BBR Testing with Ford Racing Intake Manifold

[Dillon Dollar]

any updates?

yeah but its not so good something is wrong with the car chris thinks its the diablosport software so he is going to try and tune the car with a SCT, but from my understanding it could be next week before i know my numbers...just another bump in the road for me ..

 

[rojizostang]

this doesn't sound good...numbers not near what was expected?

 

[TheSlow1]

well like i said I will be doing a same day back to back comparison on my mildly modded stang on the 18th so keep an eye out for that. I'm not to concerned if it doesn't produce gobs of power on NA, i just know I want something that will flow a bit better for when I have forced induction.

 

[rojizostang]

i'm still interested in this, and if it works out well....

 

[06GTMustang89]

just ordered my manifold and bbr is sending me my re tune by tomorrow...pretty excited about it!

 

[BlueByYou]

I would like to see the numbers with the FRPP Intake, "hotrods", and stock heads and tb? Trying to figure out if this would be a worth while investment...

Also would like to see measurements of the intake compared to stock in respect to height of the intake, curious if I can "make" the shaker fit the new intake if I cut it down...

Just received my Sept.MM/FF magazine. Livernois Motorsports just dynoed that combo you just mentioned with the only other mod was the FRPP throttle body.It made 400.3HP and 360.4TQ at the flywheel. After that they added FRPP stage 3 CNC 3v heads with the Hotrod cams and made 431.6HP and 365.3TQ at the flywheel. And that was with a FRPP CAI. Now just think what would happen if you were to add one of those JDM 302 shortblocks with some custom grind cams and 11.5.1 compression to take advandage of all that airflow. Mmmm.....475-500HP 3v???? I think there's gonna be a "3v VS 5.0" all motor shootout shortly.

 

[Dreadknought]

Yes but those numbers were grossly bloated because of how it was set up for the engine dyno. In street trip it would have made alot less.

 

[TheSlow1]

Isn't normal drive-train loss around 15% through a manual. that would put those numbers in the 340whp range without the heads and 360whp with heads. That is hardly worthy of a shootout against a 5.0 considering all they have to do is throw on a set of headers, intake and re-tune and they are hitting the 400whp mark. I'm honestly kinda surprised at those numbers thou. I would have thought the stage three heads and cams would have made a bit more power then that.

 

[SirKnightTG]

After that they added FRPP stage 3 CNC 3v heads with the Hotrod cams and made 431.6HP and 365.3TQ at the flywheel.

That's at least 20hp too low.

 

[KungFuHamster]

Just received my Sept.MM/FF magazine. Livernois Motorsports just dynoed that combo you just mentioned with the only other mod was the FRPP throttle body.It made 400.3HP and 360.4TQ at the flywheel. After that they added FRPP stage 3 CNC 3v heads with the Hotrod cams and made 431.6HP and 365.3TQ at the flywheel. And that was with a FRPP CAI. Now just think what would happen if you were to add one of those JDM 302 shortblocks with some custom grind cams and 11.5.1 compression to take advandage of all that airflow. Mmmm.....475-500HP 3v???? I think there's gonna be a "3v VS 5.0" all motor shootout shortly.

yeah but they had to twist the snot out of that motor to get every last drop of power out of it...and i dont think an extra thousand rpm is worth 4-5 hp.

 

[eng943]

Yes but those numbers were grossly bloated because of how it was set up for the engine dyno. In street trip it would have made alot less.

Hmm. The way I read it they did not fudge A/F or timing between dyno pulls, which if true would indicate it's a fairly respectable comparison.

 

[eng943]

yeah but they had to twist the snot out of that motor to get every last drop of power out of it...and i dont think an extra thousand rpm is worth 4-5 hp.

Not so in the cases where cams and heads were added. Just to clarify.

It's been proven independantly here, and backed up by the less convincing magazine tests that once cams/heads, or F/I are added this intake is a good modification. Especially given the price.

 

[Dillon Dollar]

Think we found the problem with my car, ill post a answer by this afternoon and maybe ill have my numbers sooner than expected

 

[TheSlow1]

Hmm. The way I read it they did not fudge A/F or timing between dyno pulls, which if true would indicate it's a fairly respectable comparison.

If they didn't mess with any timing or A/F adjustments then there would probably be some good gains once fully adjusted but I guess we won't know till someone actually does it. The thing is this is usually not the case when doing comparisons back to back like this. Why would you leave timing and A/F alone when you can tune it in properly and see the true gains from the parts.

 

[KungFuHamster]

Not so in the cases where cams and heads were added. Just to clarify.

It's been proven independantly here, and backed up by the less convincing magazine tests that once cams/heads, or F/I are added this intake is a good modification. Especially given the price.

im not saying the intakes not a good modification, im just saying that according to that particular test, to get the absolute maximum out of the combo they had to rev it to 7200 before the power peaked at 431. this was test "8" where they had everything on the motor to make max power (for that combination).

i dont intend on shifting my car any higher than 6500 so those are the numbers i looked at. and if you look at how low on power combo 8 was in the mid range vs combo 7, then 5 peak hp (assuming a 6500 rpm shift point) isnt worth it to me. but then again, i have no intention of wringing out every ounce of NA power either.

 

[eng943]

If they didn't mess with any timing or A/F adjustments then there would probably be some good gains once fully adjusted but I guess we won't know till someone actually does it. The thing is this is usually not the case when doing comparisons back to back like this. Why would you leave timing and A/F alone when you can tune it in properly and see the true gains from the parts.

The answer is because running the same amount of timing and same A/F ratio tells you more about what the modification did. Moreover, we do "know", because forum members have done this with the FRPP manifold.

That's exactly the way we tested my Power Pipe and the way any dyno test of a product should be done. The less you muddy the water with changes in ambient temps, fuel ratio and timing, the better when it comes to judging the effectivemness of a mod.

 

[TheSlow1]

I understand the need and want to see equal comparisons but when your already dealing with a modified tune you can end up working in a negative fashion by not making the adjustments for the new hardware. What works well for one part might not work at all for the other. When your dealing with airflow coming in and out of a combustion chamber things start to get a little tricky. I've made adjustments on cars and seen numbers plummet and rise from simply changing the location or depth of a MAF sensor. But then making the adjustment in the tune can turn things the complete opposite way. Think of it this way, you build a bottom end with forged intervals that has 8.5:1 CR because your going to turbo the car. You don't make any other adjustments to the engine aside from this and you throw it on the dyno pre turbo to see what it makes. Without any adjustments your gonna make less power even thou you have better parts in the car.

All I'm saying is if the tune has already been tampered with then it should be adjusted again to show the actual potential of the product, but it should be adjusted by the same tuner to the same degree so as to not show favoritism. Additionally things like IAT, coolant temps and AFR should be matched.

 

[Dillon Dollar]

Im surprised this thread is still kicking, lol once again ill keep ya'll up to date as to when i get my numbers

 

[rojizostang]

Im surprised this thread is still kicking, lol once again ill keep ya'll up to date as to when i get my numbers

don't know why you would be surprised...everyone wants to know if this mod is going to be worthwhile or a waste of time...

 

[Greg Hazlett]

Esp at $500-550!