Motor is gone

[94tbird]

Ohh, I was seriously considering it Ron, but a month later I'm glad I didn't. Once you get this fixed and its running good again, you'll probably completely change your mind.

i think my will is broken matt. Im not an older guy, i dont have a house or a family or expendable cash that i can do this, break shit, and fix it all the time and move on. Ive been shadowing some of the guys on forums, and having a blast doing it. And when everything works, its great, i never really had a point where something like this happened. Then reality catches up to you because shit dont stay together forever and eventually in racing you break shit. then the ghost or shadow goes away and im left with something I cant fix.

I was happy at 10psi with a really reliable car and hell if the motor blew, theres no shortage of stock motors around for $1000. drop it in and your done. I really wish i stayed at that point at times. But when shit works and 15+psi of boost hits and the car just GOES, its awesome. Im torn right now

 

[ZmanM3]

Have you ever thought about backing off the boost for a while? With my 2.95" pulley I see 15# but for the last month of so I've just been running the 3.4" pulley. I'm sure I'm probably over the 500 mark with the 3.4" pulley but you know what, the car is still fun on the road and I'm sure will be a blast at the track. I will put the 2.95" pulley on again at some point but I find that the car is just so much more fun when there are no problems. The bottom line with racing though is that you are going to break stuff.

 

[94tbird]

ive only been at about 15psi, 16 if its really cold outside

 

[05stroker]

i think my will is broken matt. Im not an older guy, i dont have a house or a family or expendable cash that i can do this, break shit, and fix it all the time and move on. Ive been shadowing some of the guys on forums, and having a blast doing it. And when everything works, its great, i never really had a point where something like this happened. Then reality catches up to you because shit dont stay together forever and eventually in racing you break shit. then the ghost or shadow goes away and im left with something I cant fix.

I was happy at 10psi with a really reliable car and hell if the motor blew, theres no shortage of stock motors around for $1000. drop it in and your done. I really wish i stayed at that point at times. But when shit works and 15+psi of boost hits and the car just GOES, its awesome. Im torn right now

Boy do I know how that feels ! Good luch on your decision.

 

[06GT_Vert]

I was happy at 10psi with a really reliable car and hell if the motor blew, theres no shortage of stock motors around for $1000. drop it in and your done. I really wish i stayed at that point at times. But when shit works and 15+psi of boost hits and the car just GOES, its awesome. Im torn right now

Ron couldnt have said it better myself...

 

[RRRoamer]

No one has explained how higher power levels could break the oil pump. When you look at the dynamics of the engine running, all the oil pump does is deliver oil TO the journals. The journals and bearings act like a pump and force the oil between the them at MUCH higher pressures than the oil pump provides. About the only thing on our car that really uses the oil pressure provided by the pump as si would be the lash adjusters and the all important VCT system.

But there is still nothing there that will increase the load on the pump when the HP is increased. Look at the crank. The oil comes into the TOP of the journals and the pistons are trying to push the crank out the BOTTOM, so it won't make that harder just because the power is up.

RPM will have some effect on the VCT system, but folks are already running bone stock engines at 6800 rpm (or more), so I doubt just raising the rev limiter is causing these issues.

I guess this is all a long winded way of saying that your pump could just as easily broken at 10 psi as it did at 15 psi. The boost level didn't directly impact the pumps longevity. The real question is did you change parts to up the boost that would have impacted the harmonics of the engine?

 

[cekim]

No one has explained how higher power levels could break the oil pump. When you look at the dynamics of the engine running, all the oil pump does is deliver oil TO the journals.

First, you have to include higher RPMs of such setups.

Second, it is also likely a function of load which will "show" the harmonics of an engine - all the force applied to the flywheel (and ultimately the tires) is coming from force applied from gas expansion on the top of the pistons...

The more force/torque is coming out of the flywheel means that more force is being applied to the tops of the pistons - the impulses/distortions moving throughout all of this metal are going to grow in magnitude proportional to the power produced...

"Harmonics" is a way of saying that you have vibrations moving through the engine which can be constructive or destructive (that is the vibration from one source, piston, cam, etc... can either add to or subtract from the vibration from another component).

So, you have sustained higher RPM and increased amplitude of the harmonics to explain the correlation with higher power setups...

 

[94tbird]

well im pretty sure its coming from the pass side head at this point. I jsut dont know what to say any longer

 

[KIM_05_GT]

well im pretty sure its coming from the pass side head at this point. I jsut dont know what to say any longer

Is that the side that had the follower problem?

 

[94tbird]

no the side that jumped 2 teeth on the timing gear

 

[KIM_05_GT]

no the side that jumped 2 teeth on the timing gear

OH....sorry to hear that.

 

[94tbird]

i think neway im not good at diagnosing noises

 

[fin1]

Ron,
I feel your pain. Trust me, owning a house w/ kids doesn't make cash anymore expendable. In fact, it can be the opposite.

Since 99% of us on here do not have sponsors, that means we foot the bill when crap like this happens. It's hard not to reflect on the cost/benefit of continuing on in light of real-world demands on our income.

It's hard to not get caught up in the "must-go-faster" culture of this forum and others like it. There are some very fast cars on this site with a lot of money being spent to get them there. I too and guilty of sometimes getting caught up in the ET race, but I've come to the conclusion that being faster does not always equate to being happy. Don't get me wrong, I like the speed rush, but frankly I can't afford to go faster.

Find what you can emotionally and financially can live with and just race the car. Remember, this sport is supposed to be fun.

 

[US-1]

Since 99% of us on here do not have sponsors, that means we foot the bill when crap like this happens.

Trust me, Slick....the 1% of us with sponsors ARE STILL footing the bill when crap like this happens.

 

[fin1]

Trust me, Slick....the 1% of us with sponsors ARE STILL footing the bill when crap like this happens.

This I know SD. I have a good idea what sponsor contracts cover and don't cover. My point was not to debate the difference but rather show how painful breakage can be give the nature of this sport.

 

[ChevyKiller]

Boy do I know how that feels ! Good luch on your decision.

As do I for shizzle...

 

[US-1]

This I know SD. I have a good idea what sponsor contracts cover and don't cover. My point was not to debate the difference but rather show how painful breakage can be give the nature of this sport.

Yes, I know, Brad. At some point the financial aspect rears its ugly head and causes us all to step back and evaluate where we are and what we are prepared to endure. I've got one sponsor right now who is not real happy about one of the organizations they were financing me in has gone out of business and taken the advertising money with them. Let's just say those ad dollars could have easily paid for an assembled Livernois or JDM or ST Motorsports stroker shortblock with extras.

Each of us must seriously look at what we sincerely want out of these cars and engines then attempt to figure out what we are prepared to pay. This was my point in another thread but it bears repeating here. As you stated to Ron....this is supposed to be FUN. When it ceases to be fun you must then take a good long look at where you are and what your idea of "fun" really entails with these cars.

 

[Dex]

Ron, I've had 2 motors pop because of some local shitty work. I decided to take one more go at it and picked who I thought had good rep for engine building and tuning. Paid the money and couldn't be happier. Maybe one more try with ST, JDM, or Livernois?? I already came so far so I had to.

My motor is built and tuned by Adam @ ST.

 

[Steedman07]

Well said SD..having FUN is extremely important to me..Once Im not having fun anymore, then its time for Bimmer M3 or something..Again, good luck Ron, and try to stay posotive.I dont know you, but I feel horrible for you.I try to put things in perspective when times get crappy....My wife and daughter and family are very healthy..it works for me..

 

[94tbird]

its a lot of things. I hear what you are all saying. Ive learned al ot about these motors in the teardown process and couldnt have gotten as far as i did if it werent for Peter ocmnig to help and Josh and Kevin over the phone. But im feeling overwhelemed and frustrated and angry and a whole slew of other motions. I have a few paths to take here and I am unsure of what to do.

1. Stock Motor, KB @ 10psi and be done
2. Fix the built motor, remove the BBR cams and go back to stock cams to make the car more manageable and fun, but still have the worry that Larry_H built a shitty motor
3. Rebuild the entire motor from top to bottm, Send the heads at minimum, or the entire motor to livernois and jsut have the entire thing redone
4. Part out and trade in for a GT500

Option one would be the most econimical of all 4 paths. It will be the cheapest, easiest and quickest.

Option two will probably cost 1-2 thousand dollars to make it work but I still have the uncertainty of Larry_H's motor

Option 3 will cost a few thousand dollars as well with the most downtime

Option 4 will cost me a lot of time and money with a result of a slower car than I currently have

Money is a problem. I do not have a lot of money, certainly not enough for option 2 or 3 right now. Option 4 will net me some cash plus a car I can trade in toward a GT500 and I can finance the rest.

Im at a loss. I do not know what to do