FRPP intake manifold...is this normal?

[Royski]

So are we waiting on anything else from ford or is it basically a "lets wait until blown motors start coming in until we look further into it" situation?

 

[dalemllns]

So are we waiting on anything else from ford or is it basically a "lets wait until blown motors start coming in until we look further into it" situation?

Pretty much it my man.....

 

[lostsoul]

I dont get it.. with close of a year of testing.. no one knows about it? It sounds like many peoples are flexing more then 1mm. I''m stuck.. my tuner wont be around here for a month. It would be a waste to pop it on there without having him there to tune.. yet how much time do we have to return these things?

why are none of the vendors or shops popping in?

This might be nothing to worry about, but there is only one person backing this up(pretty good though)... well unless I hear someone blwoig up ill just have to wait that month and do it. F it.. I feel like building another engine anyways.. I cant have my thread die. Now my son and enjoy the adventures on the ranch.. haha

 

[06GTMustang89]

So are we waiting on anything else from ford or is it basically a "lets wait until blown motors start coming in until we look further into it" situation?

its the wait till a motor blows up and we get sued because we told everybody the movement was safe...thats when they will revise the design

 

[19COBRA93]

negative, it collapses in when under throttle and then returns to normal after it returns to vaccum...movement occurs on mine when I hit the throttle and then goes away when I release it.....

LOL, you don't even know what your own manifold is doing...Why don't you go back and watch your own video again...

Under vacuum (idle/cruise) it's being pulled in (actually it's being pushed in by the atmospheric pressure from the outside because of the negative pressure [vacuum] on the inside), the moment you blip the throttle it expands back to it's natural shape for a moment because of the lack of vacuum on the inside. Then when you close the throttle it gets "pulled" back in.

 

[19COBRA93]

It sounds like many peoples are flexing more then 1mm.

The 1mm was at the injector boss which is the base of the injector. The base of the injector is technically the "pivot" point. There will be more than 1mm of movement at the fuel rail because that's where the movement is the greatest because the most movement comes from the side of the manifold where the fuel rail attaches.

And once again, I want to emphasize to everyone... Not a single failure or problem has come from all this.

 

[lostsoul]

The 1mm was at the injector boss which is the base of the injector. The base of the injector is technically the "pivot" point. There will be more than 1mm of movement at the fuel rail because that's where the movement is the greatest because the most movement comes from the side of the manifold where the fuel rail attaches.

And once again, I want to emphasize to everyone... Not a single failure or problem has come from all this.

so your saying even that amount on that video is ok? I need something to base off of when I get mine installed.. I will be cramming 15lbs in it..

 

[06silverbullet]

why are you guys seriously calling each other out about what causes the intake too deform. can't we all just agree that either frpp f'ed up on a few or f'ed up on the overall design of the manifold.

 

[Alter Ego Trip]

And once again, I want to emphasize to everyone... Not a single failure or problem has come from all this.

Yet.

I like throwing rocks at the hornets nest across the street. I haven't been stung yet so it must be safe.

 

[19COBRA93]

so your saying even that amount on that video is ok? I need something to base off of when I get mine installed.. I will be cramming 15lbs in it..

I too will be cramming about 14lbs in it as well, and I'm not a bit worried about it. It'll be going on my brand new 302 stroker, so if there was a true concern, I wouldn't risk it.

I really don't think these things are going to fail, or create any problems of any kind. These have been heavily tested, and tested to nearly 30lbs of boost without a single failure.

If there is a failure on one, I'll bet FRPP would ask for it back so they can examine it. Hopefully no one is stupid enough to "make" one fail just to prove their point.

 

[19COBRA93]

can't we all just agree that either frpp f'ed up on a few or f'ed up on the overall design of the manifold.

No one F'd up. It's been said numerous times that the movement is "normal".

Yet.

I like throwing rocks at the hornets nest across the street. I haven't been stung yet so it must be safe.

Not the same, but nice try. Your little comparo may work if no one had ever been stung by hornets while throwing rocks at their nest. The fact is, you throw rocks at a Hornets nest, you're very likely to get stung because history shows it's happened before.

It's more like saying... "You better not pet that kitten, it has sharp teeth and will bite your finger off!" When in fact, just because a kitten may show aggression and does have sharp teeth, it isn't going to bite your finger off. You just need to look past the aggression and sharp teeth and realize that it's just a kitten.

 

[Rasmus]

I wonder how this will do with nitrous. How would it handle a nitrous backfire compared to a stock intake when it flexes this much compared to the stocker? I manhandled one down at the shop the other day, and it looked like the flow would be anything but even with the first port right there front and center.

I too will be cramming about 14lbs in it as well, and I'm not a bit worried about it. It'll be going on my brand new 302 stroker, so if there was a true concern, I wouldn't risk it.

14lbs with a Rotrex?

 

[06silverbullet]

No one F'd up. It's been said numerous times that the movement is "normal".

as far as i or i think most people here there shouldn't be any movement there's no reason to have the movement if they properly designed it and didn't get cheap with it. obviously they can make a halfway decent manifold the stock ones aren't bad by any means nor do they move like these aftermarket.

 

[Alter Ego Trip]

But we're not comparing an intake manifold that's been in consumer hands for an extended period of time.

So you don't think someone learned their lesson the first time they threw rocks at a hornets nest? Obviously, not everyone who has done it knew the consequence. Just as now, we don't know if failures will result from the constant flexing of the intake.

Here's an excerpt from the current MM&FF issue titled Hustle and Flow.
"A common misconception with composite intakes is the ability to stand up to boost. According to Kershaw, Ford Racing tested theThree-Valve intake to 2.5 bar pressure or roughly 35psi, and after some ballooning in the early development phases, the intake manifold has specific reinforced areas, which allow for extremely high boost levels."

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't feel comfortable cramming 35psi in that thing seeing what I've seen so far.

And I have no idea where you were going with your kitten analogy.

No one F'd up. It's been said numerous times that the movement is "normal".

Not the same, but nice try. Your little comparo may work if no one had ever been stung by hornets while throwing rocks at their nest. The fact is, you throw rocks at a Hornets nest, you're very likely to get stung because history shows it's happened before.

It's more like saying... "You better not pet that kitten, it has sharp teeth and will bite your finger off!" When in fact, just because a kitten may show aggression and does have sharp teeth, it isn't going to bite your finger off. You just need to look past the aggression and sharp teeth and realize that it's just a kitten.

 

[06silverbullet]

But we're not comparing an intake manifold that's been in consumer hands for an extended period of time.

So you don't think someone learned their lesson the first time they threw rocks at a hornets nest? Obviously, not everyone who has done it knew the consequence. Just as now, we don't know if failures will result from the constant flexing of the intake.

Here's an excerpt from the current MM&FF issue titled Hustle and Flow.
"A common misconception with composite intakes is the ability to stand up to boost. According to Kershaw, Ford Racing tested theThree-Valve intake to 2.5 bar pressure or roughly 35psi, and after some ballooning in the early development phases, the intake manifold has specific reinforced areas, which allow for extremely high boost levels."

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't feel comfortable cramming 35psi in that thing seeing what I've seen so far.

And I have no idea where you were going with your kitten analogy.

yeah i can't see something handling boost very well if it moves with some n/a vaccum.

 

[felixbed]

Not for nothing but has anyone done the same revving on a stock intake to see if there was any movement. I have had my car for four years now and never once stood outside revving the engine to see if anything moved. If it wasn't for the video I probably wouldn't have done it now. From what I am understanding from the frpp write up I think this movement works as a safety mechanism, kind of like the pop off valve on a pressure cooker. The lid will deform under cooking pressure but the valve blows off if pressures get too high so the pot doesn't explode. Seems the deformation is to let an overpressured intake to release at the gasket like the pop off valve instead of blowing up.

 

[iwaxmyjimmy]

I agree that this intake has had alot of testing done via Ford engineers, and will probably be safe. But, I don't like seeing it move under a load, and Ford has engineered some really crappy stuff. It quite fun stumping them on the tech hot-line. And as far as the guy who thinks hes to good for making a mistake of possibly messing up hes own fuel line. Practice some humility, and assume its your fault until you can prove other wise, and I'm not saying you did mess it up. But, we are all human and we all make mistakes.

 

[TonyN]

Not for nothing but has anyone done the same revving on a stock intake to see if there was any movement. I have had my car for four years now and never once stood outside revving the engine to see if anything moved. If it wasn't for the video I probably wouldn't have done it now. From what I am understanding from the frpp write up I think this movement works as a safety mechanism, kind of like the pop off valve on a pressure cooker. The lid will deform under cooking pressure but the valve blows off if pressures get too high so the pot doesn't explode. Seems the deformation is to let an overpressured intake to release at the gasket like the pop off valve instead of blowing up.

Mine does NOT move at all with my current setup and the stock intake.

 

[19COBRA93]

I don't know about you, but I wouldn't feel comfortable cramming 35psi in that thing seeing what I've seen so far.

And I have no idea where you were going with your kitten analogy.

To be honest, I don't think I'd be comfortable either with 30-35 psi, but under 20, yes.

As for the kitten... Just because it has sharp teeth doesn't mean it's going to bite your finger off. Just as, just because the manifold flexes doesn't mean it's going to fail.

 

[Blue Meanie]

Well, I did some quick eyeball testing of the bosses and the injector bases and they flex nowhere near what the plenum and rails do. The bosses appear to move very little if at all, but the injector base does torque slightly in the boss. I took another video. Let me know if anyone is able to post it for me.

I'll be running the intake n/a for the time being. Procharger install is on hold. I'm planning on having it dynoed today,if possible, and will post the results in Steve Poe's thread.