Anyone Remove Their ABS?

[sqidds]

Why would you be braking hard in a turn where you're lifting a tire off the track?

Do me a favor and read the posts I am writing to you. This is the second time I have described the situation to you and you have not taken the time to understand. I am in no way describing a situation where the car is lifting a wheel because of speed/load which is commonly seen on FWD cars that lift the inside rear wheel entering corners.

I will post again what I did in post #25 with a few revisions so maybe you can picture the situation correctly:

"The situation I am referring to is when one wheel (front) encounters a “rise” or loose patch and completely looses traction for a split second and engages the ABS. There is no amount of pedal control that can compensate for one tire loosing traction after it is unloaded (not lifted off of the ground) due to encountering a rise in the surface or hitting debris".

Understood?

That's an easy way to initiate a spin because you're transferring the weight of the car (which already has a front weight bias) that lightens the rear and could kick it around leading to a spin or off track excursion. You said ABS was staying on too long causing the car to run wide in the turn..

Well said, too bad it has nothing to do with what I am talking about.

Sounds like you're coming into the turn too fast and trying to correct your line to hit the apex by applying hard braking while executing the turn, which could be bad news. Ideally, you want to complete most of your braking before you enter the turn so you can accelerate through the turn shifting the weight to the rear tires, which will lead to better lap times

Ok, maybe you have simply not been reading my posts. I don’t need a lesson in basic driving from you. I don’t need a lesson in advanced driving from you. Its probably a safe bet that I have turned more fast laps than everyone on this board combined. I have won so many races, championships and broken so many lap records I can’t keep track of them anymore. I assure you when it comes to driving technique there is NOTHING that you can tell me I don’t know.

And its odd that I should even have to say that because the topic of this thread is the removal of the ABS system, not a pole to see if people think that I should or shouldn’t.

The topic is:

“What is the process for removing ABS from a S197 and are there any computer pitfalls to watch out for”​

Nothing more, nothing less. If you don’t posses any information pertaining to the topic of this post do me a favor and go somewhere else to spread your driving wisdom so this thread can maybe be salvaged and put back on topic.

 

[DusterRT]

Does the FR500S ABS module work with the stock TCS or require any tuning to make it work properly in a GT? I'm wondering if this module would work in a daily driver that goes to a road course 10 times a year, or if its strictly for race cars only.

Well, considering the OE GT500 module doesn't work with the GT TCS, I can pretty much guarantee the FR500 piece won't either. I found the TCS horribly invasive and haven't missed it a bit since it has been disabled entirely. I'm pretty sure I'm going to try one this next year, I'll report how it goes if I do.

As far as streetability, I can't imagine running the race module would be any worse than not having ABS at all...I was mostly just tossing the idea out there, but this is beyond OP's intended scope and I don't want to shit up his thread any more than I already have with unwanted/useless information.

 

[RRRoamer]

No offense but I am the legitimate president of a fairly large corporation and well known and respected in the entertainment industry, but most guys on here still think I'm an asshole so he should just take any comments with a grain of salt and drink some nice, refreshing HATERADE

Mark,

Let's be honest: just because you are the legitimate president of a fairly large corporation and well known and respected in the entertainment industry doesn't mean that you AREN'T an asshole!!!

Shit, that's the reason I LOVE this forum: People are willing to say what they THINK (right or wrong...) without fear of the PC thought police busting down their doors.

Oh, and I have to reiterate: I want HD videos of that monster you built!

 

[Vapour Trails]

I have experienced exactly what Sqidd described many times. In my case I just live with it, because the ABS has too many benefits in day to day driving that might turn interesting very quickly.

As far as dick measuring contests, sqidd I think you've pulled out the ruler more times that anyone else in this thread.

"Ok, maybe you have simply not been reading my posts. I don’t need a lesson in basic driving from you. I don’t need a lesson in advanced driving from you. Its probably a safe bet that I have turned more fast laps than everyone on this board combined. I have won so many races, championships and broken so many lap records I can’t keep track of them anymore. I assure you when it comes to driving technique there is NOTHING that you can tell me I don’t know."

I spend between 5 and 10 thousand miles a year on the race track and get paid $1000 a day to teach. It’s fair to say I have a fairly good understanding of what is too fast and how brakes work.

I’m sorry, I didn’t realize I needed to submit a resume’ to ask a TECHNICAL question. I didn’t ask how to brake, if someone thought I was driving too fast or for a critique of my actions. And since when does the number of posts you have bear on anything? Clearly only having 11 posts doesn’t render me an inexperienced driver? And what does your 1500+ posts prove? It clearly doesn’t prove that you have anything that will enlighten me on the subject of ABS, braking or driving. It seems that the only thing your 1500 posts have qualified you to do is be annoying. It’s probably a safe bet that a majority of your posts are completely useless or unnecessarily negative like the ones you posted here. The topic of this thread is the removal of ABS, period. You have not brought one tiny bit of useful information to the thread. All you have done is attempt to change this thread into a dick measuring contest. If you don’t have anything to add to the topic move on. And once you have moved on I suggest you learn a thing or two about reading comprehension. My first post did not lack any detail in regards to the topic, ABS. And my reply to you doesn’t have anything even close to an aggressive tone or anything sounding like “panties were in a wad”. I provided you with a few simple facts that clarify that I don’t need driving lessons from you. Its more than clear that you are the only one here that does not have complete control of them self. And I am sure your response will more than prove my point.

Your ignorant question makes it clear that what I teach is something that you need to learn. Every single one of my students with your attitude ends up not learning a thing and are the slowest people on the track. Consequently the ones that are nervous about attending and are all ears end up learning the most and becoming very fast. If you spent more time with your fucking mouth shut and your eyes and ears open you may find you learn a few things……..no offence.

So far you've told us how much money you make, how many lap records you have and how there's nothing that anybody could tell you don't already know. All this in a few dozen posts, while telling other people they're doing dick measuring? Please....

I can't recall more condenscension in so few posts. Listen, your reputation doesn't proceed you here. You should have prefaced your post with some background if you didn't want people questioning your motivations. Like "I'm an experienced club racer and I'm running into this problem....."

There's multiple ways letting someone know that you're advanced, you chose the dick measuring path.

I've seen you post on other forums and I thought you were a then, and nothing has changed.

 

[ChevyKiller]

Mark,

Let's be honest: just because you are the legitimate president of a fairly large corporation and well known and respected in the entertainment industry doesn't mean that you AREN'T an asshole!!!

Shit, that's the reason I LOVE this forum: People are willing to say what they THINK (right or wrong...) without fear of the PC thought police busting down their doors.

Oh, and I have to reiterate: I want HD videos of that monster you built!

That was the point - being a respected member on another site doesn't mean you are not an asshole. BUT, just because some assholes on here think you are an asshole, it doesn't make it so either. So, I offer a nice refreshing drink of HATERADE to feel better...

 

[Ken04]

I have experienced exactly what Sqidd described many times. In my case I just live with it, because the ABS has too many benefits in day to day driving that might turn interesting very quickly.

As far as dick measuring contests, sqidd I think you've pulled out the ruler more times that anyone else in this thread.



So far you've told us how much money you make, how many lap records you have and how there's nothing that anybody could tell you don't already know. All this in a few dozen posts, while telling other people they're doing dick measuring? Please....

I can't recall more condenscension in so few posts. Listen, your reputation doesn't proceed you here. You should have prefaced your post with some background if you didn't want people questioning your motivations. Like "I'm an experienced club racer and I'm running into this problem....."

There's multiple ways letting someone know that you're advanced, you chose the dick measuring path.

I've seen you post on other forums and I thought you were a then, and nothing has changed.

haha, don't know any of the posters involved in this, but that, was funny

 

[RRRoamer]

That was the point - being a respected member on another site doesn't mean you are not an asshole. BUT, just because some assholes on here think you are an asshole, it doesn't make it so either. So, I offer a nice refreshing drink of HATERADE to feel better...

Ah, HATERADE!!!! So refreshing in the afternoon!

OP,

Question for you: Is this car a track only car, a club car, a weekend car, or a daily driver? You options are different depending on how you will use the car and what you expect to work properly (electronically) after you attack the PCM.

One reason I recommended a switch to KILL THE POWER to the ABS module (and it is a separate module from the PCM and SJB) is that you can kill it when you are on the track (and deal with the MIL light) and then turn it back on when you are on the street. The ABS is a fail safe system, so with it powered down it should have no impact to the brake system at all.

I do NOT know if/when the PCM will set a hard code (requiring clearing to make the MIL go out versus simply power cycling the car), which might mean you have to clear the MIL after each trip to the track with a programmer.

If you want the ABS to go away permanently (remove the hardware), you are going need to get the PCM reprogrammed so it doesn't expect there to be an ABS system talking to it. And I have NO idea who can do that or what type of programmer they would have to use (probably the Ford service system).

Good luck. And don't let everyone jumping on get to you. That's one of the charms of this place... Once you get used to it, that is.

 

[Cookiemonster]

Gray ghost, What he is describing is a legitimate problem with our ABS. When the ABS kicks in it affects all the wheels. Its not a smart ABS like some cars have where it would only kick in to the tire that locked up. If he were to remove it his problem would be solved. What is happening is he is trailbraking which allows him to bring the braking line farther into the corner and maximize his traction circle. however, when one wheel (im guessing the inside front wheel) either lifts or hits a bump while he is trailbraking the system thinks that wheel has locked up and proceeds to initiate the pulsating of the brakes. It pulsates to ALL wheels even though they never broke traction, causing him to understeer and go wide. A glaring problem with our ABS is it doesnt react as fast to regaining traction as it does to losing it and because of that the ABS tends to stay on toolong (only a second or so, but a second traveling at speed is quite a distance). If he were to remove ABS the wheel that lifted or hit a bump would only lock up for a split second and then regain traction (even if it does lock up it wont effect the other 3 wheels where most of his load is). Our ABS system effectivly links our tires traction circles where in reality they have there own individual traction circles.

 

[Gray Ghost GT]

Cookiemonster: Thanks! I learned something new about my Mustang GT. The ABS system is VERY different (Dumb) compared to all other ABS systems I'm familiar with - both foreign and domestic. Good information. I can now see why this would be a big problem given the scenario the OP described. I appreciate the detailed explanation.

....When the ABS kicks in it affects all the wheels. Its not a smart ABS like some cars have where it would only kick in to the tire that locked up...It pulsates to ALL wheels even though they never broke traction, causing him to understeer and go wide...Our ABS system effectivly links our tires traction circles where in reality they have there own individual traction circles....

NOTE: I deleted my previous posts now that I have a clearer understanding of the underlying issues and limitations of our ABS system and OP situation.

Now it has me thinking. If the ABS module (M-2353-A) from the FR500S racing car resolves this issue on the GT while deleting the TCS - I may go that route, but I think you need a race license to make a purchase. The Mustang FR500C “Boy Racer” appears to use the same ABS module found in the GT, and the GT500KR has a "recalibrated ABS" which I'm guessing is this same ABS module, but requires a VIN number to order. Has anyone tried this that can verify this mod?

 

[Cookiemonster]

for an everyday driver its not a bad system, but on a car with "proper" tires its flaws become more apparent. You could probably solve this problem with a better suspension. I think this is the perfect excuse to get that front SLA

 

[danbev07]

If I am reading this correctly you are saying that you have talked with “tuners” and they said swapping a V-8 harness into the V-6 Chassis with no ABS is a non issue?

Thanks

Precisely.

These "tuners" may actually know a little bit of the logistics behind doing such a thing. In fact it was Justin at VMP that I spoke to about it. His tunes are the ones the car will be utilizing upon start-up.

Hope to start back on my swap (postponed til this weekend, orginally planned for Thanksgiving weekend).

I'll let you all know if I run into any problems if/when everything's up and running.

 

[sqidds]

I have experienced exactly what Sqidd described many times. In my case I just live with it, because the ABS has too many benefits in day to day driving that might turn interesting very quickly.

As far as dick measuring contests, sqidd I think you've pulled out the ruler more times that anyone else in this thread.



So far you've told us how much money you make, how many lap records you have and how there's nothing that anybody could tell you don't already know. All this in a few dozen posts, while telling other people they're doing dick measuring? Please....

I can't recall more condenscension in so few posts. Listen, your reputation doesn't proceed you here. You should have prefaced your post with some background if you didn't want people questioning your motivations. Like "I'm an experienced club racer and I'm running into this problem....."

There's multiple ways letting someone know that you're advanced, you chose the dick measuring path.

I've seen you post on other forums and I thought you were a then, and nothing has changed.

Jealous a little?

 

[stkjock]

lets keep the personal BS out....

Sqidd you're a self proclaimed "know it all" you're a new quantity here and still unproven. keep that in mind please.

 

[don_w]

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/members/sqidd.html

He's legit & well respected over at AFM. I don't know why he came over here, but maybe because S197Forum has much better technical feedback.

Legit & well-respected? hahaha. Thats funny. When I used to frequent AFM, sqidd was a real high & mighty dickface. And it seems like he still is. Talked big but never contributed much. Just a pompous ass trying to be a bully. He would throw his little temper tantrums at me over there... but here at S197Forum it won't fly.

No offense but I am the legitimate president of a fairly large corporation and well known and respected in the entertainment industry, but most guys on here still think I'm an asshole so he should just take any comments with a grain of salt and drink some nice, refreshing HATERADE...

Unfortunately a lot of members on this board seem like the only thing they want to do is have a dick measuring contest. Its a shame.

You win... you are one of the biggest dicks I know.

lets keep the personal BS out....

Sqidd you're a self proclaimed "know it all" you're a new quantity here and still unproven. keep that in mind please.

Too late... I didn't like this guy before, and I like him even less now. He needs to crawl back to AFM and impress the kiddies over there. We don't need his BS here.

 

[hoovsgt]

I removed the ECU/HCU unit and got v6 front brake lines from the dealer.Still had to work the lines a little for my line lock but not a big deal.Down side is dash flashing check brake in red every time I start car or hit brakes..LOL..Not sure if tune can turn it off guess I should ask my tuner.

 

[Charlie Sheen]

Legit & well-respected? hahaha. Thats funny. When I used to frequent AFM, sqidd was a real high & mighty dickface. And it seems like he still is. Talked big but never contributed much. Just a pompous ass trying to be a bully. He would throw his little temper tantrums at me over there... but here at S197Forum it won't fly...

Ah hell, you beat me to it.

 

[sqidds]

Don_W

Legit & well-respected? hahaha. That’s funny. When I used to frequent AFM, sqidd was a real high & mighty dickface. And it seems like he still is. Talked big but never contributed much. Just a pompous ass trying to be a bully. He would throw his little temper tantrums at me over there... but here at S197Forum it won't fly.

You win... you are one of the biggest dicks I know.

Mister Roper

Ah hell, you beat me to it.

So far you've told us how much money you make, how many lap records you have and how there's nothing that anybody could tell you don't already know. All this in a few dozen posts, while telling other people they're doing dick measuring? Please....

Vapour Trails
I can't recall more condenscension (try spell check next time) in so few posts. Listen, your reputation doesn't proceed (and a thesaurus here) you here. You should have prefaced your post with some background if you didn't want people questioning your motivations. Like "I'm an experienced club racer and I'm running into this problem....."

There's multiple ways letting someone know that you're advanced, you chose the dick measuring path.

I've seen you post on other forums and I thought you were a then, and nothing has changed.

There are a few points you pathetic keyboard cowboys have missed. The first mistake is that there is nothing to win when posting in a forum. Only someone that was consistently picked last for kickball consider forums some sort of competition. You have been a dork your entire life and that has not changed because you have found a “game” (forums) you think you can win. The thing is there is no game and there is nothing to win. It makes sense that you would gravitate to forums because by doing so you have found a place where you can run your mouth, embellish your stories and create an identity that is not your own with zero repercussions. It’s easy to make a persona of the person you want to be from behind the safety of your keyboard. You have found your perfect environment, one where you don’t have to back up you claims or deal with the consequences of your actions. All you will ever accomplish in a forum is being “King of the Dorks”. For you I am sure that is a lofty goal. But at the end of the day you are still nobody.

The second mistake you continually make is I could care less what you call me, what you think of me, what you say about me, etc. The ability to not care (something you are not capable of doing) only comes from having the confidence you get by accomplishing things that most other people can’t. I live a life that you bottom feeders don’t even have enough imagination to dream of. There is nothing you can say to me that bothers me for even a moment. You are the flea on the Elephants back. Inconsequential and transparent. All you do is take up space. And because of your irrelevance you will never be capable of stepping outside of the box and looking at yourself for what you are. You don’t posses the tools to do anything more than exists. Don’t feel bad though, every heard pushes the dumb, lame or weak toward the edges. You will never know what happens at the center. I would like to feel sorry for you but that is impossible for me to do considering your only true value is what you could be burnt for fuel. In conclusion, I could care less about your opinion of me. You have mistaken your needs for mine. I don’t live my life chasing acceptance and to be frank I would be embarrassed if you did like me. One is defined by the people that like them as well as the people who don’t. And I am more than happy that you don’t like me.

And last, this thread is about the removal of ABS. Not if it should be removed, if someone knows how to drive and certainly not about if someone is a dick or not. Your posts have made a few things very clear. One, you can’t read, two you know absolutely nothing about ABS and third you know nothing about the removal of ABS. My point? Why are you even here? You have offered nothing even remotely relevant to the topic of the thread. If you want to act like a 7th grader during lunch period I am sure there is somewhere on this board for that type of self embarrassment. This section is the tech section, and this thread is about the technical aspects of the removal of ABS. Clearly you are in the wrong place. How bout you hit the road and go find where you belong.

I have said my piece and this is all I will ever say on the matter. I the future do not mistake me ignoring you for weakness. I simply don’t care enough to waste anymore time you parasites.

To the moderators:

Note my lack of vulgar language an infantile behavior. I don’t doubt that I will see repercussions for posting this from a moderator. This forum didn’t become the free for all because of a lack of favoritism. Just keep one thing I mind while you are formulating your punishment. From the first post in this thread I have not attacked anyone until they have gone after me. In short, self defense. I can assure you that if I was the one on the attack the mess would be far greater.

To the grownups:

For the rest of you that are trying to add to the thread I appreciate it. Maybe these bottom feeding 7th graders will clear out at some point so the topic of this thread can be discussed without interruptions from the ignorant peanut gallery.

 

[stkjock]

To the moderators:

Note my lack of vulgar language an infantile behavior. I don’t doubt that I will see repercussions for posting this from a moderator. This forum didn’t become the free for all because of a lack of favoritism. Just keep one thing I mind while you are formulating your punishment. From the first post in this thread I have not attacked anyone until they have gone after me. In short, self defense. I can assure you that if I was the one on the attack the mess would be far greater.

never heard of tuning the other cheek? while you many not have lit the fire in this thread, your responses threw fuel on it, so you are not without culpability here either.

we dont punish people for the most part, however, I'll break out my popcorn to see the responses that will come.

 

[Charlie Sheen]

blah blah blah.

Spend some of that income on an internet class and learn how to quote people correctly.

...I'll break out my popcorn to see the responses that will come.

Gimme some of that.

 

[don_w]

The second mistake you continually make is I could care less what you call me, what you think of me, what you say about me, etc.

And to think, it only took a 779-word diatribe for you to say that... brevity is not your strong suit.