Blackfire Wet Diamond Sealant A+++

[Seer]

I've said it many times over, 95% of a car's appearance is in it's prep work. If both cars are prepped equally and one has a $5 can of turtle wax and the other a concours style wax... there will be a notable difference.

As far as digital synapse's test. It's impossible to tell from pictures as none of them capture a car's actual appearance that can be seen in person.

As far as the test above, I can only see a difference between sheeting and beading. Sealants typical bead, waxes sheet. But again, it depends on the makeup of the compound used. Not a good "pepsi challenge" IMO.

Now if you stated which two products are on the hood, that might make this more interesting for those who have used said products before.

I did something similar on autopia, proving that you cannot tell the difference in LSP's based upon a picture, and said I did different sections of my hood with different products, can you tell which one is the most expensive product and even told them which section was which, at the end of the test I revealed to everyone the car did not have a LSP on it, just good polishing work.

Proved my point, and your local Detailer joe, who does the $100 wash/wax/polish job won't be able to tell the difference either,as all theyre good at is instilling holograms and buffer trails in paint.

I do have to disagree with you though, if you cannot tell the difference between a synthetic sealant and a good carnauba, you may need to leave the detailing to the detailer and just enjoy driving your car. Kind've reminds me when some people see a blue sports car and only say "wow look at that blue sports car" and have no idea what they're looking at LOL.

 

[DKS]

I think BFWD looks the most like a wax of any sealant out there. But, a good wax for sure looks different than the best sealant, IMO. There is no way to tell the difference by a picture, but in person I'm 100% sure I can tell the difference if I've seen the car before the application of either. Hell, I could tell the difference between BFWD and Natty's Blue Paste on my car and Natty's isn't even a top line wax by any means.

 

[NastyStang113]

I'll agree with that to some degree. It's definitely got less of that saran wrap type of look that Meguiars NXT and #21 are notorious for.

 

[DKS]

I'll agree with that to some degree. It's definitely got less of that saran wrap type of look that Meguiars NXT and #21 are notorious for.

Which part do you not agree with?

 

[NastyStang113]

I don't disagree with anything. I'm just saying that I agree with it to some degree that BFWD is the best looking sealant compared to a quality carnuba.

 

[DKS]

I don't disagree with anything. I'm just saying that I agree with it to some degree that BFWD is the best looking sealant compared to a quality carnuba.

Oh, got ya.

 

[Seer]

BFWD certainly does a good job resembling the wet look, thats part in the silicones that make apart the compound. One thing a sealant cannot do, is replicate the depth and jetting of a carnuba.

This is where the older organic compounds will always have an advantage. Now the nano coatings are coming pretty damn close as they have optical clarity thats on par with some concours waxes. Thats to be expected when "glass" is your primary component lol.

 

[DKS]

BFWD certainly does a good job resembling the wet look, thats part in the silicones that make apart the compound. One thing a sealant cannot do, is replicate the depth and jetting of a carnuba.

This is where the older organic compounds will always have an advantage. Now the nano coatings are coming pretty damn close as they have optical clarity thats on par with some concours waxes. Thats to be expected when "glass" is your primary component lol.

That's how I can tell the difference, especially on a black car.

 

[Digital_Synapse]

As far as the test above, I can only see a difference between sheeting and beading. Sealants typical bead, waxes sheet... Not a good "pepsi challenge" IMO.


I do have to disagree with you though, if you cannot tell the difference between a synthetic sealant and a good carnauba, you may need to leave the detailing to the detailer and just enjoy driving your car. Kind've reminds me when some people see a blue sports car and only say "wow look at that blue sports car" and have no idea what they're looking at LOL.

Winner. That is the point, there is no visual difference except for the way they handle water. The difference is neglible on a street car. A SEMA show car is a different, or a national car show winning car, agreed...but not many of us drive those, so neglible difference it is.

I don't let anyone mess with my car, I wash/detail it. I use Optimum Car Wax which is a spray carnuba wax and synthetic sealant blend. Love it.

 

[NastyStang113]

There is a visual difference though. Just not in photography as lighting has the most effect. Are you saying there isn't a difference?

 

[Seer]

There is a major difference synapase. You just don't know how to tell it.

 

[fdjizm]

If most people walking around don't know hwo to tell the difference or can't even physically see the difference and the car looks show quality to the general public, is there really a difference? or is it just a placebo effect?

I have a great example btw, at a car show there were like 12 guys gathered around a black z06, very nice looking and I think it was an 05 or something.
I was one of the guys checking out the car, everyone is complementing how shiny and clean it is how nice the black looks I mean the paint was great.
One guy, just one guy.. said, yea but it doesn't look "deep" and everyone looked at him like are we looking at the same car here that looks amazing.
The guy just said it's probably cheap stuff he's using to wax it bla bla bla all this correction/sealeant jargon, meanwhile everyone is wondering what the hell this guy is looking at that is wrong with this paint.
He was the only one talking about something nobody could see, so was there really something wrong?

 

[Seer]

If most people walking around don't know hwo to tell the difference or can't even physically see the difference and the car looks show quality to the general public, is there really a difference? or is it just a placebo effect?

I have a great example btw, at a car show there were like 12 guys gathered around a black z06, very nice looking and I think it was an 05 or something.
I was one of the guys checking out the car, everyone is complementing how shiny and clean it is how nice the black looks I mean the paint was great.
One guy, just one guy.. said, yea but it doesn't look "deep" and everyone looked at him like are we looking at the same car here that looks amazing.
The guy just said it's probably cheap stuff he's using to wax it bla bla bla all this correction/sealeant jargon, meanwhile everyone is wondering what the hell this guy is looking at that is wrong with this paint.
He was the only one talking about something nobody could see, so was there really something wrong?

Because people only associate "shiney" with a good looking car.

Also theres no such thing as a 05 Z06 . It's not a placebo effect, herein lies the real problem.

Most people who frequent car shows all use similar products that can be found off the shelf, sold at trade shows or bought online for a reasonable value. A lot of those products use similar components to make them up with slight tweaks here and there. I feel it is hard even for the utmost experts to tell the difference between say a $30 wax and a $60 wax. As well as a $10 bottle of sealant or a $70 bottle of sealant.

I will say this, that most experts, hobbyists etc can in fact tell a difference if the car has been waxed or sealed.

Now there are expections, there are products like BFWD that gives off a wet look, due to it uses different silicones then most of the other sealants in its range. I would say though if you compared it to similar products like Wolfgang Sealant 3.0 (which uses the same "wet" silicone) or Chemical Guys Jetseal, you would most likely have a hard time telling which is which, since those all seem to use the same similar components.

Another good example would be say P21S and the standard Dodo Juice lineup, both use similar carnauba %'s (for protection) and use similar oils (for looks). If you're educated enough in the hobby one can easily discern a difference between a Zymol Concours and a P21S though, simply due to Zymol uses varying oils which create a "glow" affect, as well as their sheeting factors if you pour water on them, it's almost not possible to keep a Zymol'd car wet for to long with running water.

The last issue now comes with Nano coatings. They give off the shimmer of a sealant, yet are replicating depth of Carnaubas, due to part in fact their main component is a glass resin.

Now the main question is, what does deep mean when it comes to reflections. Very similar to when you look at a lake or a body of water that is so crystal clear it throws the reflection back at you. A Carnauba will throw back this reflection so deep, that the reflection it throws back at you can project an image that could be hundreds to thousands of feet away from the actual vehicle itself. Sealants on the other hand do not do this well, they project the image, but it is a sheer reflection of what is directly facing it. Nor do sealants look like the car's paint is oozing wet.

I don't want to hijack this thread but these are just some of the ways to tell the difference between good products and bad products, waxes and sealants. I wouldn't say you need a trained eye for it, or its a placebo affect, I would say you just need to know what you are looking at.

Sounds like you're someone when looking at a forest, you see the tree's and not the forest itself.

 

[UltraKla$$ic]

No way trying to argue with anybody but here is the reflection off my car with Zaino

That is the neighbor ACROSS THE STREET, easily over 700ft away, outside water faucet you see in the reflection.

I would still like to get a professional detailing from one of you guys though if you lived closer.

 

[fdjizm]

If most people walking around don't know hwo to tell the difference or can't even physically see the difference and the car looks show quality to the general public, is there really a difference? or is it just a placebo effect?

I have a great example btw, at a car show there were like 12 guys gathered around a black z06, very nice looking and I think it was an 05 or something.
I was one of the guys checking out the car, everyone is complementing how shiny and clean it is how nice the black looks I mean the paint was great.
One guy, just one guy.. said, yea but it doesn't look "deep" and everyone looked at him like are we looking at the same car here that looks amazing.
The guy just said it's probably cheap stuff he's using to wax it bla bla bla all this correction/sealeant jargon, meanwhile everyone is wondering what the hell this guy is looking at that is wrong with this paint.
He was the only one talking about something nobody could see, so was there really something wrong?

I understand where you are coming from, but I'm wondering at what point does it matter if most people can't tell unless they are hardcore detailers/hobbyist etc...? if you did all this and all that, and only YOU can tell when does it become redundant?

That looks amazing to me up there what classic posted, so does it matter what he used be it hand sanitizer or wax it looks nice as hell.

 

[Grabber]

IMHO, It does not take high end products to get a nice shine.

I've always been able to get the most out of Store bought products.

UltraKla$$ic is a good example of that. That is nice shine and a lot of depth with a store bought $15-$20 wax.

Granted, I've moved away from using anything really store bought now, that doesn't mean there are not good products available for the average person.

I still wish I had the ability to look at someones paint and immediately determine the temperatue it was applied in, store location, approximate number of coats applied, what hand motion used, what type of applicator was used and how much said wax or sealant costs.

 

[Seer]

No way trying to argue with anybody but here is the reflection off my car with Zaino

That is the neighbor ACROSS THE STREET, easily over 700ft away, outside water faucet you see in the reflection.

I would still like to get a professional detailing from one of you guys though if you lived closer.

And Zaino has been known to be quite reflective. But its not known to be wet, or warm. Some people like this look, others hate it. The fact is you are showing me a picture, and many people say you cannot see a car's true appearance in a picture. To be honest your car looks like nothing special in that picture, I guarantee I can post a picture of bare clear coat and it would look rather similar, minus some of the reflections.

I bet in person your car looks nice to you though in person and I am sure most others as well. (I am not saying your car looks bad, what I am saying is... pictures prove nothing when it comes to detailed appearances unless you're doing something really extreme like wet sanding prep).

It still gives off a sterile/sealant look.

You cannot just say a product is a sealant so it does X,Y,Z. But it is safe to say all sealants give off a "plastic" look, but some have different properties than others. It cannot be refuted as that is how its chemical composition is.

All carnauba waxes are also not made equally. Some repel water better than others, some attract dust more than others. Some look wet, some glow. Some do all of the above.

IMHO, It does not take high end products to get a nice shine.

I've always been able to get the most out of Store bought products.

UltraKla$$ic is a good example of that. That is nice shine and a lot of depth with a store bought $15-$20 wax.

Granted, I've moved away from using anything really store bought now, that doesn't mean there are not good products available for the average person.

I still wish I had the ability to look at someones paint and immediately determine the temperatue it was applied in, store location, approximate number of coats applied, what hand motion used, what type of applicator was used and how much said wax or sealant costs.

Prep work is the majority of all appearances. What type of product you use determines who it will end up looking in the end.

I personally do not care what you guys use on your cars, as I don't get a kick back from anyone. I will tell you this though, if you enter your car in any real serious competition, using something bought from a store or zaino for that matter, you won't win any best appearance trophies. Those judges don't like the sterile sealant look no matter how reflective it is. If all you care about is a decent shine and good protection then who cares what you buy as long as you like it.

But to say its placebo or there is no difference is 100% untrue.

 

[fdjizm]

See this "sterile sealant" look.
I don't think anyone knows what you're talking about when you say that.
That's my whole point, if it looks good it looks good, I don't know what sterile paint looks like and I doubt a handfull of people at a car show would even say something like that. I'm saying if only you can see something that nobody else can, does it really matter? o.0

 

[UltraKla$$ic]

And Zaino has been known to be quite reflective. But its not known to be wet, or warm. Some people like this look, others hate it. The fact is you are showing me a picture, and many people say you cannot see a car's true appearance in a picture. To be honest your car looks like nothing special in that picture, I guarantee I can post a picture of bare clear coat and it would look rather similar, minus some of the reflections.

I bet in person your car looks nice to you though in person and I am sure most others as well. (I am not saying your car looks bad, what I am saying is... pictures prove nothing when it comes to detailed appearances unless you're doing something really extreme like wet sanding prep).

It still gives off a sterile/sealant look.

You cannot just say a product is a sealant so it does X,Y,Z. But it is safe to say all sealants give off a "plastic" look, but some have different properties than others. It cannot be refuted as that is how its chemical composition is.

All carnauba waxes are also not made equally. Some repel water better than others, some attract dust more than others. Some look wet, some glow. Some do all of the above.

Mmmmmkay.................

We're all noobs and you rule. One thing pics don't do is lie. You'd argue with a rock when it comes to justifying spending $bazillions$ on "Concour" waxes. Whatever.

I can GUARANTEE if you put your car next to mine, NOBODY would be able to tell you've spent a Catrillion hours and dollars on yours over mine.

One more thing, think of the degradation of the pics I posted after copying them in JPEG and editing them in MS Paint THEN uploading them to Photobucket............................You're right, it's only an AVERAGE shine in real life. LOLOL!!!!

You may be a good detailer and be able to talk the talk but you ain't fooling me.

 

[Seer]

Mmmmmkay.................

We're all noobs and you rule. One thing pics don't do is lie. You'd argue with a rock when it comes to justifying spending $bazillions$ on "Concour" waxes. Whatever.

I can GUARANTEE if you put your car next to mine, NOBODY would be able to tell you've spent a Catrillion hours and dollars on yours over mine.

One more thing, think of the degradation of the pics I posted after copying them in JPEG and editing them in MS Paint THEN uploading them to Photobucket............................You're right, it's only an AVERAGE shine in real life. LOLOL!!!!

You may fool some of the people some of the time but you ain't fooling me.

Thats the thing, pictures do lie when it comes to detailing appearances. Your finish probably looks better in person than it does in your picture.

You misconstrewed my post. If youre happy using Zaino, more power to you. But for you to say that zaino or sealants like it resemble a carnauba wax, people would look at you as if you had a second head or a third arm.

I'd bet good money if I put two cars in front of you, both prepped the exact same way, one that was done with a sealant, another done with a concours wax, you would be able to tell the difference easily. Now which one is more attractive to the eye is up to you.

You asked how can one tell the difference, I told you. You posted a picture after countless people who do know a few things about this hobby all concurred no one can see the appearance in a picture. You even said yourself the picture is degraded, so why should I do back flips over it? A zaino'd car doesn't impress me, but thats my opinion. I don't know, call me conceited but I see if someone spends 10+ hours on surface prep (and if you didnt spend at time polishing, compounding and finishing then this is a moot point) and slaps zaino or something else that doesnt really show it off to the best of your hard work... I don't know, is like putting ketchup on a filet mignon. Thats my long way to say, long hard work, deserves a good reward at the end.