5.0 Aluminator Question...Insight please

[Mystickeith50]

Guys I have plans on just getting the aluminator shortly. I was always dead set on the 9.5 comp one. As of lately I have had my eye on the higher compression version. I need some insight. I know supposedly the n/a high compression model dosent come with the billet oil pump goods, but i would swap those in regaurdless. I have a 2.3 whipple, possibly upgrading to a 2.9 and will always run 93(e85 not available, and race gas is not an option.) I really dont want to lose the hp with the compression drop, and figure if i keep it up I dont have to spin the blower as fast to make the power. What are the downfalls to this as long as the tune is proper? Is anyone else doing this? Thanks in advance guys.

 

[mr. anderson]

not true, pretty sure both of the new Aluminators being produced as of now have the billet oil pump now. one of the down falls would be the higher IAT's due to the more boost required. meth would be another option with pump gas. I am going to run it as a safety and not over tune to it incase I loose the meth during a WOT run.

 

[Mystickeith50]

not true, pretty sure both of the new Aluminators being produced as of now have the billet oil pump now. one of the down falls would be the higher IAT's due to the more boost required. meth would be another option with pump gas. I am going to run it as a safety and not over tune to it incase I loose the meth during a WOT run.

Im talking downfalls to using the higher comp. I realize with the lower comp I would be upping my boost to 14-15 spinnin the crap out of the whipple and running into high iat conditions, thats why im leaning towards the higher compression version. Also interesting that both have them now as I was told by ford racing as of Feb the lower comp version only had the billets in them. Do we know for sure that both have them?

 

[mr. anderson]

http://www.s197forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=96030

8th post here. guess you could call the tech line and verify for yourself. one other thing to consider is to talk to whipple and ask what the effiecency zone of your blower is rpm wise. I know with the KB 2.8LC and with the 12-13 psi I am at now, I am well below the efficiency range and have plenty of room to grow.

 

[BruceH]

Using this simple calculator you would need 14psi at 9.5:1 to equal the boost compression of 10psi at 11:1. I have no idea if that equates to the same power output.

http://wallaceracing.com/boost-compression-ratio-calc.php

 

[konablue11gt]

I see several on here in the psi range your wanting to run on 11 to 1 on a centri with no problems at all ....

 

[Mystickeith50]

Using this simple calculator you would need 14psi at 9.5:1 to equal the boost compression of 10psi at 11:1. I have no idea if that equates to the same power output.

http://wallaceracing.com/boost-compression-ratio-calc.php

Thanks for that Bruce.

I see several on here in the psi range your wanting to run on 11 to 1 on a centri with no problems at all ....

Yeah I know. I guess what I'm getting at is if I buy this motor am I making a mistake by going for the higher compression one. Am I wrong in thinking when properly tuned the higher compression way would be a more efficient way of making power?

 

[bigriff85]

The 2.3 will be maxed at 14-15 either way ...a bigger blower can make up for the compression...I pulled the tvs off on 9.5:1 cr because of horrible bet slip and iats and only making 575 on 93 ...Paxton on now not tuned yet so well see how it does with 8 rib and more boost, with wht I've seen everyone do with their Paxton's I'm pretty confident iats shouldn't be an issue, and with the extra boost should be a shit ton of more torque...hopefully! If you're gonna keep the 2.3 I'd stay 11:1...

 

[BruceH]

If you are just looking for a push to buy the 11:1 I'll push you, lol. If I was in your shoes I'd do the 11:1. My experience with a 2.3 Whipple is that 17psi was where power gains decreased dramatically per psi. However, that was with a 4.6 and the 4.6 Whipple has a known restriction in the air inlet at the rear of the blower. I hope they fixed that for the 5.0.

You can always add meth injection pre blower if you decide to really crank the boost up. It will cool the blower down and prevent detonation.

 

[konablue11gt]

When properly tuned you would be fine at 11 to 1.. that's the key

 

[r.barn]

The down side really is you have very little or zero room for error in the combustion process. The 11:1 will make more power, but be MUCH more prone to detonation if anything gets out of whack. It comes down to how much risk do you want to take. Detonation will destroy even a "built" motor.

I ordered the 9.5 aluminator just so I know I can beat on it in the heat of summer with zero worries of blowing a hole. You lose power but gain a MUCH greater safety margin.

Dynamic compression is really the key. Static compression only means so much. If the tuner is good he can reduce dynamic compression some by tweaking the cam advance in the vtec system.

Try playing with the dynamic compression ratio calculator
http://www.wallaceracing.com/dynamic-cr.php

 

[BruceH]

As long as the knock sensors aren't disabled and the boost and timing is reasonable you won't have any issues at 11:1. How many stock boosted 5.0s are out there making power on pump gas with no issues?

I've ran my 4.6 at 11:1 boosted with a Paxton at 10-12psi and never had a problem. My current set up is a D1 and the motor is at 10.76:1. I've ran it as high as 12psi with pump gas, gone lean during the tuning process and still not had issues. That motor/blower combo is now at 19psi on e85 no issues but the timing is kept reasonable at 21 degrees.

Sorry I can't give you direct 5.0 experience with 11:1 but hopefully my 4.6 experience will help. I can't emphasize it enough though, keep the knock sensors turned on at factory sensitivity and don't go crazy with the timing or boost. If you reach a power limit it's easily remedied with meth injection but at that point you are relying on the meth to keep the motor alive.

How much boost are the boosted 5.0 guys getting away with on the stock block?

 

[Mystickeith50]

Depends...I've been at ten no problem. There are guys running 14.... but who knows for how long.

 

[BruceH]

Depends...I've been at ten no problem. There are guys running 14.... but who knows for how long.

Do the motors die of detonation? Do the rods snap?

 

[Mystickeith50]

It all depends on the tune and how its tuned I guess Bruce. I mean Chris Cruz was run high nines at 15lbs I think and all he broke was the oil pump gears, but I have also seen busted piston and such with much less boost but who knows whether knock sensors were fucked with or who tooned it .

 

[GrabberBlue5.0]

Cylinder walls crack under lots of boost also. The supposed limit for the cylinder walls is ~725-750 hp

 

[mr. anderson]

I've been running 12-13 pounds of boost for about a year now, both first on the procharger and now on the KB.

 

[Mystickeith50]

I've been running 12-13 pounds of boost for about a year now, both first on the procharger and now on the KB.

Still stock bottom right?

 

[mr. anderson]

yup. gonna run it till it pops.