Boss 5.0 Modular Block (iron)

[JPO8GT]

Dang Buzz!
I thought i was bad about breaking shit but you broke a CRANK!! i can't touch that.. I have broke every thing but a crank I'm on my third short block when i include the original stock also third set of heads 2nd trans 2nd 8.8 rebuild..

 

[Department Of Boost]

I thought and hope it was, I shipped the entire shortblock to a different well known builder for inspection. He could not determine what caused it and also could not promise I wouldnt see the same thing if I bought a motor from him. He did mention that he had seen it happen and it happens in high HP applications. The walking crank was only part of the problem, I broke the crank and my timing system had a catastrophic failure. Luckily, I was pulling the heads to send them to be ported when 1 thing led to another.

I happen to be googling and ran across the MMFF link I posted. I called JPC and spoke to Eric, he told me they had seen it before as well and this was the solution. Was it a sales pitch ? Dont know but Im not willing to take a chance and bought into the Billet main cap theory.

What do you have for a power adder? Where did the crank break? Got pics?

 

[Department Of Boost]

Can the Cammer block hold big power? It's aluminum with knock sensors but costs a bit of money.

What about the Darton sleeve conversion? Does it hold big power?

Buzz, do you have any pics of the crankwalk? I'd imagine you see it in the bearings or thrust washer but don't really know for sure, it would be good to have a mental reference.

Part Details

Hover over image to zoom
click to enlarge




5.0L ALUMINUM CYLINDER BLOCK - ROAD RACE APPLICATIONS
M-6010-T50*
Suggested Retail Price
$4,299.00

Sold in Units of:
Each (1)


tech notes

• The "Cammer" 5.0L block is the foundation of Ford Racing's road racing success. Competing in both Grand-Am's Daytona Prototype and the FIA GT class.
• Used in the FR500C Competition Mustangs
• Engineered and optimized to be the ideal road race modular block
• Race proven revised water jackets and between bore cross drilling for improved engine cooling.
• Designed for minimal weight while retaining strength and durability for naturally aspirated engine combinations
• Big bore 4.6L aluminum block with cast iron liners
• 94mm (3.70") cylinder bore size. Stock cylinder bore size 90.2mm (3.552")
• 227mm (8.9370") deck height (same as 4.6L)
• Produces 5.0L displacement when used with a 4.6L stock stroke crankshaft, stock length connecting rods and custom 94mm-diameter pistons.
• Cross bolted main bearing caps
• Requires water pump YR3Z-8501-AB/Motorcraft PW-402 long 87mm (3.425) pump or YW7Z-8501-BB/Motorcraft PW-409 short 65mm (2.559) pump.
• No provision for heater return or thermostat bypass
• Replacement sleeve M-6055-B

specs

Package Dimensions:
13 x 14.75 x 21.25

Package Weight:
97 lbs

Part Type:
Engine: Engine Blocks

Instruction Sheet:
Not Available

Warranty Availability:
Not Available

Country of Origin:
United States

UPC Code:
756122063156

These won't take big power. The block flex's all over the place. NA only.

And last time I checked a certain shop that I refuse to run anything from does the blocks for FRPP.

 

[BruceH]

At one time FRPP had Roush finish machine the boss block. That was when the deck and bore were advertised as needing finish. They may still do it but I don't think so.

What about the darton mid insert?

 

[Department Of Boost]

At one time FRPP had Roush finish machine the boss block. That was when the deck and bore were advertised as needing finish. They may still do it but I don't think so.

I don't have an issue with Roush.

What about the darton mid insert?

I'm not sure if they use Darton inserts but the Cammer and new Cobra Jet NA blocks (they have inserts too) are machined by a shop near me (Detroit).

 

[KillrStang]

I'm curious to see how this boss block thing plays out. I have the boss block in my current setup. I'm looking for 20lbs on pump and rev to at least 7k

 

[BruceH]

I just read some promo material on the darton mid sleeve setup. Good for high boost applications 25-40psi.

It's expensive though. The parts are advertised as low as $1100 to a high of $1400. The machine needs to hold a .0003" tolerance. One shop that is certified by Darton to do it are advertising at around $1700 for labor but it includes decking, final bore, and diamond hone so the block is ready to go.

Installation instructions: http://www.darton-international.com/FORD4.6_manual.pdf

This was the cheapest for parts at $1068: http://www.prostreetonline.com/x/darton-mid-sleeves.asp

The wheels are turning in MY head.

 

[crownaviation]

I just read some promo material on the darton mid sleeve setup. Good for high boost applications 25-40psi.

It's expensive though. The parts are advertised as low as $1100 to a high of $1400. The machine needs to hold a .0003" tolerance. One shop that is certified by Darton to do it are advertising at around $1700 for labor but it includes decking, final bore, and diamond hone so the block is ready to go.

Installation instructions: http://www.darton-international.com/FORD4.6_manual.pdf

This was the cheapest for parts at $1068: http://www.prostreetonline.com/x/darton-mid-sleeves.asp

The wheels are turning in MY head.

Gee thanks. You guys get me in sooo much trouble. Gonna call my machine shop tomorrow and ask a few questions about this.

As I posted, at 800RWHP there was evidence of the crank walking and main caps chattering. This was only revving to 6500ish and less than 20psi.

Please tell me that was not the new motor...

 

[jsimmonstx]

It is a lot of money to do the billet mains.

Speed costs money. How fast do you want to go?

 

[Bobby]

i know tell me about it my boss build was right at $20,000

 

[Department Of Boost]

I just read some promo material on the darton mid sleeve setup. Good for high boost applications 25-40psi.

This is all hearsay, I have no facts or specific circumstances to back this up.

I have heard more than a few times that the sleeved blocks just do not stand up to boost. They can claim they will handle 50psi and 10,000rpm, it doesn’t make it so.

The FRPP BOSS block is supposed to be the be all, end all big HP block for the 3v. And that doesn’t seem to be panning out.

I would have to see multiple success stories before I even thought about something like that. Ha! Who am I kidding, I’m trying to wrap this car up so I can start on my next project. I won’t be doing a super trick/high dollar motor build for the blue car no matter what. A BOSS block was about as “trick” as I was ever going to go.

I have a 6 sec street car to build. I need to save my pennies.

 

[8306gt]

I'm curious to see how this boss block thing plays out. I have the boss block in my current setup. I'm looking for 20lbs on pump and rev to at least 7k

I have been daily driving mine for the last 18 months with 21 psi and pump gas and regularly spin it to 7500 without issue. If or when I switch to E85 I will swap pullies and let it make as much boost as the Paxton 2200 is capable of making.

 

[Timmbo]

i know tell me about it my boss build was right at $20,000

Damn.

 

[KillrStang]

I have been daily driving mine for the last 18 months with 21 psi and pump gas and regularly spin it to 7500 without issue. If or when I switch to E85 I will swap pullies and let it make as much boost as the Paxton 2200 is capable of making.

Thanks good to hear! What are you putting down?

 

[Dillon Dollar]

Im ordering my boss block next week and using the 4 bolt design.

Eagle stroker crank an rods
Diamond piston 10-5 compression
BBR stg 2 heads an cams
E85
Paxton 2200 turned all the way up

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Department Of Boost]

I have been daily driving mine for the last 18 months with 21 psi and pump gas and regularly spin it to 7500 without issue. If or when I switch to E85 I will swap pullies and let it make as much boost as the Paxton 2200 is capable of making.

The problem is that there is no telling what is going on till it is pulled down. Or it chucks stuff out of it.

It could be as fresh as the day it was built. On the other hand it could be one trip to 7,500rpm from going pop.

I'm just not sure if I am willing to risk the unknown reliability, add the extra weight and pay the extra cost for bigger bores. This sucks, I wish there was an easy answer.

 

[JPO8GT]

The problem is that there is no telling what is going on till it is pulled down. Or it chucks stuff out of it.

It could be as fresh as the day it was built. On the other hand it could be one trip to 7,500rpm from going pop.

I'm just not sure if I am willing to risk the unknown reliability, add the extra weight and pay the extra cost for bigger bores. This sucks, I wish there was an easy
_________________________________________

Its all unknown reliability in this hobby the only thing you can do is enjoy the ride .

 

[BruceH]

This is all hearsay, I have no facts or specific circumstances to back this up.

I have heard more than a few times that the sleeved blocks just do not stand up to boost. They can claim they will handle 50psi and 10,000rpm, it doesn’t make it so.

The FRPP BOSS block is supposed to be the be all, end all big HP block for the 3v. And that doesn’t seem to be panning out.

I would have to see multiple success stories before I even thought about something like that. Ha! Who am I kidding, I’m trying to wrap this car up so I can start on my next project. I won’t be doing a super trick/high dollar motor build for the blue car no matter what. A BOSS block was about as “trick” as I was ever going to go.

I have a 6 sec street car to build. I need to save my pennies.

Not to argue but I was always under the impression that the 4.6 3v aluminum block was the strongest mod block out there. The reason for the boss block was to get away from liners that would be (and have proven to be) too thin with a 3.7 bore. Besides being lighter aluminum is also stiffer than iron and when used properly it can handle significant stresses.

The darton sleeves require milling the entire block. Not just boring the existing hole. I don't blame you about not wanting to be the guinea pig on something that expensive. Maybe crown with do it, lol.

I was really hoping to see a boss build. I've contemplated it a few times but can never bring myself to do it. It's so easy to make hp with a 4.6 that the extra cubes are mostly going to help on a na application. Boosted motors can always add more boost and I always end up boosted.

Good luck with the project.

 

[05mustang_TT_charged]

I'm waiting for turbo kit to be done and I'll find out. I plan on running 20psi street tune on 93 octane and somewhere around 28-30 psi on C-16.

If it breaks I'm building a small block push rod motor to stick in it. I have been skeptical of the boos blocks since I bought mine.

 

[Mike K]

How is your car coming? I'm with you on the pushrod motor. If I keep mine I will probably go that way also.