Forty61
forum member
I might actually do a little research into those, I doubt I’ll end up with a blower on the car any time soon so if I have to change things way down the line I will.
Underdrive Pulleys - Cost VS Quality
- Thread starter Forty61
- Start date
I might actually do a little research into those, I doubt I’ll end up with a blower on the car any time soon so if I have to change things way down the line I will.
Dunno why, but the electric pump for the 2010 car made like a 1-2 hp improvement vs the 2010 oem mechanical pump. There is something fundamentally different in the design of the 2010 oem water pump. It was written up in 5.0 mag yrs ago. On the 05-09 cars, the electric pump indeed made a substantial improvement. Edelbrock made water pumps in 2 versions, 05-09..and 2010.
Forty61
forum member
Do they interchange though? I wonder if like the alternators it’s worth buying a 2010 specific unit when replacing them. I also wonder what else changed in that last year of the 3V.
Edelbrock made mech water pumps....and the 05-09 version was not interchangeable with the 2010 version. I researched it a bunch yrs ago, and did not get to the bottom of it. Shoulda e-mailed edelbrock or asked ford.
Midlife Crises
Senior Member
I’m using the Edelbrock water pump on my 2010. It is supposed to have heavier duty bearings and the impeller is different. If I remember correctly one has an open impeller and the other is closed.
Tasca lists the same part number for the 2010 as the 2005-2009 so if there is any difference, it is minimal
Stoenr
forum member
I am pretty sure I have my Steeda set here. Went FI last year. If I have them Id part with them for $50 plus like $20 to ship.
What baffles me is the electric water pump offerings, provide no net additional hp benefit on the 2010, and quite a bit on the 05-09 cars, go figure.
Dino Dino Bambino
I have a red car
I don't know where you're finding that information. The OEM and aftermarket water pumps on all 05-10 GTs are exactly the same. As for the HP benefit of the EWP, it's a ~7rwhp gain if you have stock pulleys but only a ~3rwhp gain if you have underdrive pulleys.
Underdrive pulleys yield a ~9rwhp gain. Of that, ~4rwhp comes from slowing down the water pump, and ~5rwhp comes from slowing down the alternator & PS pump.
PonyBoy
Member
I just took my 2010 GT into the shop for some work including the SR under drive pulleys, Edelbrock High Flow Water Pump; thermostat, belt, belt tensioner, hoses, Fluid Dampened Harmonic Balancer, aluminum radiator and better fan, monoblade TB w/adaptor plate, fuel pump, rebuilt GT350 Brembo brakes. Heading to the Dyno after that. Figured might as well do it all while they got it open. I didn't break the bank on any of these items. So the car won't have the "expensive" parts, but everything will be better than OEM and I can still put fuel in the car to have some fun.
BTW - Twin turbos, Hurst short throw shifter, twin-disc 800 HP clutch, alum drive shaft, 4.10's, Eaton dif, forged axles, BMR sway bars, upper and lower control arms, panhard bar and brace, FP intake manifold, fuel rails, injectors, FP lowering springs/struts. The weak link left are the 5 speed tranny. which would make sense if I rebuild the engine with forged parts and push up the boost.
BTW - Twin turbos, Hurst short throw shifter, twin-disc 800 HP clutch, alum drive shaft, 4.10's, Eaton dif, forged axles, BMR sway bars, upper and lower control arms, panhard bar and brace, FP intake manifold, fuel rails, injectors, FP lowering springs/struts. The weak link left are the 5 speed tranny. which would make sense if I rebuild the engine with forged parts and push up the boost.
It was well documented yrs ago in 5.0 magazine. The EWP on a 2010 yielded like 1 hp... which baffled the folks who installed it...since they had installed a LOT of EWP's on 05-09 cars...and it was a lot more than 7 hp. And no, the edelbrock 2010 pump is not compatible with the 05-09 cars. Edelbrock offered 2 x versions, 05-09..and 2010.
Let me get this straight, you are doing the SR pulleys, but then you are doing a fluidamper? You realize under drive pulleys on these cars are just the crank pulley/balancer and the water pump pulley, right?
I don't know if fluidampers have gotten any better over the years but I wouldn't touch one due to their past history.
They have the short style (mid 2001-2004) 8803 pump and the long style (1996-Mid 2001 and 2005-2010 Mustang) 8804 part number. The 2010 does not use a different water pump than the 05-09, there is no some magical friction free super pump of 2010.
So why does edelbrock list 2 x versions of their water pump, 05-09..and 2010 ? The oem ford versions appear to be the same from 05-10. Why does the EWP for the 2010 gain nothing ?
Show me where they do. Edelbrock's catalogue lists a long and a short style, the short is for mid 2001-2004 Mustang GT's.
The durability and the flow capabilities of the stock water pump has never been an issue so why not keep the $150 price difference in your pocket?
Uhhh... it's called physics. It takes energy to run the pump to push water around your motor and through the radiator. When you go electric it swaps that energy source from the mechanical engine power to electrical power from your battery or alternator thus there is a net gain in power from your motor. Same kind of gains are made by going to electric power steering. Unless you live in an alternate dimension where our physics don't apply I don't know how you can actually believe there is no net gain.
Also with an electric pump your engine will run cooler which makes gains in itself as far as engine efficiency.
The folks at 5.0 didn't measure any gains when the oem pump was replaced with the EWP...on a 2010.
Several yrs ago I looked at the EWP option in great detail. I also looked at the mech pump from Edelbrock. 8 yrs ago, Edelbrock did list a separate mech pump for the 2010..vs the 05-09 cars.
Forget who made the popular EWP at the time, but the EWP, pumped the same amount of water as the mech pump would have, at 3 krpm. So at idle, or < 3krpm, the EWP pumped loads of extra water. > 3 krpm, the EWP pumped less water than the mech pump.
I followed the thread of several folks who had installed the EWP, and 3 of em had the EWP crap out within 2-3 years. Then one more fellow had EWP failure. I dropped the idea after that, due to reliability issues at the time, and also negligible hp gains. I don't see any vehicle manufacturer using EWP's as oem. You would have to be sucking one helluva lot of current to get the eq flow rate of a mech water pump at 4-7 krpm. To double the flow rate, the pressure would have to be quadrupled, which is no mean feat for any electrical pump.
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The difference is that an electrical pump is running at the same rate all of the time as opposed to a mechanical that is slow at idle and increases flow with RPM. So at speed the mechanical pump probably flows more but overall the electrical will flow more water. This is evident in the fact that all of my cars with electric pumps run cooler. The advantage is when you need the most flow, at idle or slow speeds, when there is little air moving over the radiator the added flow increases your cooling capacity. Overall cooling capacity is increased with an electric.
None of my actual pumps have ever failed. I did have issues with the dummy idler pulley on there but the pump has never gone out. I've run at least a dozen meziere pumps over the years without an actual pump failure. My pump flows 55 gpm and draws less than 20 amps. I've put them on every race car I have built or owned.
OEM manufacturers do not currently use electric pumps but up until a couple years ago they didn't do electrical power steering either. Give it time, as CAFE restrictions get harder and harder to meet I think we may see some manufacturers go this route.
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