S197 Mustang in SCCA Solo: STX vs STU vs ESP?

[03machme]

Correct, SM or CP because of the LCA's and relocation brackets. If you didn't have those, ESP or STU (next year).

<----Adam on dfw50s.

Yep. Scca rules are maddening. Just run cp or sm and compare to stu.

Awesome thanks guys

Sent from my SGH-T999 using Tapatalk 4

 

[Whiskey11]

Just read over on another forum that the BoD just rubber stamped everything in the October FasTrack which included the Cars to STU moves and the Live Axle Diff covers.

If you have a diff mounted watts link, you can come play in STU/ESP now.

 

[lost won]

isn't SCCA wonderful?

Yeah, and six months from now straight axles are going to be obsolete.

I'm going to play one more year in F Stock-R, because it's what I do, but beyond that, it's all a big question mark....

Had a good event here in Sandy Eggo recently, Paxed ninth overall with my F Stock Pony. http://www.sdr-scca.com/solo2/results/2013/event10_tart/tart-10_pax-web.htm

Half of the people ahead of me were 2013 Nationals champs. 2012 Mustang GT and Hoosiers still working well. Practice, practice, practice. Oh, and don't let anyone tell you "Sport Mode" doesn't work for autocross.

 

[Whiskey11]

Yeah, and six months from now straight axles are going to be obsolete.

I'm going to play one more year in F Stock-R, because it's what I do, but beyond that, it's all a big question mark....

Had a good event here in Sandy Eggo recently, Paxed ninth overall with my F Stock Pony. http://www.sdr-scca.com/solo2/results/2013/event10_tart/tart-10_pax-web.htm

Half of the people ahead of me were 2013 Nationals champs. 2012 Mustang GT and Hoosiers still working well. Practice, practice, practice. Oh, and don't let anyone tell you "Sport Mode" doesn't work for autocross.

How do you figure straight axles are going to suddenly be obsolete now and not about 40 years ago when they actually became obsolete? You still have ESP which the new Mustangs wont be in and you still have CP, and if J-Rho gets his way, ST-Pony could have a delicate balancing act between IRS and Live axle cars to add in the Euro/Asian "Ponies" (looking at the later M3's and Nissan Z cars, maybe).

Sure in F-Street they might be, either by virtue of the E46 M3, E90/E92 M3 or the new Mustang/Camaro but we wont know that for sure until it happens.

 

[dontlifttoshift]

Straight axles are obsolete? You mean like pushrod V8s are obsolete?

So thinking out loud here,

STU allows 285mm tires and ESP is unlimited....

STU is full of AWD dorks and ESP is where my buddies are...birds of a feather....

STU is .846 and ESP .849 (right now)....

STU is 140 TW and ESP is DOT approved......

I will not run R comps, but why not take my 315mm street tires and run in ESP? Or to put it another way, is anyone going to be paying attention to what happens to these cars in STU?

All I know for sure is that I am putting 11" wheels on the car, tire size is TBD at this point.

Oh, something I learned this weekend, Lance Keely is stupid fast. I covered Chicago's STX field and still finished almost 3 seconds back.

 

[csamsh]

I will not run R comps, but why not take my 315mm street tires and run in ESP?

Yeah I've thought that running with the 315 Rivals in a street-tire pax'ed ESP would be fun. Also possibly of interest there would be comparing those times with good STU times, possibly in support of bigger tires.

 

[modernbeat]

The very first thing in this months SCCA Fastrack is a proposal to move the boost buggies OUT of ESP.

Delete the following lines in ESP:
Eagle - Talon Turbo (all) (1989-99)
Mitsubishi - Eclipse Turbo (1989-99)
Subaru - Impreza WRX (non-STI) (2002-07)

Add the following listing in ASP:
Eagle and Mitubishi - Eclipse Turbo and Talon Turbo (1989-99)

And change the following line in ASP:
Subaru - Impreza WRX STI (2004-07)

to

Subaru - Impreza WRX all incl. STI (2004-07)

Comment: The SPAC feels that these AWD turbo cars in ESP are not a good fit. ESP has shown strong growth, nearly all of which has been fueled by ponycars. Also, the STIs in ASP may be a more attractive option with the additional UD/BD.

Bolding is mine. Thanks for supporting the class! Write those letters in support if you want to see the AWD turbo cars moved out of ESP.

 

[Vorshlag-Fair]

Captain Obvious called.... finally!

Just wrote my letter to support "Moving The Boost Buggies Out Of ESP"

 

[dontlifttoshift]

I see they proposed the combining of STC and STS, possibly making way for STP.

 

[csamsh]

Captain Obvious called.... finally!

Just wrote my letter to support "Moving The Boost Buggies Out Of ESP"

ha me too

 

[Sky Render]

Bumping this to the top.

The CAM class doesn't exist in many regions and is a pretty stupid place for S197s (and SN95s and Fox Bodies and even disgusting Camaros).

So should we start a letter campaign? You know, like "Dear SCCA, I'd love to autocross with you, but your rules make it so my car cannot be competitive unless I drop tens of thousands of dollars to turn it into a purpose-built prepared car."

 

[jmauld]

What's wrong with CAM for the majority of mustang owners? It's basically an unlimited playing field, where you can mod the car as you want, and drive the hell out of it? True the class will eventually get owned by some dork who builds a car specifically to take advantage of the open rule set, but for most people who just want to have fun, it's a perfect playing field.

 

[csamsh]

What's wrong with CAM for the majority of mustang owners? It's basically an unlimited playing field, where you can mod the car as you want, and drive the hell out of it? True the class will eventually get owned by some dork who builds a car specifically to take advantage of the open rule set, but for most people who just want to have fun, it's a perfect playing field.

That's all true...but it provides a "dumping ground" for all of us pony car people. Instead of the SCCA actually addressing the problems with classing the pony cars, they'll say "just run CAM" an not ever make it better for those of us who may want to not just have fun.

 

[Boaisy]

What's wrong with CAM for the majority of mustang owners? It's basically an unlimited playing field, where you can mod the car as you want, and drive the hell out of it? True the class will eventually get owned by some dork who builds a car specifically to take advantage of the open rule set, but for most people who just want to have fun, it's a perfect playing field.

It isn't eligible for nationals (at least for this year) for those who want to compete in that aspect.

 

[jmauld]

All they really have to do is turn ESP back into a pony car class. I'll stick to my believe that the Mustang (S197 at least) is never going to be fast at an autocross with street tires on it so there's no reason in trying to make it competitive in the street tire classes.

 

[Sky Render]

What's wrong with CAM for the majority of mustang owners? It's basically an unlimited playing field, where you can mod the car as you want, and drive the hell out of it? True the class will eventually get owned by some dork who builds a car specifically to take advantage of the open rule set, but for most people who just want to have fun, it's a perfect playing field.

...And you don't see the problem there with someone who doesn't have an unlimited budget yet wants to be competitive?

All they really have to do is turn ESP back into a pony car class. I'll stick to my believe that the Mustang (S197 at least) is never going to be fast at an autocross with street tires on it so there's no reason in trying to make it competitive in the street tire classes.

I'm starting to think you have no idea what you're talking about. Go peruse a few pages of Terry's build thread and then come back and tell me that Mustangs can't be competitive on street tires.

 

[jmauld]

...And you don't see the problem there with someone who doesn't have an unlimited budget yet wants to be competitive?

The fact is, you aren't very likely to run into Mr. Unlimited Budget at your local autocross. And if you want to be competitive, there are classes where the Mustang is rather competitive at the moment. F-Stock is one of those. Yes, I understand F-Stock doesn't allow YOU to modify the car the way that YOU want to modify it, but it doesn't change the fact that there is a playing field for the Mustang to be competitive in. CAM is a great class for local guys to come and play at an autocross and compare themselves to other similar cars. At least for now, until it becomes a national level class and someone builds a car for it.

I'm starting to think you have no idea what you're talking about. Go peruse a few pages of Terry's build thread and then come back and tell me that Mustangs can't be competitive on street tires.

I've read Terry's build thread, and I'm quite envious of the work and effort that he has put into his car. Which is A LOT by the way.

Ultimately, we're talking about two different things here. You're talking about a world where you can create a class that would allow the mustang to be competitive on street tires.

I'm talking about reality where you can bitch and moan all that you want, and you're not going to get the SCCA to create another mustang class. With the current ruleset, the mustang will not be competitive on street tires. Not without a lot of money and effort to get there.

If you want to be fast and competitive with the mustang without dumping tons of money into mods, buy a set of r-comps and run in F-Stock.

 

[Sky Render]

Wow, what a nihilistic viewpoint.

 

[jmauld]

Wow, what a nihilistic viewpoint.

Again, you're throwing out a post to attack my character? You can do better than that.

 

[Conekiller]

I liked running the mustang in STX. Sure its just an also ran in that class and very challenging to drive "quick" on 265s but I still found it very fun. Some 285s on 10" wide wheels would absolutely help make the car more competitive in that class on a national level. I don't know if that would make the car more fun to drive though.