unfortunately I have to buy 10 meter of it. Maybe I will find an other.

Would be interesting to know the part revision history of the driveshaft if it is related to only some build date of the car? Or, people simply switched to the one-piece aftermarket shafts when they got problems.

Will try the hood thing, thanks. I bet many are still driving around with various states of vibrations, having tried multiple wheel setups and who knows what-else (to fix it), and never figured it out. Many did go to one piece shaft, but that was a disaster for me.

 

[GriffX]

Finely got the car on my lift and inspected my driveshaft.
The rubber of my middle bearing has rotated, I can push the shaft 3/8 up with ease. Maybe it is just a production error of the metal bracket with not enough clamping of the rubber?

 

[GriffX]

I cannot get the 12 point bolts out. Soaked it in penetration oil and used an 700 ft lb air impact wrench. Not one out of 4 moved.
The driveshaft was mounted the last time from a workshop.
What options do I have now?

 

[JC SSP]

Put some heat on it… propane torch.