Spindle/hub and rotor clearance.

[Laga]

Does anybody know if different spindles were used on early S197’s? I was installing Wilwood big brake kit on my 05 GT and this happened.

That is not a stock tie rod end, but the rotor is a hair under a 1/4” away from body of spindle. This is what stock looks like.
Wilwood C/S is working on a solution, but as I was doing some research, I found this on the AM site in the customer reviews.
All other reviews say the fitment was good. Wilwood says they are not aware of any problems and no special mention of fitment problems other than clearances with calipers. We have confirmed all the correct parts we’re shipped.

 

[Laga]

Update, literally 5 minutes after posting the above thread, I received this email from Wilwood.

 

[Juice]

Do the Wilwood hubs and rotors come assembled?

 

[Laga]

No, you have to bolt together and use safety wire.

 

[Juice]

Is it possible the rotor is reversed and needs to be flipped?
As it is now, (touching the tie rod), will the caliper fit?
Thats all I can think of. No hands on experience w/Wilwood brakes yet.

 

[AndrewNagle]

Installed BMR a arms and had some issues with my wilwoods lol

Father In law helped fix it

 

[Laga]

Rotor and hat are assembled correctly. As usual with my life, if there is a 1/1,000,000 chance of things going wrong with a project, it will happen to me. This is about the 5th or 6th problem I’ve had that was no fault of my own. I checked with three different vendors to make sure I ordered correct Wilwood kit before buying. Last month I ordered a new set of rear bumpstops. The company only sent one even though they are sold as a set. Before that, I bought a new alternator that was bad out of the box. I’ve had the wrong serpentine belt delivered. Shit like that happens to me all the time. It all gets straightened out in the end but it’s a pain in the ass.

That BMR arm is much thicker than stock.
Even with the replacement parts coming, I think I may have to replace the Moog tie rods ends. Once filled with grease, they expand more than others without grease fittings. I know where this is headed.

 

[AndrewNagle]

Rotor and hat are assembled correctly. As usual with my life, if there is a 1/1,000,000 chance of things going wrong with a project, it will happen to me. This is about the 5th or 6th problem I’ve had that was no fault of my own. I checked with three different vendors to make sure I ordered correct Wilwood kit before buying. Last month I ordered a new set of rear bumpstops. The company only sent one even though they are sold as a set. Before that, I bought a new alternator that was bad out of the box. I’ve had the wrong serpentine belt delivered. Shit like that happens to me all the time. It all gets straightened out in the end but it’s a pain in the ass.

That BMR arm is much thicker than stock.
Even with the replacement parts coming, I think I may have to replace the Moog tie rods ends. Once filled with grease, they expand more than others without grease fittings. I know where this is headed.

yes indeed, we called BMR and they said we were good to grind

Sorry for your troubles

 

[Laga]

I just received another email saying the replacement parts are being shipped tomorrow. New hats, brackets, and bolts. Wilwood has really been great taking care of this problem.

 

[AndrewNagle]

I just received another email saying the replacement parts are being shipped tomorrow. New hats, brackets, and bolts. Wilwood has really been great taking care of this problem.

So now you have to do the safety wire dance again

 

[Laga]

So now you have to do the safety wire dance again

Yeah, first thing that crossed my mind. The only positive is that by the time I got to the 11th out of 12 sets the first time, I had figured out how to do it easier. Should only take 2 hours this time. Maybe a high quality safety wire pliers would make it easier, but the one I got off of Amazon was a piece of shit and was more trouble than it was worth. As a retired concrete guy, I’ve spent a lot of time tying rebar with tie wire. Not much difference.
Another PITA is going to be getting the existing bolts out. They were installed with a very liberal amount of Loctite red. Yes, I know a torch is necessary. The red stuff doesn’t soften up until 550°F.

 

[MrBhp]

I had the same thing happen with my Wilwood install on my 2007 Shelby GT. But mine wasn't as bad as yours. You would think wilwood would put a caution in the instructions about the potential problem. They told me to grind the flashing off the tie rod ends. Turned out it was not the flashing at all. It was just the rubber on the tie rod ends hitting the rotor. But it was enough to cut a groove in the rotor. Odd thing is that everything spun freely when first installed. It wasn't till a week later on a planned trip across the country that it started. Maybe the car being very heavily loaded changed the geometry enough to cause it. Idk. Looks like they are taking care of you. I was a bit pissed that I dropped a substantial amount of money on a poorly thought out system. And had to pay a transport for the car. And rent a car to finish the trip.

 

[Juice]

The only thing that kept me from ordering Wilwood brakes is that they use their own flex lines. Cannot use stock. And I jave upgraded my flex lines with braided. Not taking them off.
After hearing these stories, Im kinda glad.

 

[LarryJM]

Maybe your related to the Murphys of Murphy's Law. Doing things 3 or 4 times on a modification is normal. Then it time to go on TV to show how EZ it really is.

 

[Pentalab]

Maybe your related to the Murphys of Murphy's Law. Doing things 3 or 4 times on a modification is normal. Then it time to go on TV to show how EZ it really is.

Yeah, like...'2 guy garage'..where they..'slap on a whipple' done in less than 1 hr, including commercials.

 

[Laga]

I had the same thing happen with my Wilwood install on my 2007 Shelby GT. But mine wasn't as bad as yours. You would think wilwood would put a caution in the instructions about the potential problem. They told me to grind the flashing off the tie rod ends. Turned out it was not the flashing at all. It was just the rubber on the tie rod ends hitting the rotor. But it was enough to cut a groove in the rotor. Odd thing is that everything spun freely when first installed. It wasn't till a week later on a planned trip across the country that it started. Maybe the car being very heavily loaded changed the geometry enough to cause it. Idk. Looks like they are taking care of you. I was a bit pissed that I dropped a substantial amount of money on a poorly thought out system. And had to pay a transport for the car. And rent a car to finish the trip.

That sucks.
It’s hard to tell if it’s a Ford problem or Wilwood. There are many happy customers with no fitment problems, then there’s you and me. If there are few problems, companies are not going to go through the trouble to address them. They will just eat the cost of replacement parts. Of course, it’s a bitch for guys like us. Luckily, mine is not a DD so it can sit. I still may have to find smaller tie rods ends, or go to a bump steer setup for clearance. Won’t know till Monday when new parts arrive.

Maybe your related to the Murphys of Murphy's Law. Doing things 3 or 4 times on a modification is normal. Then it time to go on TV to show how EZ it really is.

That could be. My wife and I made a list of all the shit that happened that was no fault of ours. Now, I can’t find it.

 

[MrBhp]

That sucks.
It’s hard to tell if it’s a Ford problem or Wilwood. There are many happy customers with no fitment problems, then there’s you and me. If there are few problems, companies are not going to go through the trouble to address them. They will just eat the cost of replacement parts. Of course, it’s a bitch for guys like us. Luckily, mine is not a DD so it can sit. I still may have to find smaller tie rods ends, or go to a bump steer setup for clearance. Won’t know till Monday when new parts arrive.


That could be. My wife and I made a list of all the shit that happened that was no fault of ours. Now, I can’t find it.

Yeah I totally agree. After all the shit, (I had issues with the rear brakes also) I love the brakes. The car stops, quickly and repeatedly. I think if I had replaced the tie rod ends with fomoco I may not have had a problem with the front. I used the moog "problem solver" or something like that. They were slighter larger than the originals. I was going to install the bump steer kit, but the rubber boot is now ate away just enough to not rub.

 

[07 Boss]

Wilwood is a great company. You have to understand that many of their brake systems are modular and even though this gives them great versatility, they can't be made to fit every car without some kind of modification. Though a different car, I had to cut and grind massive chunks of my spindle and even drill and tap new holes for the caliper mounting bracket. Just part of building cars. You can see here some of the machining done to get my Wilwoods to fit.








I can't wait to get the rear end and suspension together. I have the Wilwoods with the electronic parking brake.

 

[AndrewNagle]

Wilwood is a great company. You have to understand that many of their brake systems are modular and even though this gives them great versatility, they can't be made to fit every car without some kind of modification. Though a different car, I had to cut and grind massive chunks of my spindle and even drill and tap new holes for the caliper mounting bracket. Just part of building cars. You can see here some of the machining done to get my Wilwoods to fit.








I can't wait to get the rear end and suspension together. I have the Wilwoods with the electronic parking brake.

great photos and nice to share

 

[MrBhp]

Wilwood is a great company. You have to understand that many of their brake systems are modular and even though this gives them great versatility, they can't be made to fit every car without some kind of modification. Though a different car, I had to cut and grind massive chunks of my spindle and even drill and tap new holes for the caliper mounting bracket. Just part of building cars. You can see here some of the machining done to get my Wilwoods to fit.

Agreed. Once I started communicating with the right person at Wilwood, it was all cleared up. I didn't mind the modifications I had to make. It just left me in a spot, after hours, while renting a lift, not knowing if I had the correct parts, or should I just "beat to fit, paint to match". No regrets. I love the brakes. I will use Wilwood on my '70 convertible when the time comes.

The ordeal brought me back to years ago when we all just expected to modify nearly every performance part install. Especially if you were a Ford person. Companies have come a long way in the last 40 years. Things are so much easier now.