UCA - Worth while?

[BMR Tech]

IIRC, Terry hasn't found an arm yet that meets his criteria.

As for the bearing, If I am building a car for performance...I am going to do it right. I will install the bearing on the diff, every-time. As a matter of fact, an arm like our UTCA032 (massive Poly-bushing) in combination with the Spherical Diff bearing....is probably the best performing combination possible, with minimal "clunking" and banging, etc.

Binding is bad, but so is deflection in a stock UCA, or stock Diff Bushing. Keep in mind, the stock sleeve ends are designed so that the arm/bushing will not move...AT ALL. Everytime, ANY movement in, ANY direction, that movement is initiating binding and deflection. A properly designed Poly-Bushing will reduce both..

 

[sheizasosay]

IIRC, Terry hasn't found an arm yet that meets his criteria.Keep in mind, the stock sleeve ends are designed so that the arm/bushing will not move...AT ALL. Everytime, ANY movement in, ANY direction, that movement is initiating binding and deflection. A properly designed Poly-Bushing will reduce both..

I wouldn't try to argue the merits of a spherical bearing's ability to articulate without issue on the diff side bushing. I wouldn't have a problem running your arm that you listed either, in fact I might try it sometime. I have a habit of swapping out parts. However, if you have a spherical of some sort on the chassis side, it's articulation will not move the diff bushing as far as I can tell. What's it take to turn a spherical type joint (Roto, Steet Extreme..whatever)??? 1 lb? So you saying that "everytime, ANY movement, in ANY direction, that movement is initiating binding and deflection." is not making sense to me. I'm in "learn mode", so here is the question: What is the difference in bushing bind or deflection with a heim joint at the chassis side and poly at the diff vs poly at the chassis and heim at the diff? Disregard all NVH related possible issues. Seems hard for their to be a difference other than noise.

 

[BMR Tech]

Oh, no.

I was referring to the people who insist on running the stock stuff, due to not having faith in the aftermarket, OR them thinking a Poly UCA is hurting them, compared to the factory piece.

You are absolutely on point, about having a bearing on one side or the other. If I was going to run the Bearing on the body side, I would run a part like our Poly-Diff Bushing on the diff.

 

[BMR Tech]

What is the difference in bushing bind or deflection with a heim joint at the chassis side and poly at the diff vs poly at the chassis and heim at the diff? Disregard all NVH related possible issues. Seems hard for their to be a difference other than noise.

To touch on this subject.

The most important, is the NVH.

Secondly, the axle response (articulation) is more precise, and will react quicker when the bearing is on the axle side of both the UCA and LCA System. If you want something to articulate freely, you want to initiate that articulation as close to the part as possible. In this case, the differential bushing and the LCA mounts would be the first possible areas of articulation allowance.

 

[Sharad]

I'd rather run a spherical bearing in the diff, with the stock UCA.

Better NVH isolation, and it's always best to run the bearing on the axle side.

Secondly, the axle response (articulation) is more precise, and will react quicker when the bearing is on the axle side of both the UCA and LCA System. If you want something to articulate freely, you want to initiate that articulation as close to the part as possible. In this case, the differential bushing and the LCA mounts would be the first possible areas of articulation allowance.

How has this been tested and verified?

 

[BMR Tech]

How has this been tested and verified?

Which part?

The NVH characteristic has been verified by yours truly. I have driven, with the back seat and carpet removed, on just about every combination of parts in terms of LCA and UCA. I have noticed drastic changes in NVH when comparing the locations of the bearing/rod-end on both the UCA and LCA.

To touch on this, one of the companies that we do "work for" has tested NVH among most of the popular combinations on the market. They chose the BMR UCA with a Poly-Bushing, as it provided them with the least amount of NVH. The equipment they used to test with, was above and beyond what we use here at BMR, but they chose us, so we will take that for what it is worth. Their competition set-up utilizes a Poly-Bushing on the chassis and a Spherical-Bearing on the diff. That set-up allowed for their desired articulation properties while still meeting their NVH requirement. Not sure who they source the bearing from.

As for my articulation comment, that is the something that is hard to test, but I truly believe what I typed. If I want X to articulate, then I am going to place my point of articulation as close to X as possible.

This characteristic is used quite often in the automotive industry. Spindle mounts, tie-rods/ends, and just about every suspension piece. Most times, the articulation point is the point at which the part/piece ends, and the new part is attached.

My primary reasoning for this is to keep things consistent. In most cases, in our experience, people use the rear (axle-side) LCA Mounting point for the articulation point within the LCA System, so it only makes sense to duplicate that feature within the UCA System. Will it affect track performance by a noticeable margin, maybe, maybe not.

*Please keep in mind, we do NOT even sell or offer a spherical diff bearing. No motives here friend, but I am just giving my personal advice based on my experience while testing all the parts.

 

[Norm Peterson]

"everytime, ANY movement, in ANY direction, that movement is initiating binding and deflection."

"Bind" is what you get when you try to move a control arm link such that it must either distort a bushing or I suppose overcome friction/stiction.

When the bushing or end connection offers resistance to being moved in some direction, that resistance tends to show up as additional suspension roll stiffness. In the rear, this is a "loosening" tendency as far as the handling is concerned.

One spherical joint (of any sort) is a good solution for eliminating the bushing resistance you get when the car rolls in a turn but the axle (mostly) doesn't. After that, other details such as durability in a street environment, NVH, water intrusion, and stiction matter.

There are two other motion directions where relative movement could create "bind", but in general they seem to be less troublesome from a handling perspective.


Norm

 

[sheizasosay]

Kelly, I think a BMR poly UCA would be good on the road course with the addition of the spherical diff bushing. Without that spherical back there , there is no way I would want to run it except straight line. With that being said, I think we already covered the PITA the swapping of the diff bushing is. That is a put off for buyers like myself. That leaves a chassis side spherical for your offerings, which is noisy. I think that might be a common line of thinking on those parts (maybe I shouldn't assume).

I have an oopsie on a previous post when I said I would run your UTCA032... I have ran that part. I took it off to put the J&M Street Extreme jointed UCA in there. The reason I just swapped UCA's is because I didn't want to screw with the diff bushing. That bushing and the front LCA hydra bushings have me scared. I will not replace my front LCA bushings either. I will buy the entire OEM A-arm with the bushing already installed. Ain't nobody got time for that....ain't nobody got time for that. I'm a lazy modder....
So if I wasn't a lazy modder, putting the spherical bushing in the diff would have been the ticket for the fix.


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[BMR Tech]

^ The UTCA019 is probably the part you used. The 032 is a much different and better piece. I wish we would hurry up and release a modified mount so people could bolt the 032 into the '05-'10 cars without having to mod.

I see what you are saying, and I can fully relate.

 

[sheizasosay]

^ The UTCA019 is probably the part you used. The 032 is a much different and better piece. I wish we would hurry up and release a modified mount so people could bolt the 032 into the '05-'10 cars without having to mod.

I see what you are saying, and I can fully relate.

It is the UTCA019 that I had on there. I looked at the pic of your UTCA032 and saw poly bushing with a grease fitting and a threaded shaft for adjustability and just assumed it was the same one. Looking closer at the new one, that bushing looks a whole lot bigger.

 

[Roadracer350]

Ok well the big question I have is who sells a Spherical Bearing for the diff for 05-09?

 

[sheizasosay]

Steeda was mentioned.


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[BMR Tech]

I'd recommend the Steeda piece if you want a diff bearing.

 

[Mountain]

Multimatic is bat shit-crazy on that price. Lol...what? I can't help but laugh. Have you driven a Boss S or ridden in one? Curious if they are clunk-free cars. If that UCA in the Boss S isn't completely silent or can't grow an arm out and jerk me off, then they can keep it for that price.

What UCA did you find to your linking during your "parts adventure"?

Well, Multimatic does make the stock rear suspension components ad some other components on the S197, so I would think the fitment would be top-notch just with that in mind.

 

[Mountain]

Ok well the big question I have is who sells a Spherical Bearing for the diff for 05-09?

Are the differential bushings between the 05-09 cars not the same as the 10-14 cars?

 

[Sharad]

Which part?

...

As for my articulation comment, that is the something that is hard to test, but I truly believe what I typed.

^^THIS is what I was asking about. Opinions are fine. Just wondering how you backed up that claim.

One spherical joint (of any sort) is a good solution for eliminating the bushing resistance you get when the car rolls in a turn but the axle (mostly) doesn't. After that, other details such as durability in a street environment, NVH, water intrusion, and stiction matter.

Norm

^^that's my opinion as well.

Ok well the big question I have is who sells a Spherical Bearing for the diff for 05-09?

05-14 Spherical Bearing
http://www.uprproducts.com/mustang-8-inch-bushings-05.html

^^Made in America and carries a Lifetime Guarantee

 

[barbaro]

Would not get a new upper control arm based on the "Clunk" factor. But I did get a Cortex Torque arm and adjustable rear lower control arms with relocation brackets to go along with my Cortex Watts Link. Who needs an upper control arm? Goes on tomorrow I will let the OP know how it turns out.

 

[Ivan 5.0]

But I did get a Cortex Torque arm and adjustable rear lower control arms with relocation brackets to go along with my Cortex Watts Link.

Well look at you fancy pants, lol. Just kidding- sounds like a great setup, let us know how you like it over what you're currently running.

 

[sheizasosay]

Well, Multimatic does make the stock rear suspension components ad some other components on the S197, so I would think the fitment would be top-notch just with that in mind.

That's a big ole fat-ass glass of Kool Aid you got there. Cheers!
C'mon mountain....who you kidding? $700?? I hate saying "makes no sense" because Obama says it (and I would pour gasoline on Obama and push him into the camp fire), but.....it makes no sense.

 

[BMR Tech]

lol....

sheiza, good fitment isn't worth $700 to you? Come 'on man!