cam phaser question

[crownaviation]

other than the gasket failures with the new ones... I think they are better (and they hold some pressure after shutdown). I have a new found faith in the Ford guys that made the decision to redesign them to what we have now. Certainly not worth breaking another chain guide and having a chain jump tooth.

My motor will only go one season between overhauls so I am not worried about the gaskets too much and just replace the tensioners on each rebuild..

 

[crownaviation]

hey crown!! did it sound like this!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-RP3g2AV53k

here is my carnage after less than a total of 60 min run time.

my brandnew steel tensioner collapsed and chain went loose and beat the F out of everything in my timing cover

Yes, mine broke too. It also sheared off the guide pin on the Right hand bank. Found it rolling around in the oil pan.

 

[lito]

...and can actually cause the knock sensors to ping.

Makes sense if you think about it. The hard steel will transfer a lot more force than a softer plastic.

Is this for real?

 

[Dubstep Shep]

Is this for real?

His words, not mine. Idk about it pinging the knock sensors, but there's no doubt a steel tensioner would transfer more vibrations.

His experience has been the 3V engines do better with the 3V tensioners. Considering the depth of his experience in the matter, I wasn't going to argue lol.

 

[michael.konor]

Before I went to steel tensioners, I hadn't broken a single guide in over 30k miles. After going to the steel tensioners, I broke two guides at the same power levels.

I'm back to plastic tensioners...

Of course, your experiences may vary.

 

[skwerl]

The problem with the steel ones is that the ratcheting mechanism does not retract, ever. The chains are very long and have a certain amount of play as they spin. If the ratchet mechanism happens to barely catch the next notch at an idle, then when the motor is spun up to 7000rpm and the chain is too tight then things break.

 

[michael.konor]

The problem with the steel ones is that the ratcheting mechanism does not retract, ever. The chains are very long and have a certain amount of play as they spin. If the ratchet mechanism happens to barely catch the next notch at an idle, then when the motor is spun up to 7000rpm and the chain is too tight then things break.

Damn, forgot to mention that part. The racheting mechanism on the *R* side broke, along with the guide.

 

[19COBRA93]

LOL at the suggestion that steel tensioners transfer noise to the knock sensors. Sorry, but no. The '13/14 Boss 302's run steel tensioners, maybe someone should tell Ford?

Somewhere on the interwebz there's a graph that shows engine knock compared with all the other engine sounds. The engine knock was miles above the other running sounds that it's "almost" impossible for those sensors to pick up anything else (production-wise) and interpret it into knock.

With that said, those are some interesting, and unfortunate, failures with the steel tensioners. I sell a ton of those as upgrades over the plastic ones.

 

[AutoXRacer]

Commenting on the plugs to seal off the valve covers for ones that want to remove their VCT solenoids:

I got some new freeze plugs. These are 36.6mm, 0.6mm larger than the valve cover opening.

It matches the VCT seal pretty well...but 0.6mm too large. I have another set coming that will only be 0.3mm larger. I would prefer a cup style plug versus these coil/flat types.

 

[GT500KR]

what if there were billet ones made? just rtv them in?
also quick question... ive had a major engine problem due to a phaser... now when i lock them out... i can remove the VVT solenoid all together? leave the open hole in the head where it was? will that mess up oil flow somewhere? thanks

 

[lito]

^read the thread, all answers here.

 

[AutoXRacer]

what if there were billet ones made? just rtv them in?

Now that would be AWESOME!! They could even come engraved with custom logos!!!!

Who's got the means to make these??? The opening in the valve cover is perfect of this type of plug!!!

I'm ready with cash!!

I've already spent over $50 in different size expansion plugs trying to find the perfect size. sigh

 

[GT500KR]

Now that would be AWESOME!! They could even come engraved with custom logos!!!!

Who's got the means to make these??? The opening in the valve cover is perfect of this type of plug!!!

I'm ready with cash!!

I've already spent over $50 in different size expansion plugs trying to find the perfect size. sigh

i do

 

[AutoXRacer]

i do

How much will it cost for one off/prototyp?

 

[GT500KR]

PM me. And check out facebook.com/monztermotorsports

 

[AutoXRacer]

PM me. And check out facebook.com/monztermotorsports

Wow, beautiful work!!!!
But whats up with all the Mopar and Ram stuff...? LOL

 

[na svt]

Use the metal tensioners but remove the ratcheting mechanism.

 

[BruceH]

Use the metal tensioners but remove the ratcheting mechanism.

Have you done this? If so how does it hold tension on startup?

 

[dysan]

Even the metal ones are spring loaded so they have some tension even without oil pressure. I have been running the metal tensioners for years now and I actually believe they saved my last engine from having catastrophic failure due to the damn pins the tensioner arms pivot on snaping. If it wasn't for the ratcheting ability of the metal tensioners I believe the chains would have jumped teeth and caused piston to valve issues.

My thoughts are that the use of a two step use may be causing issues with the tensioner arms along with heavier weight oils. My current block doesn't have those screw in pins for the tensioner arms but they are the press fit ones (iron block 4.6) so I have zero concern about those breaking again.

 

[crownaviation]

Even the metal ones are spring loaded so they have some tension even without oil pressure. I have been running the metal tensioners for years now and I actually believe they saved my last engine from having catastrophic failure due to the damn pins the tensioner arms pivot on snaping. If it wasn't for the ratcheting ability of the metal tensioners I believe the chains would have jumped teeth and caused piston to valve issues.

My thoughts are that the use of a two step use may be causing issues with the tensioner arms along with heavier weight oils. My current block doesn't have those screw in pins for the tensioner arms but they are the press fit ones (iron block 4.6) so I have zero concern about those breaking again.

On my last setup it never saw rev limiter and did not use 2step since all the components were new. I also was saved as the ratchet did not retract preventing the chain from skipping... But at the end of the day I am positive without doubt the ratcheting mechanism is what caused the arm and pin to break.

I am using 10w30 but don't think that is the cause of the failure (now using joe Gibbs 5w30)

I used the crap out of the 2step on the stock plastic tensioners with zero failures

I am way too chicken to be test dummy and run the steel tensioners without the ratchets... I have a shit pile of cash in this setup. You would shit. I actually could care less about the block as the bulk is tied up in my heads, 3.4l whipple, rods and pistons... A failure could wipe it all out