Alignment Shop Woes

[TylerM]

Took my car down to an alignment shop in Sharonville, Ohio. Received a call today saying that my car was ready to be picked up but there were "complications." Apparently they could not get camber into spec using the MM Camber plates that I installed, so they went ahead and ground out my driver side strut to get it aligned. I was also informed that my "right steering arm is bent." I asked them to elaborate because I was just under the car over the weekend and everything looked normal. Got off the phone with the mechanic. Received a call back. This time when I asked him to elaborate specifically what was bent ie, tie rod, control arm. They dodged the question and then told me it was "twisted" and that I would have to "replace the spindle." I just replaced almost the entire suspension front to back.
Ford K Springs
Koni Str.t shocks and struts
GT500 front lowers
Maximum Motorsports Camber plates
Steeds bumpsteer kit.

They informed me that they set everything as best they could but that I would turn fine one direction and understeer turning the other direction. Needless to say I am fairly furious. Any input or advice?

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[RED09GT]

Find a new shop?
I'd double check to make sure that everything is installed properly and bever go near that shop again.

 

[01yellerCobra]

Look for a shop that handles aftermarket stuff. I took my car to a chain place because it was the only one open on a Sunday. Apparently the Maximum Motorsport caster/camber plates were too confusing and needing to remove the rear tires to loosen and tighten the heavy duty toe links confused the shop monkeys.

 

[thump_rrr]

Always bring it to someone you trust.
If you can’t bring it to someone you trust then you stay with the car the whole time.
Bring safety shoes/boots and safety glasses with you.
If they tell you that you can’t be in the shop for insurance purposes you walk, bringing your car with you.
Their opening up the hole in your strut is unacceptable considering you have camber plates on the car.
Once again they should be able to show you what’s twisted.

I even bring my own 22-23mm combination wrenches with me to adjust the bumpsteer kit.

 

[TylerM]

I do not trust any of the shops around here. This particular one deals a lot in euros and exotics. Even had an E-Type in their shop. I asked them specifically if they knew how to adjust the camber plates.

They did not once call me, and their mechanic was trying to tell me that it was per the manufacturer reference to grind out the strut and he did not call me because he "does it all the time."

As of now they are not getting paid. I already gave their "mechanic" and desk guy an earful over the phone twice.

I guess what I am getting at is how do I best approach the situation? Because I do not want to give them a cent and I want a new strut.

Also, I am checking the camber plates when I get there to see if they even adjusted them that way.

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[86GT351]

I do not trust any of the shops around here. This particular one deals a lot in euros and exotics. Even had an E-Type in their shop. I asked them specifically if they knew how to adjust the camber plates.

They did not once call me, and their mechanic was trying to tell me that it was per the manufacturer reference to grind out the strut and he did not call me because he "does it all the time."

As of now they are not getting paid. I already gave their "mechanic" and desk guy an earful over the phone twice.

I guess what I am getting at is how do I best approach the situation? Because I do not want to give them a cent and I want a new strut.

Also, I am checking the camber plates when I get there to see if they even adjusted them that way.

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That is a tough one. Depends on the local laws. Do you have a signed repair order? What is on the repair order for the customers request?

 

[TylerM]

No repair orders or anything. I asked for an alignment and dropped the keys.

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[86GT351]

That might benefit you depending on where you live. What year car are we talking about?

 

[86GT351]

Where the issue is, the Ford Workshop manual states to enlarge the strut to knuckle holes to adjust camber as needed. This should not be needed if the tech paid attention to you telling them about the CC plates.

The other thing is ALWAYS ask for a copy of a repair order when the vehicle is dropped off.

 

[TylerM]

2005. And I understand if I was using Ford shocks. They are not Ford shocks and the camber plates were installed for the purpose of adjusting the camber without grinding the strut. Otherwise I would have just kept the GT500 mounts in.

I DID NOT want them to grind the struts. Period.

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The struts were centered in the shock tower prior to alignment, per Maximum Motorsports. They have not moved then there will definitely be issues.

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[travelers]

I took mine to a shop that the owner road races. So it was setup really well and he was knowledgeable with cc plates. I'm the second owner of the car '11 GT and it had 7200 miles on it. To get everything in align front and back we actually had to tweaked the K member. It feels great now.

 

[TylerM]

Shop owner just tried to tell me that he helped invent camber plates and that my car was probably wrecked.

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[TylerM]

Small update. So after the shop owner tried to tell me he helped invent camber plates and whatnot. I finally got paperwork which had a disclaimer in there about my rights. I did not sign it. I wrote at the bottom that I never waived my rights and that I did not give explicit consent to modify any components on my car. Paid the $200 and left even though I never signed the waiver and statement saying they could place a lien on my car. I read all the applicable laws before going in and read their sheet. They were in violation of their paperwork and local laws.

I talked to a Ford Performance advisor before going in. I got his opinion which was against grinding out the aftermarket parts despite what the reference says. The owners of the shop tried telling me that my car was probably wrecked and not reported, so it was not in the carfax. Their explanation for not getting the camber in with the plates. I looked at the plates. The passenger side is sitting dead center where MM instructions tell you to set it at install. The driver side (side that strut was grinded on) was set all the way in toward the engine bay.

Replacing the strut and taking it to the Ford Performance shop near me. If they can get the camber set without grinding, I am going after the shop I originally took it to.

As far as bent/twisted components. The steering knuckle is twisted slightly where the tie rod end bolts into it. What he referred to as the steering arm.

Placed the order for the new knuckles, the strut, and all new hardware.

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One more note. I had the car aligned before the cc plates and bumpsteer kit. I was at -2.5 camber without the plates. Same suspension.

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[86GT351]

Small update. So after the shop owner tried to tell me he helped invent camber plates and whatnot. I finally got paperwork which had a disclaimer in there about my rights. I did not sign it. I wrote at the bottom that I never waived my rights and that I did not give explicit consent to modify any components on my car. Paid the $200 and left even though I never signed the waiver and statement saying they could place a lien on my car. I read all the applicable laws before going in and read their sheet. They were in violation of their paperwork and local laws.

I talked to a Ford Performance advisor before going in. I got his opinion which was against grinding out the aftermarket parts despite what the reference says. The owners of the shop tried telling me that my car was probably wrecked and not reported, so it was not in the carfax. Their explanation for not getting the camber in with the plates. I looked at the plates. The passenger side is sitting dead center where MM instructions tell you to set it at install. The driver side (side that strut was grinded on) was set all the way in toward the engine bay.

Replacing the strut and taking it to the Ford Performance shop near me. If they can get the camber set without grinding, I am going after the shop I originally took it to.

As far as bent/twisted components. The steering knuckle is twisted slightly where the tie rod end bolts into it. What he referred to as the steering arm.

Placed the order for the new knuckles, the strut, and all new hardware.

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Make sure you take pictures to protect your self before the new shop touches the vehicle.

 

[07 Boss]

When I ran camber plates on my struts I took a dremel to the bolt hole. Not sure what is so weird about it.

 

[TylerM]

I bought the camber plates because I did not want my struts modified. Otherwise I would have stuck with the GT500 strut mounts and saved money.

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[msvela448]

A twisted steering knuckle?!... Seems like it hit something. That's definitely not "wear and tear". I can understand why they are telling you the car may have been in a wreck. Bent steering components often mean the car slid into a curb, or hit a curb / hole / dip / etc.. pretty hard.

Grinding the strut tower opening used to be the norm for fox body cars... That shop probably did lots and lots of them... Might be where the owner is getting his info from. Plus... If I'm reading the other posts right... There is a Ford shop manual saying grinding the strut tower bolt holes is an acceptable method for making small camber adjustments? (which seems logical for stock CC plates.

But there is no way they should be doing that in an S197 with CC plates. Did you provide the instructions for the CC plates as well? If it comes down to legal action a lot can be based on what the shop "knew or should have known". If they deviated from instructions the aftermarket parts company provided then they are in liability territory. But if no instructions were provided and they followed a Ford approved procedure I think you'll be hard pressed to win that fight. As others have stated... A written "work order" detailing the work to be performed would have been nice.

You mentioned one strut is leaning all the way in, and the other is in the middle of the tower opening... Do your struts have an elongated hole in the top of the upper bolt hole where they attach to the spindle? (one time use bolts BTW) Some aftermarket struts have an elongated top hole to allow for even more camber than a CC plate will allow for... Or to allow for camber adjustments with stock CC plates. If your struts have the top mounting bolt hole elongated then one might be adjusted all the way "out" and the other is all the way "in"... This will definitely cause the top of the struts to look uneven in the holes in the engine compartment.

Lastly... I agree that any shop worth its salt should have no issue with you watching or coming in the alignment bay to see how everything is being done.

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[86GT351]

A twisted steering knuckle?!... Seems like it hit something. That's definitely not "wear and tear". I can understand why they are telling you the car may have been in a wreck. Bent steering components often mean the car slid into a curb, or hit a curb / hole / dip / etc.. pretty hard.

Grinding the strut tower opening used to be the norm for fox body cars... That shop probably did lots and lots of them... Might be where the owner is getting his info from. Plus... If I'm reading the other posts right... There is a Ford shop manual saying grinding the strut tower bolt holes is an acceptable method for making small camber adjustments? (which seems logical for stock CC plates.

But there is no way they should be doing that in an S197 with CC plates. Did you provide the instructions for the CC plates as well? If it comes down to legal action a lot can be based on what the shop "knew or should have known". If they deviated from instructions the aftermarket parts company provided then they are in liability territory. But if no instructions were provided and they followed a Ford approved procedure I think you'll be hard pressed to win that fight. As others have stated... A written "work order" detailing the work to be performed would have been nice.

You mentioned one strut is leaning all the way in, and the other is in the middle of the tower opening... Do your struts have an elongated hole in the top of the upper bolt hole where they attach to the spindle? (one time use bolts BTW) Some aftermarket struts have an elongated top hole to allow for even more camber than a CC plate will allow for... Or to allow for camber adjustments with stock CC plates. If your struts have the top mounting bolt hole elongated then one might be adjusted all the way "out" and the other is all the way "in"... This will definitely cause the top of the struts to look uneven in the holes in the engine compartment.

Lastly... I agree that any shop worth its salt should have no issue with you watching or coming in the alignment bay to see how everything is being done.

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[86GT351]

Its funny that you say this. Transparence of a shop is so important these days. I can't allow customers on the shop floor while the vehicle is being worked on, but I ca allow to be in the shop to watch if requested.

 

[TylerM]

I have a copy of the pages from the manual they used plus the work order that I was supposed to get before anything was performed. I signed the bottom saying I had not waived any of my rights nor did I give explicit consent to modify any component on my car.

The modifications to the strut were performed according the Ford Manual. Except that the parts being modified are Koni.

As far as the steering knuckle. The arm that the tie rod attaches to is ever so slightly, to the point that I did not see it looking right at it but enough to throw the vehicle off a few degrees. Roads around here are crap so I am guessing pothole. Not mad at them over that.

The driver side was slotted but also has the strut post sitting all the way in toward the engine bay at the top of the shock tower. The passenger side is shifted ever so slightly to the outboard.

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