replacement springs

[whitmanink]

getting some comp cams stage 3 vsr xfi,,
i got the loc outs ,,, the springs are the problem,,

at lmr and AM ,, im only seeing these

Comp Cams Mustang Beehive Valve Springs; 0.550-Inch Max Lift 26113-24 (05-10 Mustang GT) - Free Shipping (americanmuscle.com)

people are saying they are just like stock,, there soft,
so which springs should i get?

also do i need the comp cams valve spring retainers to use the new springs?
this is all new to me,, thanks guys

 

[Midlife Crises]

getting some comp cams stage 3 vsr xfi

You did not mention which comp cams grind number you have selected. Can’t tell you if those are the correct springs or not. There are two sets of springs available from CC for the 3 valve. Comp lists the required springs for the cam right on their wed site. I have used both sets of springs and they are not the same as stock Ford springs. They are the same basic size with higher pressure ratings and allow more travel without coil bind. They will work with stock retainers but stock retainers may contact the valve seals. I have Comp steel retainers and they work fine with stock keepers with no worry of seal contact. Also, the 113 spring set is the lighter of the two sets.

 

[RED09GT]

If you are locked out, these are what I am using:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/tfs-15410-24
https://www.modularheadshop.com/i-2...-2-3v-valve-springs.html?ref=category:1268209

They use stock retainers and keepers. These are also known as the PAC stage 2 springs that Modular Head shop uses on all their 3V head packages. They have a bit too much rate for the stock VVT system-although with an upgraded oil pump and the improvements to the roller followers, they may work just fine.

The TFS part # used to be about $50 cheaper but I see that has changed now. Still a better deal than the comp springs and having to buy their retainers.

 

[whitmanink]

COMP Cams 127600 Mustang Camshaft Set XFI SPR Stage 3 For 2005-2010 Naturally Aspirated Engines 4.6L 3V GT (cjponyparts.com)

 

[RED09GT]

With those cams, the PAC stage 2's are a good fit. The 26113 comps would be marginal at best.

 

[Badd GT]

COMP Cams 127600 Mustang Camshaft Set XFI SPR Stage 3 For 2005-2010 Naturally Aspirated Engines 4.6L 3V GT (cjponyparts.com)

That’s a lot of cam for a street car, I’ve run the 500’s and 400’s, sold the 500’s and kept the 400’s. Better street manners and make just as much power

 

[Midlife Crises]

That cam calls for Comp Cams 26125-24 springs. Also note; the stock retainers will work with either spring set. It is the lift of the cam you should be concerned with. That is what can drive the retainer into the valve seal. Nothing to do with the spring. Performance retainers can be shorter, thinner, smaller, lighter and made from stronger material than stock retainers. Your choice.
Looking at the PAC spring specs they are for up to .550 lift. The cam you selected has .560 lift on the exhaust. That is a lot of cam. Do you plan to run over 7,000 rpm?

 

[RED09GT]

Yeah, the 26125 does give a bit more headroom. 0.060" from coil bind is the standard on conventional springs, beehive springs can get quite a bit closer in theory but not worth it, especially for the RPM's these cams will need.

I just checked with a used up set of 26113's and the stock retainer will work. the ID of the comp spring is bigger than stock so the stock retainer fits, it just doesn't fill the ID-no big deal. The comp retainer won't fit on a stock spring.

I bought those 26113's with supposedly 20,000 miles on them (they were a throw-in with a bunch of other parts so not a huge loss that they are junk). On the valve spring tester, they were close to stock (Somewhere around 80 lbs) at the install height for my heads and were only showing around 170 lbs at .550" lift. My stock 30K mile springs had similar seat pressure but were on the verge of coil bind at .550" so the numbers were skewed as most of the spring was solid.

@whitmanink what is the rest of your combo? I wouldn't touch those cams on anything short of a big bore stroker or a 5.4/5.8 based motor. Even with a big bore 5.3, you'll still probably need to go well over 7,000 to see them shine.

 

[whitmanink]

i plan on running to 7300 rpm when racing,,,, maybe stage 2 cams than due to too much lift?

COMP Cams 127500 Mustang Camshaft Set XFI SPR Stage 2 2005-2010 For Naturally Aspirated Engines 4.6L 3V GT (cjponyparts.com)

 

[whitmanink]

what is the rest of your combo? I wouldn't touch those cams on anything short of a big bore stroker or a 5.4/5.8 based motor. Even with a big bore 5.3, you'll still probably need to go well over 7,000 to see them shine.

im putting in 3.73 gears, jlt cai , stright piped the whole way,,,,UD pulley, and than cams with a lito tune,, (should see at least 360rwhp with this combo)

also,, the cams say good up til 7500 rpm i think, so im not sure how you get id have to go well over 7000rpm to see them shine?

 

[Badd GT]

im putting in 3.73 gears, jlt cai , stright piped the whole way,,,,UD pulley, and than cams with a lito tune,, (should see at least 360rwhp with this combo)

also,, the cams say good up til 7500 rpm i think, so im not sure how you get id have to go well over 7000rpm to see them shine?

comp cams recommends minimum 3.90 gears for 127500…. Might as well go 4.10, if your going to run the 600’s might want to go more than 4.10

 

[RED09GT]

You are going to run out of intake maifold flow as well.
3.73's are not going to cut it with those gears either.
Those cams are a really big mis-match for your combo.

 

[Midlife Crises]

7,300 rpm, Good to 7,500 rpm. No mention of reinforced bottom end. Sounds like an Improvised Explosive Device to me. Run away, run away.

 

[whitmanink]

ok guys, so what cam will work best that gives the most hp for youre buck>? no hot rod cams or any of that junk, i want real gains , so springs required and phaser loc out,,,... im going turbo in about a yr as well so no more than 3.73 gears

 

[Badd GT]

Livernois Motorsport makes a turbo cam that is a 127400 w/ 114 LSA. That cam works with factory gears or whatever gears you want. I’ve been running that cam w/TVS supercharger 3.73 gears w/ 6 speed gt500 trans. Works great
I ran the same cam NA and made 380 rwhp! Btw I have a JLT III cai I’d sell you if you want.
I’ve got a set of 127350 cams with 1 hour run time if your interested. You can look up the specs, they only need springs, no limiters

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

i plan on running to 7300 rpm when racing,,,, maybe stage 2 cams than due to too much lift?

COMP Cams 127500 Mustang Camshaft Set XFI SPR Stage 2 2005-2010 For Naturally Aspirated Engines 4.6L 3V GT (cjponyparts.com)

If you're planning to run the engine that high, you'll definitely need an aftermarket intake manifold e.g. Ford Performance, Holley Sniper. Even with a CMCV delete, the stock intake manifold's performance tails off at about 6300rpm and is effectively spent by 6800.

7,300 rpm, Good to 7,500 rpm. No mention of reinforced bottom end. Sounds like an Improvised Explosive Device to me. Run away, run away.

The stock connecting rods aren't really a problem up to 7500rpm if the engine remains NA. However the OP stated that he wants to add a turbo later on so he'd definitely need forged rods/pistons before then.
For a 7000+rpm application I'd certainly recommend a HV oil pump with billet gears plus a higher capacity oil pan. This is required to provide additional cooling and to prevent potential oil starvation at high lateral g loads.

Livernois Motorsport makes a turbo cam that is a 127400 w/ 114 LSA.

A great choice on an engine that isn't intended to rev past 6700rpm in conjunction with a CMCV delete stock intake manifold.
That said, the SPR cams really work best with ported heads as the higher valve lift enables greater cylinder filling. Of course you already know that from your previous 384/359 NA combination.

 

[whitmanink]

DINO ,, i was wondering if you were gonna chime in , because i value your input,,

a guy "foureyes" on youtube had the cams i want to put in,, he had stock manifold , ported heads (but lowerd the compression ratio), long tube headers , upgraded springs,, he had the cams in and he was putting down like 385 rwhp The results of installing the most aggressive cams on my Mustang - YouTube

 

[whitmanink]

link ... The results of installing the most aggressive cams on my Mustang - YouTube

 

[whitmanink]

the four eyes guy has alot of good info,, like why the charge motion control plates should stay on unless you are boosted,, ect ect,,, and alot of his info he got , dont really match up with what some are saying on here,, so if you could please shed light on whats the best route to go for max hp on the stock block..

 

[Dino Dino Bambino]

the four eyes guy has alot of good info,, like why the charge motion control plates should stay on unless you are boosted,, ect ect,,, and alot of his info he got , dont really match up with what some are saying on here,, so if you could please shed light on whats the best route to go for max hp on the stock block..

I've seen all if Four Eyes videos and indeed he does have some good info. As far as the CMCVs go, I recommend you do yourself a huge favour and delete them if you're planning to add a turbo or a centrifugal supercharger. I deleted mine a long time ago with good results and my engine remains N/A.

https://www.angelfire.com/my/fan/Mustang2006GT/CMDP.html

Apart from potential problems with them sticking since they quickly get covered in crusty oil deposits, the butterflies have been known to break off the shaft in the aforementioned boosted applications and cause catastrophic engine damage.
Four Eyes has a Livernois built 298ci stroker and since he's also planning to add forced induction, he kept the compression ratio in the mid 9s rather than the ~11:1 compression that would have been the norm for a NA stroker. Hence his engine "only" made 387rwhp despite having full bolt ons plus Livernois CNC heads, 127600 cams, and the Ford Performance intake manifold. Otherwise he could have been at ~410rwhp.